parking violation question. please help! (Pittsburgh, Washington: houses, neighborhoods, live)

[sandielabor]

In pittsburgh pennsylvania,if a vehicle is parked in front of a house on a street that allows on street parking, is that spot able to be considered "private property" by the resident of that home? I was driving home four days ago and my alternator must have gone out because my battery died while I was on my way. luckily I was on a street less than half a mile from my home and was able to pull the car up against the sidewalk before it completely died. I left the car in a spot that did not have "no parking" signs and was not blocking anyone's private driveway. There were quite a few other cars parked in front of where I stopped but for the number of houses in that area, I felt that I was in no way taking anyone's spot or making it so that someone who lived on that street would not have anywhere to park.

I made arrangements to tow the vehicle home tomorrow which will be day five. I unfortunately did not have the money to do so before. I walked by the car today to check on it and found a parking citation stating that I was parked unlawfully. additional comments were written that I had parked on private property without the consent of the owner. i'm just trying to figure out if I can fight this. I have always been under the impression that unless you are in or blocking someone's driveway, on-street parking is considered public. This was not a private street either. I also read up on laws stating that if you leave an inoperable vehicle over 48 hrs it is considered abandoned. I would understand if the citation were written because of vehicle abandonment, but this one only stated that I was in violation for parking on private property.

And did I mention the ticket is for $100? Otherwise I wouldn't be so concerned.

[chielgirl]

Ah, I take it you're not from Pittsburgh!

In Pittsburgh, there's an unwritten law that the space in front of your house is yours, not your neighbor's, not their friends, but yours. You shovel and clean up the area and if necessary, put a chair in your space to show that this is yours. Most people respect that tradition; if not, it makes for bad neighbors.

Did you talk with the neighbors where you parked?
Did you leave a note on the car?
They could have seen your car as abandoned.
Was it parked near a driveway? There's a requirement of being no closer than 3 feet from either side of the driveway.

If you don't have the money for the ticket, take it to evening traffic court.
The fine can be reduced or dismissed.
It might be worth the trouble.

[ditchdigger]

In Pittsburgh, there's an unwritten law that the space in front of your house is yours, not your neighbor's, not their friends, but yours. You shovel and clean up the area and if necessary, put a chair in your space to show that this is yours. Most people respect that tradition; if not, it makes for bad neighbors.

And that tradition is totally contrary to what is actually legal. Probably about 12-15 years ago, Dormont made the news because the Police Department directed the Public Works guys to go around town and confiscate all the "parking chairs." People were fighting over the spaces anyway, and the cops were getting tired of it. Leaving your furniture on public property is in fact illegal.

Sandielabor, not that I can help at all, but which municipality was this? The "private property" aspect is puzzling. If you were indeed next to the curb on a public street it doesn't matter what the adjoining property owner thinks is theirs, but it had to be a cop who issued the ticket...

[Hopes]

It was probably reported as an abandoned vehicle since it sat for so long.

The homeowner is probably related or friends with the police.

[aveojohn]

The streets in every area I know of, parking has always been 1st come 1st serve, with the exception of permit parking in some areas of the city. These areas are usually marked pretty well. I would fight the ticket in traffic court.

[greg42]

The unwritten rules don't make for a ticket, though. Are you sure it's a real citation and not somebody faking? It's mostly a joke but I suppose someone could actually be pulling such a thing if that is "their" spot so to speak.

The reasons for legitimately getting a ticket just don't really match up for the "parking on private property" cited on the ticket. The only ones I can think of are the abandoned vehicle, permit area, snow removal or street cleaning. (I don't think there was significant snow removal last week, and I don't think they do the street cleaning in the winter.) If it was any of those, it should have been cited on the ticket.

Since the car is still in its exact spot, now is the time to grab some pictures if you have a chance, take a picture of its location, of any signage posted about parking, etc. Then go to court and fight it, assuming you're 100% sure of the public street thing (there are a few private streets as you may know, but you seem to have that covered). If it was 10-20 bucks or something, it might not be worth it to go to court, but for $100 it seems like it should be.

That, at least, is what I would do. The pics of the car in its exact spot, clearly showing it on the street, should mean a simple case. I mean, if they want to ticket for abandoned vehicle, they need to put that on the ticket I think. Maybe the ticket writer screwed up and cited the wrong thing, but that is not your concern here.

Disclaimer: am not a lawyer, have not been to Pittsburgh traffic court, etc. Just what I would try to do because it seems simple if all is as described.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by sandielabor

I also read up on laws stating that if you leave an inoperable vehicle over 48 hrs it is considered abandoned. I would understand if the citation were written because of vehicle abandonment, but this one only stated that I was in violation for parking on private property.

I'm sure the unlawful parking pertained the it being an abandoned vehicle. The not getting permission from private property owner was probably just an added comment.

Originally Posted by aveojohn

The streets in every area I know of, parking has always been 1st come 1st serve, with the exception of permit parking in some areas of the city.

My girlfriend's neighborhood is not first come first serve and it's not a permit parking area. All of the neighbors respectfully park in front of their own houses. Nobody puts chairs outside, but neighbors do it out of respect. Doing otherwise would be asking for war. There have been one or two neighbors would didn't understand this concept but the neighborhood as a whole made it clear that they needed to get with the program. I think this is more common in neighborhoods where the houses are occupied by homeowners instead of renters. Homeowners are more stable in the neighborhood so it's easier to establish unwritten 'laws' like this. In an area with high percentage of renters, it would be impossible to 'enforce' due to the instability of the neighborhood population.

[greg42]

Originally Posted by Hopes

My girlfriend's neighborhood is not first come first serve and it's not a permit parking area. All of the neighbors respectfully park in front of their own houses. Nobody puts chairs outside, but neighbors do it out of respect. Doing otherwise would be asking for war. There have been one or two neighbors would didn't understand this concept but the neighborhood as a whole made it clear that they needed to get with the program. I think this is more common in neighborhoods where the houses are occupied by homeowners instead of renters. Homeowners are more stable in the neighborhood so it's easier to establish unwritten 'laws' like this. In an area with high percentage of renters, it would be impossible to 'enforce' due to the instability of the neighborhood population.

The idea here though was in terms of a ticket, not in terms of tradition. The neighborhood respect thing is all well and good, but that doesn't mean they can get a car ticketed just for being on that street. The point was in terms of the LAW the parking is first come, first served in a non-permit area, including the one you are describing above. What the people who live there do with their own cars is not material.

Stuff like this does make me wonder where the visitors have to park in some of these areas in order to not PO the neighbors. Also reminds me that in any housing search in the city, off-street parking will be a must.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by greg42

The idea here though was in terms of a ticket, not in terms of tradition. The neighborhood respect thing is all well and good, but that doesn't mean they can get a car ticketed just for being on that street. The point was in terms of the LAW the parking is first come, first served in a non-permit area, including the one you are describing above. What the people who live there do with their own cars is not material.

I'm fully aware. I was just elaborating on the Pittsburgh tradition of parking spaces on public streets in residential areas. Since you're not from the Pittsburgh area, you might be unfamiliar with this strange tradition. It's worthy of discussion since it is relevant. The OP very well could win the fight of the ticket. But I'm not surprised he got a ticket. I mentioned in my previous post that the house owner might be friends with the police. That stuff happens in Pittsburgh. Just sharing what I know.

Originally Posted by greg42

Stuff like this does make me wonder where the visitors have to park in some of these areas in order to not PO the neighbors. Also reminds me that in any housing search in the city, off-street parking will be a must.

Visitors aren't usually a problem. If a neighbor has a huge party, the visitors take up whatever spaces they want. The neighbors simply park elsewhere. It only becomes an issue if a certain house has parties on a regular basis. Fortunately, most parties start when other residents are already home from work and parked in their spots. That leaves the visitors to usually take what's left or park a block or two away.

[hempfield mania]

Parking "chairs" always looked good in the dumpster when I lived on Mt. Washington. Just sayin'.