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Old 08-07-2010, 05:09 PM
 
Location: Texas
2,847 posts, read 2,518,315 times
Reputation: 1775

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Why do you feel the need to assign blame; what purpose does that serve?
Why not simply "how do we fix this?"
one of the premises of problem solving is to identify the cause.
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,495,743 times
Reputation: 27720
You cant fix something if you don't know what broke it.

K-12 is broke IMHO. They come out of high school and many cannot enter into college without taking remedial courses in English and Math. The CC's have more remedial classes than college level classes for pete's sake. And they even drop out of the remedial classes because they are too hard.

That's because everyone is the same, everyone is a winner. Lower the bar so that No Child is Left Behind. Got it..no one is left behind but that can only happen if everyone else slows down, or in the case of education, gets dumbed down. Teach to the test and throw critical thinking and logic out the window.
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,286,152 times
Reputation: 11416
Quote:
Originally Posted by aliveandwellinSA View Post
one of the premises of problem solving is to identify the cause.
Identifying the cause is a bit different from "who to blame" as stated in the OP.
Words matter.
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:00 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,419 posts, read 20,311,358 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Those breeding like bunnies are the ones going after the welfare handouts. Even coming here from other countries by the millions. We now reward single mothers with a life-long retirement plan, they just have to have lots of kids.
Well, she isn't exactly the brightest bulb.
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:11 PM
 
140 posts, read 129,059 times
Reputation: 57
We've fallen way behind the rest of the industrialized world in everything over the past 30 years. A "free market money is all that matters" philosophy will get you that. My generation is ****ed, thanks baby boomers!
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:33 PM
 
8,263 posts, read 12,200,443 times
Reputation: 4801
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimrome View Post
We've fallen way behind the rest of the industrialized world in everything over the past 30 years.
No, where certainly aren't. I'll never understand people who just throw up there hands and use some ridiculous claim as support to how doomed we are.

In this instance, 12th? Do you believe there are only 11 countries in the industrialized world and that we are way behind #11?
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:39 PM
 
Location: SC
9,101 posts, read 16,459,190 times
Reputation: 3620
Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneTraveler View Post
If college wasn't expensive as hell here then maybe more Americans would attend.
So TRUE! You know what? It used to be affordable BEFORE the government got involved in guaranteed student loans. But is this surprising? No, it is to be EXPECTED. Anytime the governement gets involved in ANYTHING that the private sector does just ends up INFLATNG the costs and REDUCING the quality.

In the old days, it used to take one year's salary to pay for a college education. In those days though, there were NO government guaranteed student loans. When these were introduced, rather than making education available to more people what they did was guarantee to the colleges that the tuition would be paid even though it usually meant students would be mortgaged to the hilt! Colleges took full advantage of this and RAISED PRICES of TUITIONS. Did schools begin providing BETTER EDUCATIONS? No, in fact it is easier to gain entrance to colleges than ever before.

At Tulane University before the days of federal guaranteed student loans, a year of undergraduate education working towards a BA or a BS degree was around $4k to $5k . Now it is in the $60,000 range and the entrance requirements are easier, no doubt, and the course work has been made easier, so the less capable students of today, can handle it. So not only are colleges getting paid 15 times as much as they used to, they are providing an inferior product!

The perception of course is that the government is making higher education available to so many more people. HA! Actually, a college education costs three times what it used to and is providing not nearly the academic experience that it used to. Furthermore, those who get student loans to pay for it will be paying for it for a LONG LONG TIME! It is just ANOTHER SCAM successfully perpetrated on the American People!
Who really benefirts from govt. guaranteed student loans? It isn't the student, that is for sure. Rather it is the government, the banksters and the schools.

Another example of an industry that by getting involved, the government has absolutely ruined, and like a drug addict, still think it needs to get more and more involved (at Taxpayer expense) is the housing industry with government backed home mortgage programs! We all know what THIS did to ruin our economy by now.

The bottom line is that history plainly shows that government involvement in anything done by the private sector will make it MORE EXPENSIVE exponentially and lower the quality. Let's wake up and realize it and STOP ALL FEDERAL GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS except the military and stop forcing the taxpayer to pay for overpriced substandard programs that only benefit the government and the banks and the industries
involved.


YouTube - ‪Peter Schiff on why government intervention causes high college tuition prices‬‎

Peter Schiff explains the history of college tuitions (above) and how by the government getting involved to "make them more affordable" they have become less and less affordable...also he talks about how the academic standards have droppede.


YouTube - ‪Peter Schiff: Jobs, Emigration, Student Loans, Capital Controls‬‎

watch from the 4 min to the 6.4 minute marker to listen to Peter Schiff on how the Government continues to increase the cost of education.


YouTube - ‪Peter Schiff On Bernanke, Fannie, Freddie, Tax Cuts And Student Loans‬‎

watch from 3:20 minute mark about government backed home loans and from 6:10 about the new even MORE IRRESPONSIBLE student loan programs -- another unethical Obama administration program that will put even MORE burden on the taxpayers.
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:41 PM
 
140 posts, read 129,059 times
Reputation: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by slackjaw View Post
No, where certainly aren't. I'll never understand people who just throw up there hands and use some ridiculous claim as support to how doomed we are.

In this instance, 12th? Do you believe there are only 11 countries in the industrialized world and that we are way behind #11?
We were 1st in pretty much everything across the board 30 years ago. Are education used to be the best in the world for people of all classes, now it's only good for the rich. And we are falling, and will continue to do so WAY behind in terms of education. The article explicitly says it, what part of "are schools have fallen behind the rest of the world" doesn't stress you?
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:59 PM
 
2,638 posts, read 6,021,530 times
Reputation: 2378
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
And yet over on the education forum, many people argue against college education.
Only because it's a commodity here.

In other areas it's lauded and elevated as an accomplishment. Other countries know how to prioritize jobs that really do need a college degree to perform the job. Additionally, they understand that some jobs can be self-taught and those people can prove they are as capable if not more so than their college-educated counterparts.

In the U.S., nearly every position asks for a 4 year degree. Even silly jobs like Customer Service and woodworking. If every job wants a high-end degree, it lessens the perceived value of getting one into a commodity that people scramble over; then when they get it, all of a sudden people want "experience". Well...most people who go to college straight out of high school don't also work, so they get stuck with a piece of paper that's useless. U.S. Companies are using the degree as an excuse not to hire otherwise qualified candidates.
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Old 08-07-2010, 07:08 PM
 
3,709 posts, read 4,628,778 times
Reputation: 1671
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Obviously they are not factored in, since there is no records of them being residents.
So, they are handled as if they don't exist. I am sure liberals compiled the data, then.
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