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Old 05-03-2008, 02:21 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles Area
3,306 posts, read 4,133,707 times
Reputation: 592

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Quote:
I don't think rudeness is endemic to one geographical area. Gee, if some rude people move from Boston to Pgh, do you include them in your survey?
The problem is rudeness is not a physical property, its a cultural property. Seeing as cultures differ so does the notion of rudeness, this also includes the cultural differences seen in different regions of the US. People that were raised in Pittsburgh are unlikely to think the area is particularly rude. I on the other hand was not raised in the area, rather approximately 2,600 miles away. In my original post I stated that my view may be due to culturally differences. I was interested in hearing insight into what those differences may be, of course Pittsburgh fan-boys took it differently. Anyhow, so to an outsider rudeness (as they know it) can be endemic to a particular geographical region.

Although, I do believe customer service in Pittsburgh is worse than other areas in a way that can be objectively measured. But locals may be perfectly satisfied with such levels of customer service, I have no idea.
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Old 05-03-2008, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,219,944 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTH View Post
With respect to this forum, I don't think there is any excuse for people being uncivil just because they disagree. On the other hand, I think it is important to note that if you behave in an uncivil manner yourself, you will likely get uncivil responses. In fact, I think there are sometimes people who basically come here looking for a fight.

Finally, I don't want to single out londonbarcelona, but it doesn't help to improve the tone of the discourse here to blame the "whole forum" for particular incidents, or to describe the forum as a "bunch of childish whiners", or to compare the whole form unfavorably to other forums, or so on. Rather, my suggestion would be for everyone to deal with each other as individuals, and not try to lump the people posting here together.
I have spent a lot of time thinking about this whole issue, not just of rudeness in Pittsburgh, but rudeness on this forum, which has also been addressed here, including in Brian's post that I have quoted here. I too, think there is no excuse for being incivil, which I have seen much more on this forum than on the others I frequent. I have posted several times that on Colorado, we seem to get along much better, even though we do not all agree all the time. We have a "sky is falling" person, we have liberals, conservatives, snow-boarders, engineers, you name it. Yes, we have people using sarcasm at times, and posts get deleted occasionally for rudeness, etc. The Pittsburgh forum is noted for people who cannot tolerate "constructive criticism" about lots of things. Many people have noted so. I know of no other forum on CD where people are constantly questioned about why they are even posting here. Colorado has several Californians that want to move there who post frequently, plus a couple from Wyoming, people who have lived there in the past, people whose relatives live there but they never did, etc. People don't come on and say "I don't know why you're here", or "you must get some psychological enjoyment from coming here when you haven't lived here for years . . . ". In fact, there is far less psycholanalysis in general. People don't make snide references "between the lines" telling others to leave, on any other forum I visit frequently. That includes Illinois, Indiana, Minnesota, Nebraska and some others.

I agree we should treat each other as individuals, but when a large number of people start going gangland, as londonbarcelona called it (I like that!), it seems like the whole forum is doing it. We went through that awful period last fall/winter with that troll who angered a lot of people, but he had his sympathizers who would bash others along with him. He sent nasty DMs, gave reps with nasty messages, etc. Yet still a lot of people supported him. It was awful. I think those of us who were his targets, and we were very carefully chosen, will not forget that soon and were left with a bad taste in our mouths. There will be some who say "why come over to Pittsburgh then?". Well, I'm from there and I enjoy talking about it. I don't understand why a few people should feel like they should be able to chase everyone they don't like away.

Last edited by Katarina Witt; 05-03-2008 at 05:11 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 05-03-2008, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Saint Petersburg
632 posts, read 1,734,001 times
Reputation: 319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I People don't come on and say "I don't know why you're here", or "you must get some psychological enjoyment from coming here when you haven't lived here for years . . . ". In fact, there is far less psycholanalysis in general.
LOL! I'm sorry you're still hung up on this topic. I didn't realize it would consume you this long. I was actually really surprised to see this comment today.

Nevertheless, I still stand behind what I've said to you in the past about your motivations for the behavior you often display here.

However, you needn't blame Pittsburgh or other Pittsburghers or even other forumites for the crimes that I have apparently committed against you. If you have an issue with me, then please feel free to call me out. But don't tar them with the hate-on you have for me personally. That's not fair to them or the beautiful city we live in.

Last edited by subdivisions; 05-03-2008 at 05:41 PM..
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Old 05-03-2008, 05:52 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,219,944 times
Reputation: 35920
I did not mention you by name, subdivisions, and I supported londonbarcelona's comment that people go gangland on a person who says anything less than 100% positive about Pittsburgh, meaning, people gang up on such a person. You are not the only one who has questioned why someone is posting here, since they don't live in Pittsburgh, and not just me. So don't take it so personally.

I am irritated at your constant attempts to analyze me. If I feel the need, I will seek out some qualified help.

Maybe you could look up Beaver Falls on a map. You could also do a search for all this "horrible" stuff I have said about it. I recall saying it's sad that it's become a shadow of its former self.

Last edited by Katarina Witt; 05-03-2008 at 06:09 PM.. Reason: change a word
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Old 05-03-2008, 06:09 PM
 
Location: Saint Petersburg
632 posts, read 1,734,001 times
Reputation: 319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I did not mention you by name, subdivisions, and I supported londonbarcelona's comment that people go gangland on a person who says anything less than 100% positive about Pittsburgh, meaning, people gang up on such a person. You are not the only one who has questioned why someone is posting here, since they don't live in Pittsburgh, and not just me. So don't take it so personally.
Ok, fair enough.
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Old 05-03-2008, 08:20 PM
 
20,273 posts, read 32,877,652 times
Reputation: 2910
Again, I don't really see much value in generalizing from a particular set of incidents involving certain individuals to the forum as a whole.
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Old 05-03-2008, 08:41 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,219,944 times
Reputation: 35920
^^^Well, you weren't posting much when this was going on with the troll. It was awful. There is no other word for it. Most of the worst of the stuff has been deleted, though some remains. I would suggest you go back and look at some of the old stuff if you think this did not affect the forum as a whole.
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Old 05-03-2008, 09:44 PM
 
20,273 posts, read 32,877,652 times
Reputation: 2910
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
^^^Well, you weren't posting much when this was going on with the troll. It was awful. There is no other word for it. Most of the worst of the stuff has been deleted, though some remains. I would suggest you go back and look at some of the old stuff if you think this did not affect the forum as a whole.
Well, that is part of my point. I was indeed not a regular here at the time, but I am now. So not to make this personal, but why should whatever happened at that time be attributed to me? And yet that is exactly what people are doing when they talk about the whole forum being characterizable by those incidents, since I am now part of the whole forum.

Again, to be perfectly clear, I am not making excuses for anyone's behavior. I also don't take this personally. Rather, I am just pointing out that it doesn't help to improve the tone around here, or otherwise to move the conversations here in more productive directions, when people do things like attribute those incidents to the entire forum, as opposed to attributing them to the actual individuals involved.
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Old 05-03-2008, 10:35 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,219,944 times
Reputation: 35920
It was pretty much a forum-wide thing back then. And it was awful. Yes, at some point we should all get over it. But it was a turning point for some people who up till then were very positive about Pittsburgh. londonbarcelona is correct. People on this forum do gang up on people who say something remotely negative about Pittsburgh. Not all of them, but enough to make it feel that way. This has been noted over and over again by many different posters, before and after the troll mess.
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Old 05-03-2008, 11:08 PM
 
20,273 posts, read 32,877,652 times
Reputation: 2910
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
It was pretty much a forum-wide thing back then. And it was awful. Yes, at some point we should all get over it. But it was a turning point for some people who up till then were very positive about Pittsburgh. londonbarcelona is correct.
I don't have a basis to comment on what was going on in the forum at that time. All I can say is that whatever was going on then, it would be inaccurate to claim the "whole forum" is behaving in such a fashion now.

Quote:
People on this forum do gang up on people who say something remotely negative about Pittsburgh. Not all of them, but enough to make it feel that way. This has been noted over and over again by many different posters, before and after the troll mess.
Again, I am not unsympathetic to people who feel that way, but I do think they are making matters worse by generalizing from individuals to the whole forum, because that needlessly antagonizes those individuals who are not participating in the relevant incidents.

Anyway, I really was just trying to make a helpful suggestion to those who would like to see a positive tone and productive discussions on this forum. People are, of course, free to ignore that suggestion.
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