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how many of you have been to a muslim country?
how many of you have left your small town or county?
how many of you know there are people in this world who are not Christian fundamentalists?
how many of you know we are a pluralistic society by tradition and by established Constitutional precedents?
how many of you have been to Manhattan?
how many of you have spoken with a non Christian?
how many of you have non-Christian friends?
how many of you have met a muslim?
how many of you conversed with a muslim?
how many of you have attended a serive as a mosque?
how many of you have thought for yourself?
how many of you question authority?
how many of you scrutinize what you hear and read?
how many of you blindly follow your leaders?
how many of you believe in the Constitution?
how many of you have been to a muslim country?
how many of you have left your small town or county?
how many of you know there are people in this world who are not Christian fundamentalists?
how many of you know we are a pluralistic society by tradition and by established Constitutional precedents?
how many of you have been to Manhattan?
how many of you have spoken with a non Christian?
how many of you have non-Christian friends?
how many of you have met a muslim?
how many of you conversed with a muslim?
how many of you have attended a serive as a mosque?
how many of you have thought for yourself?
how many of you question authority?
how many of you scrutinize what you hear and read?
how many of you blindly follow your leaders?
how many of you believe in the Constitution?
Please ask muslims in the middle east and Saudi Arabia and Syria and Iran and elsewhere...please ask them the same thing...
It's about cultural preservation...self preservation...and even religious preservation...all things muslims in the middle east enforce to the T....
but somehow those living in America are made to feel they must accept and swallow anything that comes their way, even if it means self destruction...
This is not PBS...this is not National Public Radio....
These people, these Americans, have a right to defend their homeland as they see fit....
Just as Iranians do...do you ask Iranians to be more tolerant of Jews?
This whole thing has a snake oilsman feel to it...
Asking people to except those who want to destroy them....get real...
Please ask muslims in the middle east and Saudi Arabia and Syria and Iran and elsewhere...please ask them the same thing...
It's about cultural preservation...self preservation...and even religious preservation...all things muslims in the middle east enforce to the T....
but somehow those living in America are made to feel they must accept and swallow anything that comes their way, even if it means self destruction...
This is not PBS...this is not National Public Radio....
These people, these Americans, have a right to defend their homeland as they see fit....
Just as Iranians do...do you ask Iranians to be more tolerant of Jews?
This whole thing has a snake oilsman feel to it...
Asking people to except those who want to destroy them....get real...
It's not even done that way on the streets...
I wonder why I would have no problem with a Hindus, Sikh, Buddhist, or any other religion building a temple near Ground Zero. Maybe it is because they are not trying to build a monument to their greatest victory in their war against the infidels?
Please ask muslims in the middle east and Saudi Arabia and Syria and Iran and elsewhere...please ask them the same thing...
It's about cultural preservation...self preservation...and even religious preservation...all things muslims in the middle east enforce to the T....
but somehow those living in America are made to feel they must accept and swallow anything that comes their way, even if it means self destruction...
This is not PBS...this is not National Public Radio....
These people, these Americans, have a right to defend their homeland as they see fit....
Just as Iranians do...do you ask Iranians to be more tolerant of Jews?
This whole thing has a snake oilsman feel to it...
Asking people to except those who want to destroy them....get real...
It's not even done that way on the streets...
I don't give a flying **** what happens in Saudi arabia, or Syria or Egypt or Iran. I do however a give a **** what happens in MY/OUR country-THIS country, America.
Let Saudi Arabia continue with its policies, let Syria contiue with their's. But let America continue with it's. Our policy is religious freedom and pluralism.
It is that policy which is under attack by people like you and the religious right, Christian fundamentalists.
You say it's about cultural preservation. What exactly is American culture anyway? Please expound that idea. Is it white protestant America? Is it Italian/Irish Catholic America? Is it hispanic America? Is it Chinese America? Is it Muslim/Arabic America? Is is gay America? Is it black America?
See, each of those things represnts but one aspect of our nation. Each of those things separates us from Saudi Arabia, from Syria. They as soverign nations may do as they see fit. And we as a soverign nation may do as we see fit. And what we see fit, is enshrined in our Constitution. The free practice of one's faith. That is our cultural preservation.
If you knew anything of history, and the history of our nation, you would know how absurdly xenophobic you sound. But it's a noise that's been played ad nauseum by people in this country every generation. And guess what, people like you ALWAYS lose. Because the Constitution always wins. In that document, in the tradition and founding principles of the republic, there is no room for your's or anyone else's tyranny.
You never see any apologies for the sidewalk cafe bombings or for the WTC. Never are the so-called radical Muslims excommunicated for their acts. It's one thing to insist they are some separate branch of Islam - but never does Islam try to severe that so-called radical branch from Islam.
Do you actually believe these things... or do you just regurgitate whatever you hear that fits your prejudice?
Here... this is from another thread here on C-D:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingsy
Perhaps because the media doesn't feel those stories will draw in viewers?
Muslims march to protest terrorism - Aftenposten - News in English - Aftenposten.no (http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article924678.ece - broken link)
http://www.freep.com/article/20100722/NEWS02/100722046/Lawyer-to-hold-rally-for-Christian-missionaries (broken link) (this one is quite interesting - a Muslim attorney hosting a rally to protest the arrest of 4 Christians here in the US who were arrested for rallying AGAINST Islam and promoting hate speech AGAINST Islam at an Arab American festival)
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/07/us/07religion.html (which explains a bit about how peaceful sects of Islam are persecuted by violent fundamentalist sects, and what the peaceful sects are trying to do about it... Islam, like Christianity, has multiple sects/denominations)
And for the record - Islam, like Hinduism and Buddhism for example, doesn't actually have excommunication... the closest they have is something called takfir. Islam also doesn't have a central ruling body... the Catholic church has the Vatican, most Christian denominations have a central authority, Jews have Rabbinical courts, etc.
Islam isn't set up that way. It's not broken down into denominations (Methodist, Lutheran, UCC, UU, Episcopalian, etc.) wherein each has an authoritative body.
This, unfortunately, contributes to the problem of ignorant people lumping all Muslims in together... because there aren't existing sects who can condemn the actions of another sect the way most Westerners are familiar with.
Do you actually believe these things... or do you just regurgitate whatever you hear that fits your prejudice?
Here... this is from another thread here on C-D:
And for the record - Islam, like Hinduism and Buddhism for example, doesn't actually have excommunication... the closest they have is something called takfir. Islam also doesn't have a central ruling body... the Catholic church has the Vatican, most Christian denominations have a central authority, Jews have Rabbinical courts, etc.
Islam isn't set up that way. It's not broken down into denominations (Methodist, Lutheran, UCC, UU, Episcopalian, etc.) wherein each has an authoritative body.
This, unfortunately, contributes to the problem of ignorant people lumping all Muslims in together... because there aren't existing sects who can condemn the actions of another sect the way most Westerners are familiar with.
Islam has no sects you say? What about Sunni, Shia, Sufis, and many other denominations/sects across the Islamic world.
I'm gonna make a point about Christianity, and kudos to those of who understand why I'm gonna say this.
___________ There maybe several hundred denominations of Christianity, but there is only one that counts: the Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic church.
The Holy Roman Catholic Church, founded through the Apostles in the name of Christ.
The rest of you are pretty much heretics...
See, I'm Catholic, so I must be right. I must know what's best when it comes to Christianity. I pray and worship in a church that is unbroken since the days of Christ himself. So I and my fellow 1 billion Catholics are the only people who are an authority on Christianity.
______
Now subsitute some words in for Christian, Catholic, heretic....and you pretty much can assume every problem that exists in the world.
Islam has no sects you say? What about Sunni, Shia, Sufis, and many other denominations/sects across the Islamic world.
You're right, Bostonian... I should have been more clear. My "the way most Westerners are familiar with" wasn't really enough of an explanation.
I suppose it's because I've spent too much time listening to how many of them think of these different schools of tradition versus how we think of our denominations... that I see a major difference.
And I should know better than to leave a comment like that wide open... because unfortunately, most here won't actually take the time to familiarize themselves with how Muslims structure their religion and their beliefs... or to understand how that differs from what most of us are familiar with.
Muslims, not Americans, are religious bigots | Washington Examiner (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/Muslims-not-Americans-are-religious-bigots--101125989.html - broken link)
This new argument from the Left that America must "prove" it is not religiously bigoted toward Islam by allowing this disgraceful mosque oh sorry, community center, to be built near Ground Zero, is bogus. America proves it every day in the thousands of mosques that have already been built here peacefully and by the fact that there have been no acts of violence against the many thousands of Muslims who live here after one of their freaks murders innocents in the name of Islam (e.g. Ford Hood murderer).
As far as I'm concerned, it is Islam that must prove to the rest of the world that they are truly peaceful and not religiously bigoted against 'infidels'.
As far as I can tell, Islam has proven itself to be an epic FAIL in that department.
"Off with your heads infidel" I see not intolerance there...just plain ol elimination
Do you actually believe these things... or do you just regurgitate whatever you hear that fits your prejudice?
Here... this is from another thread here on C-D:
And for the record - Islam, like Hinduism and Buddhism for example, doesn't actually have excommunication... the closest they have is something called takfir. Islam also doesn't have a central ruling body... the Catholic church has the Vatican, most Christian denominations have a central authority, Jews have Rabbinical courts, etc.
Islam isn't set up that way. It's not broken down into denominations (Methodist, Lutheran, UCC, UU, Episcopalian, etc.) wherein each has an authoritative body.
This, unfortunately, contributes to the problem of ignorant people lumping all Muslims in together... because there aren't existing sects who can condemn the actions of another sect the way most Westerners are familiar with.
Exactly. Islam doesn't have excommunication and there is no schism like in the Christian world. There aren't various denominations. The radicals belong to Islam every much as those who don't practice it or never read the Koran.
There is no radical Islam mosque versus a mild Islam mosque. Islam is Islam. No matter how American liberals want to define it - it's not like Baptists, Methodists, Catholics.
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