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I think the city problems have filtered out to the suburbs.
I miss the city and county of the late 90s and early 2000s. Things were pretty stable with crime. It was all in Homewood, Central Northside, Fairywood, St. Clair Village, Mckees rocks Terrace, Wilkinsburg, Rankin and Braddock. Most of the eastern suburbs were still pretty desirable, west Mifflin was still decent, never had to go through metal detectors or worry about crime at kennywood. Penn hills was still a good suburb and safe. Monroeville was also much safer. Sto-Rox used to have a fire fighters parade, one of the largest in the country and a fair on the football field. Now shootings near the high school. You never heard of shootings in places like Kennedy township. Even places like Sheridan, Carrick, Marshall Shadeland used to be good working class neighborhoods. I’m sorry I just don’t think the county and city are better with crime. :It’s widespread now and make some once livable neighborhoods and suburbs undesirable. I think it was a more livable city and county back then, before crime filtered out to everywhere.
Pittsburgh is a small enough city where one can track literally all of the changes. Blacks have been displaced in the following:
Northside: Allegheny Dwellings at Sandusky Court (soon to be the rest of the complex), California-Kirkbride, Central Northside, Manchester and Northview Heights Estates two high-rises on Mt. Pleasant Avenue/low-rise units on Chicago Street/Penfort Street. Relocating members of four Crip gangs and one rival OGz/Gz gang.
South: 3200 Arlington Heights and St. Clair Village. Beltzhoover has also had an exodus of Black residents. Relocating members of three Crip gangs.
Central: Hill District’s Addison Terrace [now called Skyline Terrace] / Allequippa Terrace [now called Oak Hill and the Peterson Sports Complex] (Terrace Village), Bedford Dwellings (Francis Street/Whiteside Road now called Bedford Hills at Memory Lane) and the original Crawford Square area and Reed Roberts Manor (Crawford-Roberts); South Oakland — near Frazier Street; West Oakland — near Pitt/Carlow. Even the Strip District from 27th to 32nd Street, but nobody would ever know that now. Relocating members of seven Blood gangs and one Crip gang.
East: Bloomfield/Friendship near Garfield, throughout Lawrenceville, 5800 Pierce Street in “East Shadyside”, Point Breeze North and southernmost Highland Park/Morningside. East Liberty’s East Liberty Gardens/ Omega Place (now Cornerstone Village), East Mall High-Rise (now East Liberty Place South), Liberty Park High-Rise/6300-6500 Centre Ave Apts (now Fairfield), the original New Pennley Place/New Pennley Park/Penn Manor Apts, Penn Circle East High-Rise (now Target), Penn Plaza and most of the neighborhood outside these complexes. Garfield (formerly Garfield Heights now Garfield Commons and south of Rosetta St). Larimer (Lower Larimer — south of Meadow Street that's off Larimer Avenue i.e., the Auburn Towers and 6200 Hamilton-Larimer Auburn Street Apts). Even Homewood South (7300 Fleury Way, 7300-7500 Formosa Way, 7600 Tioga St, 600 Collier Street, etc.), the East Hills (2200 Bracey Drive and the original East Hills Apt units) and Wilkinsburg, PA (Kelly West/Pebbles Square neighborhoods west of the busway and Hammett Place/Sperling neighborhoods near Edgewood). Recently Valmar Gardens in Penn Hills, PA as well. Relocating members of two Blood gangs, three [LAW] Hoodz gangs and two Crip gangs.
West: Broadhead Manor and Westgate Village. Relocating members of one Blood gang, one Crip gang and two Westside Convictz gangs.
Southeastern city limits: historically Glen Hazel Heights (Cove Place, Naomi Drive & Rivermont Drive especially) and more recently Hazelwood. Relocating members of Hazelwood’s Crips (Glen Hazel Heights was redeveloped/partially demolished before Crips/Bloods/current gangs were in the city).
Even Allegheny County’s portion of the Mon Valley: First Talbot Towers of Braddock, PA (besides Homestead, PA south of the tracks). Then eventually: Cochrandale in Duquesne, PA; Blair Heights in Clairton, PA and Burns Heights in Duquesne, PA (now called Orchard Park). Along with McKees Rocks Terrace, now called Meyers Ridge. Relocating members of five local public housing gangs. Crawford Square units of E.R. Crawford Village (known as “The Circle”) in McKeesport were demolished and remolded, pushing some 105 Crawford Village Crips gang members outside of the complex as well.
Pittsburgh is a small enough city where one can track literally all of the changes. Blacks have been displaced in the following...
All together, that’s several thousand residents over three decades. However, it’s also the relocation of members of 13 Crip gangs, 9 Blood gangs and 11 other local gangs. Where they’ve been relocating to can also be traced.
The Northside Crips relocated to Allegheny Commons East Apts (Allegheny Center) and Marshall-Shadeland’s Woods Run. The Manchester Original Gangsters, relocated to Marshall-Shadeland (excluding Woods Run). Meanwhile, the Three Rivers Manor Apts (Spring Hill-City View) now has a variety of relocated groups from throughout the city — making it so increasingly violent. Relocated Allequippa Terrace/Crawford Roberts gang members have also relocated to the two areas. Yet both the rival Northside Crips and OGz/Gz have also relocated scattered throughout Brighton Heights/Perry North and the West End/Stowe Rocks communities.
Southern Hilltop: St. Clair Village Darccide Crips gang members relocated to most of Knoxville (besides the 200-400 blocks of Charles St/Jucunda St/Orchard Pl/Zara St, 300-400 Rochelle Street, Moore Avenue/Marland Street) and most of Mt. Oliver Borough. With smaller groups getting vouchers in what’s left of Arlington Heights and scattered throughout Carrick. 3200 Arlington [Heights] Purple Crips gang members moved to 3000-3100 Arlington Heights, part of Arlington/adjacent South Side Slopes streets and scattered in/outside the Southern Hilltop. Meanwhile, Beltzhoover has just depopulated and consequently become less gang violent. Yet the Zhoove Crips relocated to and overrun most of Allentown (excluding most of the E Warrington Ave businesses district and east of Arlington Ave), part of Upper Knoxville (the 200-400 blocks of Charles St/Jucunda St/Orchard Pl/Zara St, 300-400 Rochelle Street) and formerly southeast Mt. Washington (south of Eureka St from Haberman to Beltzhoover Ave) as they are now being relocated out of the latter area. Some scattered in Beechview and outside the Hilltop though. These other Southern Hilltop areas do however have formerly displaced residents from other sides of town (especially Carrick).
McKees Rocks Terrace moved back to Meyers Ridge, some in Pleasant Ridge and outside both complexes still within Stowe Rocks. Ohioview Acres moved back into Pleasant Ridge, but also to Groveton Village in Coraopolis, PA and Mooncrest in Moon Township, PA. Like the Northside gangs, rival Hill District factions have also moved to Stowe Rocks communities adding to violence of those areas.
Fairywood was different because they had three major gang divisions the Bloods, Crips and Westside Convictz. Broadhead Convictz / Westgate Village “VGz” Convictz eventually relocated to and overran the Greenway Park Apts (now Mountain-View Apts) and adjacent Crafton Heights Townhomes, parts of Sheraden, part of Elliott and temporarily to Northview Heights Estates and Brett Manor (during the flood of Hurricane Ivan weather). The Crips moved to public housing in McKees Rocks (Hays Manor/Uansa Village) and the ones with drug money to Chartiers City, northern Windgap and the nicer part of Sheraden. The 3500-3600 DownBottom Fairywood Street Bloods relocated mostly to and assimilated within scattered areas such as the Hill District’s Addison Terrace Projects at Elmore Square, causing only them to be defunct. Leaving just a few Crip/Westside Convictz members on 500-400 Fairywood Street and 500-400 West Prospect Ave for the greater part of the millenium–present. Broadhead Manor has returned to nature and Westgate Village is now Emerald Gardens (little do the people know they’re paying for renovated formerly section 8, Western PA crack-epidemic ground zero).
However, the 20 remaining gangs that have been affected by displacement of their original ghettos of the Central-Eastern parts of the city and Mon Valley public housing complexes have either relocated elsewhere within their neighborhoods or scattered completely. At the same time areas such as Braddock, Homewood North, Lincoln-Lemington, Middle Hill, various Mon Valley city areas, etc., lost Black residents (including gangsters) due to continued decline. Many different gang members relocated to the following areas: Brinton Manor (Braddock Hills), East Pittsburgh, Munhall, various North Versailles apartment complexes, Penn Hills, Pitcairn, Swissvale, Turtle Creek, West Mifflin, Wilmerding and 1st Ward of North Braddock. Making these areas a mixed stew of former city/Mon Valley hoods, as like was said earlier they were formerly gang free. In summary East moved Eastward.
Clairton, Duquesne and McKeesport are not only far out and but also have colloquial stigma nicknames such as “Cut Throat City”, “Dukie City” and “Disease-port”. So the many families and elderly residents with few other choices had to relocate there. Same said for Homestead, North Braddock’s 2nd-3rd Wards, Rankin (excluding Hawkins Village), parts of Wilkinsburg and even Tarentum & New Kensington/Arnold. Illustrating the increasingly dire affordable housing crisis for Blacks especially in the city.
All together, that’s several thousand residents over three decades. However, it’s also the relocation of members of 13 Crip gangs, 9 Blood gangs and 11 other local gangs. Where they’ve been relocating to can also be traced.
The Northside Crips relocated to Allegheny Commons East Apts (Allegheny Center) and Marshall-Shadeland’s Woods Run. The Manchester Original Gangsters, relocated to Marshall-Shadeland (excluding Woods Run). Meanwhile, the Three Rivers Manor Apts (Spring Hill-City View) now has a variety of relocated groups from throughout the city — making it so increasingly violent. Relocated Allequippa Terrace/Crawford Roberts gang members have also relocated to the two areas. Yet both the rival Northside Crips and OGz/Gz have also relocated scattered throughout Brighton Heights/Perry North and the West End/Stowe Rocks communities.
Southern Hilltop: St. Clair Village Darccide Crips gang members relocated to most of Knoxville (besides the 200-400 blocks of Charles St/Jucunda St/Orchard Pl/Zara St, 300-400 Rochelle Street, Moore Avenue/Marland Street) and most of Mt. Oliver Borough. With smaller groups getting vouchers in what’s left of Arlington Heights and scattered throughout Carrick. 3200 Arlington [Heights] Purple Crips gang members moved to 3000-3100 Arlington Heights, part of Arlington/adjacent South Side Slopes streets and scattered in/outside the Southern Hilltop. Meanwhile, Beltzhoover has just depopulated and consequently become less gang violent. Yet the Zhoove Crips relocated to and overrun most of Allentown (excluding most of the E Warrington Ave businesses district and east of Arlington Ave), part of Upper Knoxville (the 200-400 blocks of Charles St/Jucunda St/Orchard Pl/Zara St, 300-400 Rochelle Street) and formerly southeast Mt. Washington (south of Eureka St from Haberman to Beltzhoover Ave) as they are now being relocated out of the latter area. Some scattered in Beechview and outside the Hilltop though. These other Southern Hilltop areas do however have formerly displaced residents from other sides of town (especially Carrick).
McKees Rocks Terrace moved back to Meyers Ridge, some in Pleasant Ridge and outside both complexes still within Stowe Rocks. Ohioview Acres moved back into Pleasant Ridge, but also to Groveton Village in Coraopolis, PA and Mooncrest in Moon Township, PA. Like the Northside gangs, rival Hill District factions have also moved to Stowe Rocks communities adding to violence of those areas.
Fairywood was different because they had three major gang divisions the Bloods, Crips and Westside Convictz. Broadhead Convictz / Westgate Village “VGz” Convictz eventually relocated to and overran the Greenway Park Apts (now Mountain-View Apts) and adjacent Crafton Heights Townhomes, parts of Sheraden, part of Elliott and temporarily to Northview Heights Estates and Brett Manor (during the flood of Hurricane Ivan weather). The Crips moved to public housing in McKees Rocks (Hays Manor/Uansa Village) and the ones with drug money to Chartiers City, northern Windgap and the nicer part of Sheraden. The 3500-3600 DownBottom Fairywood Street Bloods relocated mostly to and assimilated within scattered areas such as the Hill District’s Addison Terrace Projects at Elmore Square, causing only them to be defunct. Leaving just a few Crip/Westside Convictz members on 500-400 Fairywood Street and 500-400 West Prospect Ave for the greater part of the millenium–present. Broadhead Manor has returned to nature and Westgate Village is now Emerald Gardens (little do the people know they’re paying for renovated formerly section 8, Western PA crack-epidemic ground zero).
However, the 20 remaining gangs that have been affected by displacement of their original ghettos of the Central-Eastern parts of the city and Mon Valley public housing complexes have either relocated elsewhere within their neighborhoods or scattered completely. At the same time areas such as Braddock, Homewood North, Lincoln-Lemington, Middle Hill, various Mon Valley city areas, etc., lost Black residents (including gangsters) due to continued decline. Many different gang members relocated to the following areas: Brinton Manor (Braddock Hills), East Pittsburgh, Munhall, various North Versailles apartment complexes, Penn Hills, Pitcairn, Swissvale, Turtle Creek, West Mifflin, Wilmerding and 1st Ward of North Braddock. Making these areas a mixed stew of former city/Mon Valley hoods, as like was said earlier they were formerly gang free. In summary East moved Eastward.
Clairton, Duquesne and McKeesport are not only far out and but also have colloquial stigma nicknames such as “Cut Throat City”, “Dukie City” and “Disease-port”. So the many families and elderly residents with few other choices had to relocate there. Same said for Homestead, North Braddock’s 2nd-3rd Wards, Rankin (excluding Hawkins Village), parts of Wilkinsburg and even Tarentum & New Kensington/Arnold. Illustrating the increasingly dire affordable housing crisis for Blacks especially in the city.
Fairywood was the worst and probably the most violent city in the neighborhood until the very early 2000s. Westgate village and broadhead manor were huge housing projects. Probably around 1,000 or more units combined at one time. westside elementary school, now demolished, looked like a bomb shelter. There used to to be a community store across the street and right across from Westgate, now emerald gardens, is the remnants of a strip shopping mall that once had a giant eagle and hills department store. It looks like now one part of the strip is used for storage and the other is u haul or something. For a period not 20-25 years the drug dealing and violence there was incredible. Making it worse you had one road in and one road out, broadhead fording road. And yes it was ground zero for the crack dealing. There was probably more cash flowing out of those projects than local banks and businesses in the city. I remember in the early 90s when Sophie was mayor the Jamaicans from NYC came in and tried to take over the neighborhood because the drug business was lucrative there due to its location between NY and Chicago with access to Detroit and Cleveland. The national guard almost came in to gain control. People were afraid to stand at the bus stops worried about getting hit by stray bullets. If you go on YouTube and search for Westgate village there is about a half hour home made documentary about a gang member that lived down there. He walks through the new emerald gardens and said. These people are paying top rent and have no idea that this is a modern day graveyard for gangbangers that were here 15 years ago.
But you are right. The problem didn’t go away it just was spread out. Crime was concentrated until the early 2000s when public housing went away and neighborhood integration was the new thing. All it did was push groups of these folks to depressed municipalities outside of the city and middle class neighborhoods where there were no more buyers due to a poor economy and no job growth. A lot of the places you mentioned used to be OK until the early 2000s. I remember Sto rox used to have a parade and carnival on their football field. That ended about 2003.
African Americans are automatically disadvantaged being born in Pittsburgh. I saw it with my own eyes. I was one of the few to make it out.
African Americans are automatically disadvantaged being born in Pittsburgh. I saw it with my own eyes. I was one of the few to make it out.
Might be true, but a lot of that fault lies within their communities and playing "the victim". It isn't like there isn't opportunity in our area as there are a TON of very successful people of all races, it is being a product of an environment of defeated people. How to you break that mold? No idea, but throwing money at things is pretty much a waste of time. It is all about parenting and maybe offer classes on it in these communities? Nothing else seems to work and certainly all these public housing places will never build self-esteem, nor will they help long term. They just create defeated people who will rely on a system and their kids will also rely on a system funded by the hard working and tax dollars. If you continually are in need of help, you will never have any pride. Just feel owed for some odd reason. No one is "owed" in our country. We have it very good if you open your eyes and block out the garbage people spew.
Might be true, but a lot of that fault lies within their communities and playing "the victim". It isn't like there isn't opportunity in our area as there are a TON of very successful people of all races, it is being a product of an environment of defeated people. How to you break that mold? No idea, but throwing money at things is pretty much a waste of time. It is all about parenting and maybe offer classes on it in these communities? Nothing else seems to work and certainly all these public housing places will never build self-esteem, nor will they help long term. They just create defeated people who will rely on a system and their kids will also rely on a system funded by the hard working and tax dollars. If you continually are in need of help, you will never have any pride. Just feel owed for some odd reason. No one is "owed" in our country. We have it very good if you open your eyes and block out the garbage people spew.
@ YAC - you might as well just this down now. This thread of discussion on a declining Internet blog had already reached its peak. This conversation is going from a unique insight on local racialized housing trends and how it relates to locations of violence, but is likely heading to individual aversive racist ideologies, nuanced bigotry and borderline violations of UNESCO/United Nation Mandate Article II Section I.
h_curtis / gg man you just had to spoil it didn’t you. I have no problem admitting that there are major fault lines within the community, specifically the plight of the so called “African American” community. There are certain mentalities that are stronger and weaker than others that play into individual/ collective community success and failure.
However, what your saying does not account for 401-413 years of active oppression by Institutional, Structural and Systemic Racism and White Supremacy towards Melanted Turtle Island Aboriginals, Moors, Hebrews and Afrakan prisoners of war and their descendants. I have somewhere I have to be soon and am not going to waste my time arguing — in an argument I know I could win, as it is based on citing racist policies/double standards in this nation that have been around since it’s/before its (manifest destiny) “inception”.
African Americans are automatically disadvantaged being born in Pittsburgh. I saw it with my own eyes. I was one of the few to make it out.
I'm from the South and lived in Pittsburgh for a good while. I was absolutely floored with not only the open racism I saw on display while living there. People are not passive aggressive about it like they can be in the South, they are open with dropping slurs outright and calling groups out without hesitation. There is also the direct "shut your mouth" response when people call it just like we see in this thread.
But what really blew my mind is that there is no black middle class whatsoever in Pittsburgh. If you are black you are poor, and deviations from that were EXTREMELY rare. I'm back again where I grew up (Raleigh) and there is a healthy black middle class here. White people and black people interact freely without hills and rivers separating their neighborhoods. When you interact with people different from you all the time it no longer becomes a point of contention, imagine that. I will back up what this poster says, if you can make it out of Pittsburgh as an African American there are much much better places you can live in the US.
Sorry, I usually just lurk but I saw some of the recent posts in this thread and it brought me back to those same racist attitudes I remembered when living in Pittsburgh.
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