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I'm sorry, but I just had to recycle this topic. Me and some of my friends who are looking to escape their toxic jobs are on the job boards everyday.
I do not see recovery here -although I understand that there have been "allegations" that the impact of the recession never hit Pittsburgh as hard as other areas in the country.
I see that things are possibly getting worse, and if not worse, WEIRD.
Posters on a national forum I frequent have noticed that employers are posting jobs for minimal pay with extravagant job duties...jobs for "Accountants" listing typically entry-level accounting clerk duties and asking for B.S. degrees...and a dirth of entry to mid-level office or operations jobs. These kind of postings reflect an employer's market, one where recruiters are operating on the belief that there are many unemployed people floating around out there to pick and choose from.
I am also seeing a lot of unemployed posters experiencing "bad" behavior from recruiters. Some of them think recruiters will come to regret their alienating behaviors once the the employer's market is over. I think this is delusional thinking.
I also think some jobs are not coming back for a long time because businesses have become more efficient , in part because they have been able to redirect their negative and dyfunctional energies after purging people they dislike using the ecomony as an exuse. Also, whatever entry job openings do exist that are not undesirable for some reason, are now more than ever, part of the hidden job market - very closely held, so to speak. God forbid, letting "unlikeable" people back into the fold.
Relatively good doesn't mean great in absolute terms. We're still down in the total number of jobs from pre-recession, and meanwhile we have a lot more jobseekers here than pre-recession. Even with job growth starting up, that still means it is an oversupplied (employer's) market. And that could continue for a while if more new jobseekers keep showing up.
Just by doing some casual browsing on job boards, I can see that their are more jobs in my field (IT). However, about 3/4 of them are very low offers with not so great benefits. Even though we're getting more "jobs", that doesn't change the fact that the jobs that we are getting pay horribly.
For example, my girlfriend is an actuarial analyst and she's getting paid $30,000 a year which is 20k below the low end of the national average. Hell, I nearly made that much stocking shelves at Shop N Save in my teens.
I agree. You see plenty of job postings; but the pay rate offered is just ridiculous. $30K is near the mid-to-high range. Anything over that, the job postings are so specific in regards to your past experience, your work hours, how many dogs you have at home....it's just crazy!
My first 'professional job' was working for a title insurance company. I walked in the door, not even knowing what title insurance was! However within 3 years I promoted to making just under $40K, with no college degree. And I had friends whispering in my ear about other opportunities where the pay would be even higher. However real estate dried up...and I went back to college. Now I have a BA; but the job market is bone dry. I have a job; but I make much less than what I used to (just under $30K). So now I'm in graduate school. Which will probably over-qualify me for many jobs. But hey, I get to defer my loan payments!
To the OP: Your entire post is anecdotal. While I do not question the truthfulness of your account, your experience, and your friends experiences, may or may not be typical. That is the problem with anecdotal evidence. Statistical evidence, which is what people are citing when describing the Pittsburgh job market as relatively good, can, however, determine typicality.
Of course then we're dealing in generalities, they mean nothing to individuals whom experience a result which may be atypical to general statistical analysis.
Having said that, if your interested, my anecdotal account regarding your specific experiences is as follows: Accounting is a very saturated carreer across the nation right now. In the early 2000s accounting exploded after the Enrons of the world and Sarbanes-Oxley was inacted. Now, there are a ton of people with B.S.'s in accounting looking for jobs, and with a scale back of SOx, and the depressed economy, the supply far, far out weighs demand. So employers are going to be choosy. So yes, what are you experiencing is probably a manifestation of this fact pattern in the Pittsburgh market.
But, as I alluded to above, the overall job market in Pittsburgh may still be relatively good.
Corporate recruiters have always been, and will always be, bloodsuckers.
I secured a job just over a year ago, for which the job listing stated requirements that were unquestionably beyond the reach of my resume. I had an acquaintance pass along my resume which resulted in an interview. I made a case for myself, and things worked out.
In sum, while I understand the odds, don't always let a job's "requirements" turn you away (within reason, of course). And never stop networking.
Now granted I did not own my own automobile and I did not have a drivers license until August of that year. My Tight old Hunkie dad wouldn't let me drive because he did not want to pay more for car insurance and he did not want me wearing out his automobile.
Now I had an offer to go to tech school to become an auto mechanic. Vale Tech - Blairsville.
But right back to the tight old Hunkie dad, he didn't want me spending money on school, because the GI Bill sent him to school and he never used his education. It was the same deal when I went to elementary school and wanted to plan a musical instrument.
So everything revolved around my tight old hunkie dad's belief's and his wants and not mine. There was never anything written in a book that said that you had to send your kids to school when they graduate from high school back then and there was nothing written in a book that said that you had to provide transportation - if they wanted to get a job.
The only advice my dad had was for me to join the military and let they pay to train me and educate me. That was what his mother made him and his siblings do - until my youngest uncle graduated and the Vietnam war was going on - and then she didn't want him going to no army and getting killed and so they spent their money so he could get an education and not be drafted into the military.
I paid for that later in life, because my first job only paid $3 an hour delivering lumber for a local business. That was 2 years after I graduated from high school and I had a strong back and a good work ethic.
The funny thing was, I had to walk 3 miles one way every day to get to and from work and I drove a delivery truck for a living.
It would be like having a job milking cows, but not making enough money to be able to afford to buy milk.
I saved my money and bought a really old / used truck that I used to go elsewhere to find better employment opportunities.
I ended up wearing out that old truck and never did make enough money to buy a better vehicle.
In my first 10 years of employment, I don't think I made $40,000.00
All of the good jobs were spoken for and the people who had good jobs kept those good jobs in the family. Most employers were closed shops, where you couldn't even get your foot in the door.
Even truck driving jobs requires you to have a CDL and unless you have the money to go to school, the only way you can get a CDL is if your relatives owns a company that has large trucks, where you can drive their trucks to take the test to get the CDL. You get my point?
Jobs like Electrical Linemen were non existent, because the people that had those jobs were in their 30's and 40's and had many years before they were going to retire. Plus many of the employers that hired those people wouldn't hire you unless you worked so many years for a sub contractor line crew. The line crews were not located near my home and so you couldn't get hired to work for one of those outfits - because they were too far away and they wouldn't pay for you to stay in a motel when they worked out of town.
Now companies like First Energy ( Penelec) has Colleges to educate the youth so they can get hired after one year of full time school. Those people who were in their 30's and 40's - 30 years ago are now retiring and they have not trained anyone to take their position when they leave so when you look at a crew you see a large disparity in the ages between the workers. You have gray beards who looks like they are about ready to kick the bucket and young kids who looks like they should still be playing with marbles. Many times the old people won't teach the young people anything and the young people won't listen to the old people anyways because the colleges has filled their heads so full of nonsense and the only reason why they took the job was because of the high level of pay.
Now you wonder - why was my electric off so long last winter?
Let me put it to you like this. The old people are not in good enough condition to work 50 or 60 hours straight, nor would their unions and OSHA let them work that long without a break. The young people thinks that they work 8 or 10 hours and then they go home. They don't want to work, they just want paid!
I'm sorry, but I would have to agree with Perryview 22 on this one.
I see this mentality all across the board.
The employers who hired someone 30 years ago, who had to wear many hats to get the job done, are for the most part now too old or are ready to retire and there is no one to pick up the ball and run with it.
So they put an ad in the Career Link web site or in the newspapers that they are looking for someone who can just walk right in the door, push the button and start to work. They don't want to train you and they do not want to hire someone without anything less then 5 years of experience.
This is a short term gain, but a long term loss.
This fixes my problem today, but what about tomorrow when that person gets too old to do it anymore, or if that person quits and goes somewhere else because company X is paying $.50 an hour more money and is closer to the employee's home.
There is no loyalty and most people can expect to have multiple employers over a lifetime.
In the meantime, most everything is electrical / electronic and since you can't get the younger generation to work and since robots doesn't eat or take breaks, most everything is going automated and when you add that to the equation, the problem now is - not only do you need a mechanic to fix your old JUNK, you also need a robotics specialist to fix all this high tech junk!
You go to hire a machinist and if he doesn't have CNC experience, you just throw the application in the garbage. In the meantime, you hire kids who knows computers and knows what the G codes are - but doesn't know how to machine. You put them on a manual machine and they don't even know how to run it. They don't even know what the hand wheels do or how to change the gears.
Unless this country wakes up and gets back into manufacturing - it isn't going to be around much longer. I'm sorry - but that is just how it is.
Pittsburgh made it's money off STEEL - not technology.
The other thing is - if you want to cry so much about how bad things are, maybe you ought to look in your driveways.
This same punk kid who comes on here complaining about how bad things are - probably has a HONDA or a HYUNDAI in their driveway.
I'm sorry - but that is just wrong.
I drive a Chevrolet, my dad drives a Chevrolet, my brothers all driver General Motors products. That is the way it is in my family.
If you want our country to survive this depression - you got to buy AMERICAN PERIOD! There is no short cuts to getting rich quick.
There is only two ways to make money, Either be born into money or figure out a way to steal it off someone who already has money.
There is nothing in between. You are not ever going to get rich working 40 hours a week for $10 a hour. That is Subsistence living .
You work, your wife works, your girlfriend works, your kids works, your parents works - well beyond the retirement age and the only people who gets rich is the ones who owns the companies!
The credit card companies - who acts like they are your best friend and your parents who never explained to you that a credit card is like a small loan. Every time you want something and you don't have the money to pay for it When you use that credit card, it is not free money, it has to come from someplace. The card companies are not out to loan you money, they are there to make money off the interest.
The young kids don't understand that at some point, it all has to be paid back with interest. At the same time - the young kids who doesn't want to live in an old house - goes out and buys these McMansions - and maybe between their pay and their spouses pay they can afford the mortgage, but they can't afford the taxes and the insurance and they don't realize that at some point their automobiles are going to wear out and their clothes are going to wear out and they just use the card to pay for everything until they get so far in debt that they can't get out and then they declare bankruptcy.
All the time, they are driving past my house, laughing at me for owning my own home - even though it is a dump and 120+ years old, it is mine and I own it and I don't owe anyone anything. There is no bill collectors calling me on the phone - wanting to know where their money is. I don't even have caller ID. I don't have a cell phone - because I'm not hiding from anyone. There isn't anyone in this world who is so important that I have to carry around a phone so if they want me that I am at their beck and call 24/7.
Do you want to know where your money is? It is tied up in all those luxuries you carry around with you. Computers and phones and fancy cars and credit cards and your high style of living. After 4 years of no prospects of employment - Communism doesn't look so bad. At least everyone has a roof over their heads and everyone has a job and there is no borrowing money and there is no credit cards and there is no one working to get ahead - because everyone gets paid the same for the job that they perform.
We didn't win the cold war, we just outspent the communist. Then once they declared use the winner, we gave them money and help to get back on their feet! There is something messed up with this picture.
The Japanese lost WW II - yet they own more of the United States then we do! The Chinese declared Korea a tie, yet they own more of the United States then we do!
Last edited by Honest Bob; 05-28-2010 at 08:46 AM..
Can I add my two cents? .....if you want to cry so much about how bad things are, maybe you ought to look in your driveways.
This same punk kid who comes on here complaining about how bad things are - probably has a HONDA or a HYUNDAI in their driveway. I'm sorry - but that is just wrong.
I drive a Chevrolet, my dad drives a Chevrolet, my brothers all driver General Motors products. That is the way it is in my family.
If you want our country to survive this depression - you got to buy AMERICAN PERIOD!
Yep, that's about 2 cents worth!
There's a very good chance that the Honda or Hyundai that those "punk kids" are driving was made in America.
There's an equally good chance that the Chevy you love was made in either Canada or Mexico, or possibly even Korea! (gasp!)
It's no longer 1978; if you're there, you need to somehow build a time machine and get yourself to the 21st century, or at least the very late 20th century.
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