Thank you for your reply, I will first comment on the selected articles, and then try to illuminate the historical background:
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
13. We demand the nationalization of all trusts
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This was in answer to monopolizing trusts which fixed prices (mostly food, building materials etc.) after WWI.
While not anticapitalistic (monopolies are generally not allowed), one could argue that it had an 'nationalization'-tint. I think one has to consider that this sentence meant something else then than it does now. But that is open for discussion.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
14. We demand profit-sharing in large industries
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This one is closely related to #13, as it concerns large corporations who mostly grossly abused their powers to generate monopolies and fix prices. Obviously, it sounds like nationalization, but I have the same doubts as above. But, again, open for discussion
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities
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I give you that one, there are socialist tendencies here.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
17. We demand an agrarian reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to expropriate the owners without compensation of any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land
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Sounds harsh, but is connected to #13 and #14 and concerns the fixing of food prices by trusts and large industries (who bought enormous stretches of agrarian land during WWI). It furthermore is in agreement with the "Blut und Boden" (blood and ground) ideology of the NSDAP, which proclaimed the quasi-holiness of aryan ground.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
25. In order to carry out this program we demand: the creation of a strong central authority in the State, the unconditional authority by the political central parliament of the whole State and all its organizations
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This is business as usual in nearly every modern democracy, and was in answer to secessionist tendencies of various territories after WWI (Bavaria and others)
One could certainly argue that points 11-18 proclaimed some vague socialist tendencies. Hitler actually did, and negated them in 1928 with an amendment (see my previous post on this)
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
well while it not in the 25 points, it does go back to the 1928 law and was reissued with the 1938 law
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I agree. But note that the 1938 law was specifically meant as a determent to jews, communists, subjugated countries etc.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
4. Only those who are our fellow countrymen can become citizens. Only those who have German blood, regardless of creed, can be our countrymen. Hence no Jew can be a countryman.
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As I said, no 'blaming', but proposed exclusion/harassment
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
7. We demand that the State shall above all undertake to ensure that every citizen shall have the possibility of living decently and earning a livelihood. If it should not be possible to feed the whole population, then aliens (non-citizens) must be expelled from the Reich
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Actually, I think that there might be a slight but important flaw in the translation:
"
Wir fordern, daß sich der Staat verpflichtet, in erster Linie für die Erwerbs- und Lebensmöglichkeit der Staatsbürger zu sorgen. Wenn es nicht möglich ist, die Gesamtbevölkerung des Staates zu ernähren, so sind die Angehörigen fremder Nationen (Nicht-Staatsbürger) aus dem Reiche auszuweisen."
"In erster Linie", used as it is here, means that the State shall primarily look after the well-being of its citizens, and not the non-citizens. If funds or means are insufficient, non-citizens should be expelled.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
15. We demand a generous increase in old-age pensions.
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Vaguely socialist. Seems to be a propaganda instrument, as the percentage of older people was disproportionally high after WWI (young people died in the war)
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero
16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities
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Same as above. One could add that the creation of a middle-class is decidedly anti-socialist/anti-class-warfare.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
Further, a Nazi decree of October 19, 1941 established abortion on demand as the official policy of Poland. Hitler, however, expressed dissatisfaction with this policy. Abortion, he believed, should NOT be limited to Poland. He therefore ordered that abortion be expanded to all populations under the control of the "Ministry of the Occupied Territories of the East."
On July 22, 1942, the Fuhrer exhibited a highly positive attitude towards abortion as an indispensable method of dealing with the non-German populations in countries under Nazi control. "In view of the large families of the native populations," he asserted, "it could only suit us if girls and women there had as many abortions as possible." Hitler also personally announced that he "would personally shoot" any "such idiot" who "tried to put into practice such an order (forbidding abortion) in the occupied Eastern territories
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Abortion as an instrument of control over subjugated people and persons not considered "Aryans" was indeed a policy of the Nazis. But it seems to be out of place in a discussion about the similarities of Hitler and Obama, as it wasn't Obama who allowed abortions in the US.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
In Nazi Germany, for instance, abstinence from tobacco was a "national socialist duty" [...]
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Didn't know that fact, interesting! Thanks for the information.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
I would never compare the dictatorship or inhuman or evilness of hitler to obama or the liberals...but to compare a national socialist agenda to the liberals is at least in the ballpark
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This is certainly a claim you can make.
However, I think you need to take into account that the 25-Punkte-Programm stems from 1920, when there still were members with socialist tendencies in the NSDAP. After an internal struggle for power, which Hitler won (1926), he rescinded on the points with vague socialist tendencies (1928), and adapted decisively pro-industry, pro-corporation and pro-private-property policies.
As to the alleged similarities between Nazi-ideology and liberal ideology:
pro-choice: the difference lies in the intended implications. Nazi: de-individualization, control of masses. Liberal: individualization, rights of property on own body.
anti-tobacco: don't know enough about the Nazi's side to comment on this. Besides, I'm a smoker.
pro-gun-control: Nazi: control of masses, decrease in defensive abilities and safety in targeted factions. Liberal: decrease in violence, increase in safety for whole population.
I know that these last points are debatable, but there are enough threads for this on this forum.
I hope that covers most points, if not, or if you don't agree, let me know.