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Socialism does work in certain limited situations. Look at our interstates. Socialism can work in, if properly employed, in situations where a free market is absent. Capitalism CANNOT work without a free market because then it's no longer capitalism.
You know, when we look at Socialist countries of the past, NO ONE FO THEM SUCCEDDED. France is imploding, England is having a hell of a time caring for their people and its medical and social services systems are in chaos. Can you name 1 country with more than 20 million people where Socialism works?? Just 1 would do. Now don't try to say Canada, because their medical system completely sucks, that is why 1 out of every 10 clients I had in my old immigration law job were Canadians complaning how the healthcare sucks and social services were for illegal aliens only (nothing left for Canadian citizens).
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Originally Posted by doc1
Socialism, communism, I don't care as long as I'm one of the ones that gets to live in the palace.
Yep like Fidel Castro or Stallin. Hugo Chavez supposedly has his perosnal wealth close to 1 Billion US Dollars.... his people starve, and he talks a good show... specially now since he shut down all TV and radio stations that say the people are starving while Hugo Chavez has a $1 Billion Dollars in the bank from oil revenues. (Hugo Chavez - One Man Axis of Crazy) Socialism works... for the top guys. Stallin lived in the Russian palaces, Castro is well-fed while his people starve, and Chavez vows to be the next Fidel. Let's hope Chavez doesn't meet a Che Guevara-type, so the people of Venezuela won't be massacred as the Cubans were!!
I quit taking the liberal rags years ago. Surely you want people to vote with truthful information don't you?
Not all newspapers are liberal. And just because you read it doesn't mean you have to believe it, but you do need to be aware of the different view points in the world. As much as I hate to admit it conservatives are not always honest, for example right now in SC we have a Republican conservative being indicted for cocaine distribution while in office, you can not get away with something like that for very long without being a well-practiced liar. . If you know the liberal "facts" and the conservative "facts" you can cross check them and discover the truth. Don't get me wrong just because I don't believe that conservatives always tell the truth don't mean I am not a conservative because I am, I am just willing to admit that no one is perfectly right 100% of the time and no one is perfectly wrong 100% of the time. You have to take in all info with a critical mind.
You know, when we look at Socialist countries of the past, NO ONE FO THEM SUCCEDDED. France is imploding, England is having a hell of a time caring for their people and its medical and social services systems are in chaos. Can you name 1 country with more than 20 million people where Socialism works?? Just 1 would do. Now don't try to say Canada, because their medical system completely sucks, that is why 1 out of every 10 clients I had in my old immigration law job were Canadians complaning how the healthcare sucks and social services were for illegal aliens only (nothing left for Canadian citizens).
What are you going on about? I never said the US should convert to socialism. I was giving an example of limited, isolated cases where it does work (in situations where a free market is absent). Your post is nothing but grandstanding. You didn't make a single point worth refuting because you didn't even debate my original point. Moderator cut: ad hominem
As for socialism, that word seems more and more to be becoming a stand-in for 'not neoconism'. The latter of course is more and more widely being recognized as a primary source of the general mess that this country finds itself in six years on, and if young people -- i.e., those who have the longest time yet to live with the unfortunate consequences of neoconism -- seem to be turning away from it in droves, good for them. The country may end up having a future after all...
Last edited by saganista; 06-22-2007 at 07:48 AM..
If I read this board there are far more right wing young people than left wing. I find this absurd because the right wing has concentrated behind the Bushistas and the neocons in creating an authoritarian nightmare dominated by the true believers in the one right way. I would hope there are many young people realizing that this distorted form of capitalism does not offer then much of a future and that left wing egalitarianism will provide a much more prosperous and fair future.
The first and most effective way to destroy free market capitalism is to let the businessmen involved collude to create a set of monopolies. Some times business uses the government to help them to create the monopolies but avoid the regulation of their profits. The ultimate result is corporate welfare such as we now have dominating our economy.
I consider a system that redistributes the wealth from the top to the bottom to be much more desirable than one that only redistributes income from the bottom to the top. Among other things the latter gives the people on the top much more incentive to work harder and take more risks to keep their exalted status.
If I read this board there are far more right wing young people than left wing. I find this absurd because the right wing has concentrated behind the Bushistas and the neocons in creating an authoritarian nightmare dominated by the true believers in the one right way. I would hope there are many young people realizing that this distorted form of capitalism does not offer then much of a future and that left wing egalitarianism will provide a much more prosperous and fair future.
We don't have to throw the baby out with the bath water. I'd rather fix the baby, maybe create a bionic baby! Socialism is not the answer.
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The first and most effective way to destroy free market capitalism is to let the businessmen involved collude to create a set of monopolies. Some times business uses the government to help them to create the monopolies but avoid the regulation of their profits. The ultimate result is corporate welfare such as we now have dominating our economy.
You're right. That is what we have. That doesn't mean we need to trash the entire system, though. We need to fix the problems, and they are fixable.
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I consider a system that redistributes the wealth from the top to the bottom to be much more desirable than one that only redistributes income from the bottom to the top. Among other things the latter gives the people on the top much more incentive to work harder and take more risks to keep their exalted status.
I don't. I find ANY wealth redistribution to be undesirable. I realize that a little is necessary to have a functioning society, but it should be minimized.
Then little Jowy over here graduated from college and cannot find a job, because lil' Jowy wants to get paid decent wages and he cannot, because Mr. Punjab takes Jowy's job for $18,000 less a year.
No wonder people are getting pissed off!
Preaching to the choir. I'm one of those people who are pissed about this. I used to be supportive of illegal immigrants, but now after going through what I went through the last 2 years, I want all illegals kicked out.
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Originally Posted by Nirvana-Guy
Oh you should see Boulder. These people there are liberal hippie quacks. They hate this country, they blame the US for everything, they think the US is at fault for the defeat of the Soviet Union, they tell kids at school to use Ecstacy, to have sex with anyone and everyone (everything) without condoms, to act crazy. One of their college professors goes out and calls 9/11 victims Nazis and keeps getting paid for over 2 years.
Boulder? I hear Boulder is a great town and is relatively liberal compared to the rest of Colorado, but is it really what you say? They like Stalin, Lenin, Mussolini, etc? Come on, anyone with a drop of common sense knows that Stalin and Mussolini and any others you named were butchers.
I find ANY wealth redistribution to be undesirable. I realize that a little is necessary to have a functioning society, but it should be minimized.
Redistribution of income is one of the fundamental purposes of any society. Society is an association established for risk- and cost-sharing purposes done in the quite well-founded belief that collective gains in real income can and do result from cooperative effort. There is no a priori reason either to minimize or to maximize social redistribution of income. Reasons for moving in either direction proceed from the circumstances that a society confronts. Income redistribution is a means to an end. Without knowing the end, it is impossible to judge the worthiness of the means...
Ah yes income redistribution....shall I go to my state welfare office, or should I head for that interview on Rockefeller Plaza? It would be a tough choice given the ramifications of either. Seriously, some of you are downright frightening, never mind the fact that income re-distribution is already well under way and expanding in every state and at the federal level. It will always continue and grow without the presence of a flat tax at all facets. Of course I will get the predictable retorts of the rich with their offshore accounts, tax breaks, and the issue of corporate welfare, which is a whole separate issue.
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Hugo Chavez supposedly has his perosnal wealth close to 1 Billion US Dollars.... his people starve, and he talks a good show... specially now since he shut down all TV and radio stations that say the people are starving while Hugo Chavez has a $1 Billion Dollars in the bank from oil revenues. (
Socialism is not the answer. 
