What does Pittsburgh lack? (Greensburg, Washington: mortgages, theatre, school)

[okaydorothy]

Originally Posted by eschaton

The fact of the matter is, even if job opportunities are there, immigrants are just more likely to move places where there's an existing community of countrymen to socialize with.

I mean, put yourself in their shoes. Consider if you had to leave the U.S. and take a job opportunity in China. In one area, you and your family would be some of the only people of American descent, but you would make a bit more money. In another you wouldn't make quite as much, but 10% of the population in your immediate neighborhood would be foreign expats you could socialize with. Some people might pick the first, but many (most) would pick the second one.

And the locals in these other cities are more accepting of outsiders. When I immigrated here first, I moved to Long Island, NY. Not to one of the irish areas of the Bronx or Queens where most irish expats were in the '80's. Many of our friends that we had there are still good friends to this day. Some are american, some are european. I notice here in Pittsburgh, the first question is where did you go to school. Yes, the people are looking for a common ground or interest. But when I say Ireland, they don't know what to say. I understand both sides because it is how my family are in Ireland.

[xdv8]

Originally Posted by okaydorothy

And the locals in these other cities are more accepting of outsiders. When I immigrated here first, I moved to Long Island, NY. Not to one of the irish areas of the Bronx or Queens where most irish expats were in the '80's. Many of our friends that we had there are still good friends to this day. Some are american, some are european. I notice here in Pittsburgh, the first question is where did you go to school. Yes, the people are looking for a common ground or interest. But when I say Ireland, they don't know what to say. I understand both sides because it is how my family are in Ireland.

Not all areas of the metro are created equal with regards to attitudes towards new transplants. Your experience is very different from mine. I'm not arguing that Pittsburgh isn't insular, but you don't even live in the city and it's not going to surprise anyone that suburbs aren't as welcoming to outsiders.

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by xdv8

Not all areas of the metro are created equal with regards to attitudes towards new transplants. Your experience is very different from mine. I'm not arguing that Pittsburgh isn't insular, but you don't even live in the city and it's not going to surprise anyone that suburbs aren't as welcoming to outsiders.

That statement actually would surprise me because it isn't true. Generalizations weaken your argument and don't do anyone justice. You rail against the trolls but your statements are just as close minded.

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by gladhands

This simply isn't true, as evidenced by the fact that only high-end housing is growing. There is money to be earned, but it requires skills and education, not "hard work".

"high end" everything is growing. this is a function of the dying middle class and isn't specific to pittsburgh. plus high end housing is more profitable.

[erieguy]

Originally Posted by Paul2421

That statement actually would surprise me because it isn't true. Generalizations weaken your argument and don't do anyone justice. You rail against the trolls but your statements are just as close minded.

Exactly, especially when it's obvious that many never leave the city to know otherwise.

[gladhands]

Originally Posted by Paul2421

"high end" everything is growing. this is a function of the dying middle class and isn't specific to pittsburgh. plus high end housing is more profitable.

What evidence do you have that Pittsburgh's middle-class is dying? I think that Pittsburghers got so used to the city's Rust Belt decay that they lost sight of what the middle class really is. You should not, in the 21st century, expect homes to cost 50k. Pittsburgh still has plenty of low-crime neighborhoods where single-family homes can be purchased for HALF of the national median home price. Two people working at Aldi can buy this house:

https://www.redfin.com/PA/Pittsburgh.../home/73550546

[wanderlust76]

Originally Posted by gladhands

What evidence do you have that Pittsburgh's middle-class is dying? I think that Pittsburghers got so used to the city's Rust Belt decay that they lost sight of what the middle class really is. You should not, in the 21st century, expect homes to cost 50k. Pittsburgh still has plenty of low-crime neighborhoods where single-family homes can be purchased for HALF of the national median home price. Two people working at Aldi can buy this house:

https://www.redfin.com/PA/Pittsburgh.../home/73550546

The cost of living is getting ridiculous in a number of cities so yeah Pittsburgh is probably in an ok place. The wages are still stagnant but you can at least find a STEM job pretty easy really.

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by gladhands

What evidence do you have that Pittsburgh's middle-class is dying? I think that Pittsburghers got so used to the city's Rust Belt decay that they lost sight of what the middle class really is. You should not, in the 21st century, expect homes to cost 50k. Pittsburgh still has plenty of low-crime neighborhoods where single-family homes can be purchased for HALF of the national median home price. Two people working at Aldi can buy this house:

https://www.redfin.com/PA/Pittsburgh.../home/73550546

I'm not talking about Pittsburgh just in the US in general. It is pretty well documented that the middle class is shrinking. I know it is anecdotal but the narrative is that back in the day a single manual labor income could support a house.

I actually agree that pittburgh is more affordable than most to buy a house. Young people these days are part of the bragging generation and see things on social media that aren't obtainable to most.

It seems like you are part of the well compensated group but it would be beneficial to see things from other's point of view.

I was mostly saying that in response to your point that high end housing growing means that there is income to be gained by everyday Pittsburghers. I agree with this to a point but it seems like a large number of these jobs are software development and new skills that many people don't have in this area. Because of this, people will move in from out of the area and take those jobs so yes there is income to be gained, but this doesn't directly help natives from their point of view.

Many are happy that google and apple and uber are here, me being one of them, but it seems like some are to the point of questioning if it is hurting the everyday citizen, as evidenced by many community groups.

[wpipkins2]

Originally Posted by gladhands

What evidence do you have that Pittsburgh's middle-class is dying? I think that Pittsburghers got so used to the city's Rust Belt decay that they lost sight of what the middle class really is. You should not, in the 21st century, expect homes to cost 50k. Pittsburgh still has plenty of low-crime neighborhoods where single-family homes can be purchased for HALF of the national median home price. Two people working at Aldi can buy this house:

https://www.redfin.com/PA/Pittsburgh.../home/73550546

I really like that house with the exception of the bathroom.

[okaydorothy]

Originally Posted by Arnold Slick

Dorothy, as a native Pittsburgher I will acknowledge that we are often insular and seek that common ground, which for us is so commonly "so where exactly are you from" because often enough it does provide an easy start to a conversation.

But at least among my friends and I, meeting someone who said they are from Ireland would be super interesting and we would probably annoy you with questions and make you feel weird for being from somewhere so far away. We would also expect that you know exactly who Dan Rooney is and likely use that as our conversation icebreaker.

Go to Meetups, hang out in different places with different crowds that are likely to be more outgoing and open-minded (a quirky coffee shop or a craft brewery or a MeetUp group for example). Maybe you've tried changing it up and you've reached the same conclusion. If so I apologize on behalf of all of us that exhibit that behavior, many times unconsciously.

We are genuinely curious and we will invite you into our groups if you share the same interests and are easy going. I speak for my millennial demographic and I realize it will be harder for you, but there are like-minded people in your demographic too they are just harder to find in this city. Don't be "above" using online dating services or even Craigslist to solicit friendship. You will sift through plenty of perverts and spam and waste a fair share of your time but there are diamonds in the rough in those places as well and people who turn to the internet to meet people. Several years ago I used these services looking for love and while I did not find exactly what I was looking for, I met some good people, some of whom I still keep in touch with via Facebook. Advertising yourself as a woman of a certain age looking for companionship and nothing serious; someone to spend some social evenings with in places with a lot of people where other potential social interactions may flourish. It's easy to stereotype our city, we deserve it in this case and many others, but if you are open-minded and persistent I think you can find what you are looking for.

I am not looking for a partner ; have been married for a very long time. I am talking about parents of kids that are in the school with our kids, neighbors who live across the street etc. I am also talking about the fact that most people have their extended families living here and spend a lot of time with them, so it is harder to have a social life or make the effort to get to know outsiders in a social setting.