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Yes, I agree, that sounds more like it. Acutally, I think MY kids' high school is 7th in the country. Just kidding! I don't even know where it ranks in Colorado.
btw I understand now what your point was... im sorry. LOL. I'm brain dead tonight. And no I don't know the ratio of the advanced degrees for the teachers.
BUT... getting advanced degrees during nights and weekends is no easy task and is extremely time consuming. You have to have a ton of dedication and I honestly doubt a majority of teachers do it for the extra money they would be acquiring years down the road after completion.
Furthermore, if you have advanced masters and doctorates in the majors that you mentioned..... these people aren't teachers, I’m so sorry you think they are. They are college and higher education professors, scientists, novelists, and researchers where they can actually garner the respect and financial payback to warrant the degree. Don't get me wrong, I know some of these wonderful teachers do exists with these degrees, but let's be realistic.
What exactly are these teachers getting PhDs in if not history, english, math, and arts?
Education. Having a high percentage of teachers with "advanced degrees" means little if the vast majority of these degrees are in education, rather than in substantive academic disciplines.
Teachers who DO have advanced degrees in real disciplines usually teach in private schools.
I know that this thread has moved kind of far away from your original questions, but here goes
I'm born and raised in So Cal, and am moving to Mt Lebanon this summer. Lots of reasons! So,not having moved yet, I can't really share a personal reaction except that we have spent about a month there in our research and loved it! I did want to share, however, that I have a freind who relocated there a few years ago for a job (Fox Chappel) and she really loves it except the winter. She says that that has been much harder for her than she thought it would be, but that otherwise she is very very happy. She loves how family oriented everything is, the good schools and the easy commutes. Hope that helps!
Like you, I am really really curious about what the "California Attitude" is though LOL!
I'm an LA-er who was born in Pgh and Pgh is GREAT for families
Hi Potential Pittsburgher,
I have lived in LA for 15 years and was born and raised in Pittsburgh. I lived in Crafton and Mt. Lebanon, 2 of the places you mentioned possibly moving to.
I was in a long distance relationship with someone in Pgh for 3 years and almost moved back to get married and raise a family in Pgh, so I've considered a lot of the same things you're probably considering, so I'll share my experience, in case it's helpful. The relationship didn't work out, but the prospect of moving back to Pgh wasn't the main reason, of course.
This is only my opinion, and you must take my background into account. For me, it is a little bit frightening a prospect to raise a family here in LA and I fantasize about moving back to Pgh under the right circumstances. I am not as concerned about crime in LA, perhaps because I've been fortunate to live in relatively nice places like Marina del Rey and Sherman Oaks. Sherman Oaks is a lot like Mt. Lebanon, in my opinion, by the way. There are lots of trees here.
The school system in Mt. Lebabnon may be better, however, since it's supposedly one of the best in the country. I haven't checked statistics in a long time but it was one of the top 50 schools in the country when I graduated in 1984. That included private schools. Perhaps that's no longer true, however since I haven't researched it recently. I can tell you that kids in Mt. Lebanon that I know still have that same thirst for knowledge and love of it than I remember when I lived there and went to school.
In LA, I've noticed something of a different attitude toward knowledge and learning -- but that may be because the weather's so darn nice here. Who wants to be inside, studying, yes? : )
The neighborhood that has the same feel as Mt. Lebanon in LA is Pacific Palisades. Also, I know several families with kids there, and their approach toward learning is similar to Mt. Lebo's. They all send their kids to private school in PP, but in Mt. Lebanon, there will be no need. You'll pay more in property taxes to live there, but it's a fabulous place and the schools are excellent and equipped to the hilt. We had 2 theaters to learn acting and stagecraft. One was a 1.2 million semi-thrust theater that's nicer than most small theaters in LA. We also had astro-turf on our football field (Lebo is a little elitist -- but generally not snobby), tennis courts, an ice skating rink, paddle tennis, etc.). The high school looks more like a small junior college with multiple buildlings and sports facilities.
The weather is a factor re: living in Pittsburgh. I have heard it has one of the highest number of overcast days of any city in the country and ranks up there with Seattle. My solution for this was to get away every winter, when it 's its grayest. 2 weeks would be ideal. If you can get away twice over the course of a few months in the winter and spring, this is even better.
For me, falls and summers are fantastic there. The best anywhere. There are lightning bugs and crickets in summer evenings. The environment is lush and green. Summer activities included classical music concerts in the parks under a star-filled sky. If you get a small boat, you can go on the river and soak on intertubes. It's a beautiful place to raise a family.
Regarding the weather -- don't be like my silly family and try to tough it out with minimal resources. If you approach it with what I call the "PATAGONIA APPROACH," -- or like a winter sport, you should be fine. Here are examples of what I mean:
1) Get a house / condo with a garage and keep your cars in the garage in winter so you don't have to scrape ice off the windows in the morning. If it's heated, that's even better, because it can be annoying getting into a cold car in the morning. Use the garage for cars, not storage, like my folks did. We were constantly out in the driveway scraping ice or sitting in the car shivering while it "warmed up."
2) Get really good Patagonia or other winter sportswear. A lot of the houses you'll be visiting will be older -- which means beautiful architecturally, but DRAFTY. So, make sure to have layers of capilene so no matter where you go, you'll be warm. A lot of Pgh-ers lived through the depression and may have their heat on low. PS I'd buy a newer house for that same reason, although I LOVE the older houses in Pgh -- so beautiful, but the heating bills are high and they need serious insulation.
3) Get sensible, cool, waterproof shoes, rather than stylish ones for winter and rainy times. Gore tex, etc.
4) Get a car that's good in snow and rain -- like an SUV with the best, most kick-ass tires. I drove an SUV while in Pgh (not out here, because I don't consider them necessary). I always felt safe going out in snow or potentially crappy weather.
5) Invest in some killer rain coats. Once I acquired 2 very cool burberry rain coats, I didn't mind the fact it can rain a lot back there certain times of the year; I was excited to wear my coats. One had a hood, which was awesome. Didn't have to worry if I forgot an umbrella.
6) Purchase excellent maps of Pgh. It's laid out funny because it has a lot of geographical barriers like rivers and mountains and can be challenging -- unless you approach it like a foreign terrain you're hiking for the first time, or a mountain you've never climbed before. If you're prepared, you'll feel like you're king of the world while the rest of the folk are just groping along.
7) Find the Whole Foods and gourmet food / produce stores. It's worth it. Pgh didn't used to have Whole Foods, but does now. I found its produce to be superior, plus I didn't have any problem getting my fancy / unusual CA stuff when I was back east.
Hope those tips didn't intimidate you. I formulated these tactics over 2 years of figuring out how I could assure the most successful experience moving back there from CA.
I'm really excited for you if you decide to go for it. Your children will have a safe, happy place to grow up in. In my opinion, Pgh-ers have excellent morals -- like the best native Californians do-- some of the best people I've met in the country. Pghers are kind, they'll be there for you when you need it, neighborly. Your kids will develop excellent study and cognitive thinking skills, and best of all, because of the lower cost of living, ideally, you won't be stressed about making your mortgage every month and you'll have more time to spend with them, which is the best gift you can give your children.
Hope you have a nice trip. Feel free to email if you have any more questions.
wow that was an extremely eloquent post. It seems to me that although you are quite content in LA part of you years for the 'Burgh! Who can blame you! Lots of success to you and your family in CA.
I never once said the population wasn't declining. Ever. I said it was stabilizing and did you see this?
Net domestic migration in 2005:
Boston: -50,025
Philly: -14,926
NYC: -264,770
Pgh: -11,544
DC: -24,872
By the way, this isn't a one year dip for these cities.
This isn't unique to Pittsburgh.
Furthermore, we don't stereotype here, we respect each other and learn about our differences. The differences in culture and neighborhoods is something we pride ourselves on. And religion has nothing to do with it. It's more like, "Oh you're from Bloomsfield! Have you tried that little italian restaraunt that makes that gnocci! How do they make it so good!" I don't think I've ever met someone and said "tell me your nationality!" How stupid.
And I definitely have no idea where you get your school facts. Pennsylvania schools are some of the best in the country. Locally there are North Hills (teachers can't even apply to the district unless they've managed a 4.0 throughout college), Pine Richland, Fox Chapel, Sewickly, Upper St. Claire. These are a few at the top of my head. You don't like less student population at your schools? Do you know how insane that sounds? Most parents would KILL to not have their kids graduating with half a million other kids. They would like a more intimate, individualized learning institution.
These numbers don't mean anything. you have to look at how many people moved into the area as well. IN a city like NY for example, people are moving in and out all the time.
These numbers don't mean anything. you have to look at how many people moved into the area as well. IN a city like NY for example, people are moving in and out all the time.
They do. People move in and out and of that measurement, all of these cities had a NET loss. These numbers are not numbers of people leaving a metro, they are the net of in and out migration. If you have a negative number than had a net loss.
Hi,
Good Luck to you and your family Morefromcali!
And WOW...thank you so much Sunshine1000!
I really really appreciate the information.I was hoping
to hear from someone who knew exactly where I am
coming from....so thanks again :-).
Take care,
Rachelle
P.S.
Thanks to everyone who has offered their opinions!
Well....did you move yet? I was born and raised in Pgh (east of Pgh in Monroeville..which is not listed as one of the cities on this site). I lived there a LONG time. Then, I lived in Florida for 14 years (Clearwater on the gulf coast and Melbourne on the east coast), then Atlanta for 3 years, and I've been in SoCal ever since (from Ojai to Agoura Hills).
I LOVE most things about Ventura County (except the crime and traffic, of course).....and mostly the cost of living. If I leave, I will truly miss my hikes through the beautiful mountains overlooking the ocean. I am thinking about moving somewhere where it's cheaper again. TOO MUCH STRESS HERE!! I do have to say that I wouldn't go back to Pittsburgh, but it's mainly because of the weather. I can't take the cold after all the years in the south and in CA. We also had the most potholes in the world in Pgh, I think (are the roads still bad?)
The ONE thing I miss most about Pgh....you may not believe this....is the pizza. Everywhere you go in Pgh, the pizza is different, and most of it is totally wonderful. I haven't had a great piece of pizza in years. In fact, I even think Pizza Hut pizza is okay now, and when I lived in the burgh, I wouldn't touch it.
Three Rivers is a wonderful area. My mother was born and raised in Mt. Washington, and totally took it for granted. But the views are supurb. The art festival used to be held right at Three Rivers and it was huge. I remember loving Phipps Conservatory, the Carnegie Museum, and I saw plenty of concerts at the Civic Arena.
I haven't lived there, nor have I been back, for 20 years (I was the last one in my family to leave, and I left right after the steel mills closed).
The winter will truly make you enjoy spring and summer. I used to get depressed in the fall because all I could think about was that winter was coming. Winter was cold and you won't see the son literally for MONTHS (you have to think of that, because your experience now is total sunshine). This might be the hardest part of the transition to make.
Oh, I forgot to mention.....I don't feel "welcome" or "at home" in CA. I find that the people in this area don't seem to know how to or want to connect. My theory is it's because everyone is trying too hard to make a living so we can afford the lifestyle. I've been in the real estate industry (I'm a mortgage consultant)....and greed is rampant. I'm getting out of mortgages because so many people have been ripped off that they don't know who to trust. It's very frustrating to me that people can't feel my honesty. I never sold a neg am mortgage. Anyway...that's another story.....
I wish you well, and if you've made the move, let us all know how you're doing!
Last edited by jtuck2; 07-13-2007 at 06:34 PM..
Reason: added info about not feeling at home in CA
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I'm an LA-er who was born in Pgh and Pgh is GREAT for families
