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I am not big on the green movement. It seems everything green related(food, cars, building materials,etc...) is more expensive than non green related products and services.
The green movement does not include a large portion of American citizens, mainly the poor population.
You'll never see a Whole Foods in a poor neighborhood. Just like you probably will not see poor people driving Hybrids.
Is it just another form of classisim?
It is more expensive, because its new.
Just like cars used to be more expensive before Henry Ford found a cheaper alternative, with new manufacturing processes that made them affordable for every American.
Green energy comes down to two very important things.
1. Humans screw things up. Its just that simple. If you've ever done any kind of clean up work for kids, relatives, the general public, hell yourself, you should know that people are just dirty. We leave things lying around, we are terrible stewards of our environments even inside the house.
The less impact we can have on the environment, unless its hurting us, the better correct? Lets work with the planet, not against it. I used to do weeds and seeds in tech school, nasty people, terribly nasty people. We leave crap everywhere, its the same way with our energy needs.
2. Because less human impact is a good thing, green energy is really the way to go. Yes, we can use Nuclear, and I support it. I also support coal, with algae to eat the CO2, or other options. Anything we can do to stimulate "clean coal" is a good thing. We are the worlds Saudi Arabia of coal. China needs it, and they need us because of it. But the ultimate goal would be to have a renewable, clean energy source. The best way to get to peace on Earth is unlimited resources. Thats what Green energy could give us.
Also, lets look at what other countries are doing. China, Europe, and many of our competitors are developing green energy alternative. China is the leading experts on solar production right now. Do we really want them to get there first? Do we want to buy that stuff from China, or have them buy it from us?
Unnecessarily so in some cases. 15 years ago recycled paper towels were cheap. Now they slap a green label on them and they cost more because it's hip to buy green product.
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Also, lets look at what other countries are doing. China, Europe, and many of our competitors are developing green energy alternative. China is the leading experts on solar production right now. Do we really want them to get there first? Do we want to buy that stuff from China, or have them buy it from us?
European countries particularly those heavily invested in renewables have some the highest electric rates, I don't think we need to go down that road. China is doing it for export because we'll pay for it, in the meantime they will build a new coal plant every couple of weeks for their own energy needs.
If they want to go green then get rid of plastic and bring back glass where we can return for a deposit fee. Remember those days ? That's true recycling.
Even recycling is big business these days. We have all those containers for sorting stuff and some companies live on our waste.
Glass is interesting insofar as
a) we are supposed to throw it into glass containers. When doing so, bottles break, i.e. the bits and pieces have to be molten and shaped again, quite a waste of energy in my view.
b) people say glass bottles and jars are not hygienic enough, thus the plastic. I doubt that logic, my grandparents had their basement full of reused bottles with all kinds of self-made content.
I use a roll-on deodorant. The one I use comes in a solid blue glass bottle that would last for ages. The rolling mechanism is also very solid and can be removed. So I wrote to the company whey they don't offer refill liquid so one doesn't have to throw that bottle away. They replied for hygienic reasons As if I were too stupid to clean the whole thing or I drank the deodorant
Not to mention that most of those products (deodorant, shower gel etc.) come in bottles and containers that one cannot place upside down, so one can never use up every last drop of liquid. The lid is always round, I guess on purpose for that very reason.
Glass is interesting insofar as
a) we are supposed to throw it into glass containers. When doing so, bottles break, i.e. the bits and pieces have to be molten and shaped again, quite a waste of energy in my view.
Exactly, glass is pretty worthless as a recycled product. The resources for making it are plentiful. The energy to recycle is more in some cases.
I am not big on the green movement. It seems everything green related(food, cars, building materials,etc...) is more expensive than non green related products and services.
The green movement does not include a large portion of American citizens, mainly the poor population.
You'll never see a Whole Foods in a poor neighborhood. Just like you probably will not see poor people driving Hybrids.
Is it just another form of classisim?
IMO...it is an intelligent person that has embraced the green movement. It takes a certain amount of common sense, logic and intuitivness to comprehend the benefits and the dire need of the planet to do things radically different than we have been since the Industrial Revolution. That being said, it would stand to reason that big corporations would jump on the bandwagon when they observe a fair portion of the population displaying an interest in buying and living "green". I have seen small comapanies that have financially succeeded marketing natural or organic products being bought out by the large corporations. This bothers me as why didn't these larger companies do the right thing before the smaller ones took the intiative? Proctor and Gamble never offered eco-friendly and environmentally safe products until the smaller companies proved that there were people that gave a crap about the eco-system. I try not to buy the copycat product from the fat cats just on principle.
You should buy locally grown produce and locally produced products from smaller companies and support them as opposed the big guys that really never gave a crap about what their stuff was doing to the planet. You do not have to break the bank. There are many non toxic, readily available and inexpensive things that you can you use as cleaning products such as vinegar as opposed to that vile stuff known as fabric softener. Baking soda, lemon juice are among some others that can be used to make household cleaning products. You can make laundry detergent, dish soap and add your own natural frangrances if you prefer. You can even make natural insect repellents using particular herbs such as catnip.
If you stop using commercialy raised and produced meat in your diet and replace it with organic fruits, veggies, grains, legumes, eggs and dairy you will be saving by buying less meat. When you do buy meat, poultry or seafood, try and buy naturally or organically raised. I have not minded the extra cost as if you eat less of these items and replace them with the more vegetarian menu a few times a week, you do actually save money. Quality trumps quantity any day as far as I am concerned.
I do not think that the green movement needs to be a "class" issue if you use your common sense. If more people demand the greener foods, cosmetics, cleaning products, building materials, etc., more of these would be readily available and not novelty products that can be over priced. After all, were our grand parents inundated with the toxic chemicals as we are today? Most of them were not rich, but managed to live a "greener" life without even knowing that they were.
We are a throw-away nation and the sooner more people get with the "green" agenda, the sooner it will become the norm and it will not be trendy and more expensive to live an ecologically responsible life. Educate yourself and your kids. Take a ziploc bag and every time that you are throwing away something "disposable" such as razors or pens, dont...put it in the ziploc and see how fast it fills up. Imagine that in the landfills and how much energy and pollutants went into making the product. Even the plastic thing (does it have a name?) that closes the package of bread. Yep, you need to be smart and you too can be "green" without going broke.
Last edited by sickofnyc; 08-22-2010 at 10:20 AM..
Energy is indeed relatively expensive in parts of Europe. In Germany, which if I am not mistaken has the most solar panels installed, electricity is rather costly. For several reasons. Those producing solar energy and feeding it into the grid get subsidized, which is designed to help spread alternative energy and phase out nuclear power plants and coal mining in the long term. Also, there is a so-called Ökosteuer, a tax on energy consumption, which is supposed to make using energy more expensive and thus make people use less energy.
I saw a business that uses what looks like ground up glass out side its business. Its in an area that would normally have about five feet of grass along the side of the business. That to me is the stupidest use of "recycled" glass. not only will it do a number on your carpets and floors, but why replace grass, Its already "green" They even have a sign up to show how they are saving the planet.
I saw a business that uses what looks like ground up glass out side its business. Its in an area that would normally have about five feet of grass along the side of the business. That to me is the stupidest use of "recycled" glass. not only will it do a number on your carpets and floors, but why replace grass, Its already "green" They even have a sign up to show how they are saving the planet.
Then it will be discovered the glass that was used for the "green" space was originally used to store a toxic chemical and they'll have to remove it all along with so many feet of contaminated soil.
Good thinkin.
IMO...it is an intelligent person that has embraced the green movement. It takes a certain amount of common sense, logic and intuitivness to comprehend the benefits and the dire need of the planet to do things radically different than we have been since the Industrial Revolution. That being said, it would stand to reason that big corporations would jump on the bandwagon when they observe a fair portion of the population displaying an interest in buying and living "green". I have seen small comapanies that have financially succeeded marketing natural or organic products being bought out by the large corporations. This bothers me as why didn't these larger companies do the right thing before the smaller ones took the intiative? Proctor and Gamble never offered eco-friendly and environmentally safe products until the smaller companies proved that there were people that gave a crap about the eco-system. I try not to buy the copycat product from the fat cats just on principle.
You should buy locally grown produce and locally produced products from smaller companies and support them as opposed the big guys that really never gave a crap about what their stuff was doing to the planet. You do not have to break the bank. There are many non toxic, readily available and inexpensive things that you can you use as cleaning products such as vinegar as opposed to that vile stuff known as fabric softener. Baking soda, lemon juice are among some others that can be used to make household cleaning products. You can make laundry detergent, dish soap and add your own natural frangrances if you prefer. You can even make natural insect repellents using particular herbs such as catnip.
If you stop using commercialy raised and produced meat in your diet and replace it with organic fruits, veggies, grains, legumes, eggs and dairy you will be saving by buying less meat. When you do buy meat, poultry or seafood, try and buy naturally or organically raised. I have not minded the extra cost as if you eat less of these items and replace them with the more vegetarian menu a few times a week, you do actually save money. Quality trumps quantity any day as far as I am concerned.
I do not think that the green movement needs to be a "class" issue if you use your common sense. If more people demand the greener foods, cosmetics, cleaning products, building materials, etc., more of these would be readily available and not novelty products that can be over priced. After all, were our grand parents inundated with the toxic chemicals as we are today? Most of them were not rich, but managed to live a "greener" life without even knowing that they were.
We are a throw-away nation and the sooner more people get with the "green" agenda, the sooner it will become the norm and it will not be trendy and more expensive to live an ecologically responsible life. Educate yourself and your kids. Take a ziploc bag and every time that you are throwing away something "disposable" such as razors or pens, dont...put it in the ziploc and see how fast it fills up. Imagine that in the landfills and how much energy and pollutants went into making the product. Even the plastic thing (does it have a name?) that closes the package of bread. Yep, you need to be smart and you too can be "green" without going broke.
Darn right - it's past time to knock some sense into all those planet-killing writers and shavers. Intelligent people do GEICO commercials and write in the sand.
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As if I were too stupid to clean the whole thing or I drank the deodorant 
