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Originally Posted by lucknow
Well GuyNTexas I have to point out a few things to you. Firstly I have to point out that your point about the value of a dollar is totally and completely wrong. Never in the History of either Canada or the USA have things cost less when compared to what you make from your labour. In fact I wish that consumer goods cost a lot more than they do and that might help our societies in so many ways. When I was a kid back in the late fifties my parents were working class people. Both my mom and dad had good jobs. One thing my parents believed in was good shoes for their kids. I always got one pair of Clarks made in Europe shoes per year. They cost $50 at the time. My dad made $2.50 per hour so that works out to 20 hours of work for one pair of shoes. I bought my grandson a pair of clarks for $60 for his birthday in July. The same job my father had would now pay at least $20 per hour but more likely $30. At $20 it would take 3 hours of work to buy those shoes. That my friend is almost a 7 to 1 ratio on the value of my money and labour from 1960 to 2010. This is just one isolated example but it's the same all the way down the line. Food is way way less expensive than it was then. All appliances and electronics cost just a fraction of what they did. Even fuel is way less expensive. Remember when gas was 50 cents a gallon? I do and at 2.50 per hour you could buy 5 gallons of fuel. At 20.00 per hour and fuel at 3 per gallon you can buy 7 gallons. Just about every single item that needs to be purchased today costs less than it ever did so don't give me this crap about the valueless money.
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What we have here ladies and gentlemen is called "don't believe your lying eyes ... believe the statistics that tell you how much better off you are today ... instead."
With over 40 Million households using FOOD STAMPS today ... with an increasing poverty rate ... something just doesn't add up. Lucknow, tells us how we are all making more money and paying less today? Should we believe this? Should we believe that the Dollar is worth more today than it was in the 1950's? Frankly, this is the FIRST TIME Iv'e ever heard anyone claim such nonsense.
The truth of the matter is that the above, as well as the rest of this post is patently absurd ... presenting selective statistics in a failed attempt to declare DOWN is really UP.
Generally, what you will find is a 10 to 1 ratio or more from what things cost in 1950's to 2010 .... with quite a few individual examples of things that actually do, adjusted for inflation, cost less. But those lower cost items are exclusively associated with commodity generally paid for in cash. However, the large ticket items ... houses and cars for example ... things you finance, are a different matter. So too is healthcare .... education, etc., etc. All of the things that have been conspicuously avoided in this declaration of how good things are.
In 1950's, the average income $4,000 (1 earner predominate), average home cost $16,000 ... and an automobile under $2000 (predominate 1 car per household). Hold on to your hat ... in the 1950's the tuition at Penn State $500 ANNUALLY x 4 = $2,000 for a 4 year degree.
Now let's compare:
Income - $48,000 (2 earners predominate/ $25,000 1 earner adjust) (increase = 6 times, adjusted for two wages)
Homes - 2008 - $214,000 (increase = 13.3 times)
Car - $26,000 (increase - 13 times) 2 cars per household (26 times)
College - $24,000 (annually) x 4 = $96,000 (increase = 48 times)
and hold on to that hat .......
Healthcare - Family insurance plan average $13,375.00 per year!!! This is like buying an average home each and every year in 1950's. Or more than three times the annual incomes in the 1950's !!!!!
Average family health insurance policy: $13,375, up 5% - USATODAY.com
Now, for all of the intuitive thinkers out there ... what these big ticket items have done is increase at or exceeding the rate of inflation since the 1950's ... while doubling the rate of increase in income (1 wage earner), and are items which people finance, with finance fees not accounted for here. (this explains why Americans have such a high debt to income ratio today, which is the true measure of financial health and wealth). And it's only been recently .. due to the financial crisis and the bursting of the real estate bubble driving interest rates down to those historic 1950's levels we see today .... in the 1970's through 2000, for those 3 decades, the interest rates were close to or at DOUBLE DIGITS ... not the 5.2% we see now, which to anyone familiar with the subject has a HUGE IMPACT on monthly mortgage payments and TOTAL COST of homes over a 30 year period. (And a huge profit for the gangster bankers).
So I suppose we all should thank our lucky stars that a gallon of milk is actually cheaper today .... but in the 50's, that milk was delivered FRESH to your door (like a newspaper) and it was not the crap sold in grocery stores today. I wonder what the cost of delivery would do to the total cost of a gallon of milk? Call UPS and ask them what it would cost to ship a gallon of milk in cold packaging) ... probably would drive that cost to $20+ a gallon (or 30 times what it cost in 1950).
And I suppose it's also good that gas is actually less expensive since we often have to buy twice as much of it to fuel 2 cars instead of one, as with all of the other expenses that entail having two automobiles rather than one.
Then, we take into account the ASTRONOMICAL increases in healthcare cost, which used to be negligible .... and now costs an average family so much, it's almost like a 2nd mortgage ... so I guess we must factor that into the equation ... along with the COUNTLESS fees and excise taxes on EVERYTHING ... those items that make that $49 phone bill of yours actually cost $68.87 (30% tax). And what used to be free ... TV ... now is paid for in cable costs, along with it's 30% additional fees and taxes piled on top.
Then there are the other 30 or 40 fees and excise taxes that you pay today ... piggy backed on water ... electricity ... etc., which also range between 10-30%. License fees ... registration fees ... inspection fees ... emissions testing fees ... all TIMES 2 for the cars and drivers.
We've seen a dramatic increase in SS withholdings .... what used to be a couple of bucks per pay period ... now can exceed that which is withheld in State Income Taxes, Country Income Taxes, and after it is all said and done .... Sales taxes (Texas = 8.25%). Double taxed, triple taxed, Quadruple taxed .... and the old joke used to be ... "they'd tax the air we breathe if they could figure out a way" ... well, that joke is not a joke anymore ... with the criminals in Washington DC wanting a CO2 tax for the global warming fraud. Technically, it's not taxing the air you breathe, more like taxing the air you exhale ... but I really don't think the difference is worth mentioning.
But hey ... life is good ... so quit yer btching .... you never had it so good!
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Originally Posted by lucknow
You damn the fed and the central bankers but without them your currency would be truly worthless. You tell me how a nation that has had a horrendous balance of trade and payments for umpteen years running has a currency that has any value at all??? Added on to that is a government that spends and spends and spends making the USA the greatest debtor nation in history by far. If it was any other country but the USA the money would be worthless and you would truly have to pay in gold. Those at the fed are wizards and they convince the rest of the world of the underlaying value of the dollar and that is all the value of anything is based on. Confedence in the debtors ability to pay. I have tried to study and understand economics and have come to the conclusion the nobody really understands it. There are so many conflicting theories and practicies that it makes ones head spin trying to make heads of tails of all the different ideas.
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It's really not all that complex. When broken down into plain english, an elementary school child should be able to grasp the concepts ... it's nothing more than garden variety FRAUD.
The Central Bankers have destroyed the value of the dollar, step by step, year by year, and have looted the American economy. Better than I could possibly explain ... you ought to read the book "Creature from Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin. That will give you the foundation for understanding the Federal Reserve .. how it was created in secrecy, and designed to do EXACTLY what it has managed to do ... which is control the United States of America through the issuance and control of it's currency.
Your statements bolded above simply show that you don't understand what your own eyes see. The FED created the environment which has destroyed the value of the dollar and the reckless deficit spending because they collect interest on every dollar created and "loaned" to the US Government. And after the US Dollar was no longer backed by gold ... and after silver was removed from circulation as money ... what was left was a Dollar that was not a dollar ... it was a counterfeit. And just because the criminals in congress pass laws that allow this counterfeiting to continue, doesn't make it any less of a fraud.
The first question that even the most simple minded should ask is why does the US Government borrow it's own money from a group of private bankers and pay them interest on those "loans"? It's ridiculously just that simple. The answer is equally ridiculous. Because, in 1913, a group of these criminals conspired with criminals elected to congress and an idiot president (Woodrow Wilson) to pass a law (Federal Reserve Act) giving them the power to control the US monetary system ... I suppose under the guise of them expert bankers being more qualified to take on such a monumental task. So, like a child that cannot be trusted with his own allowance ... we gave the Federal Reserve Crooks total control of our bank account that we were apparently too stupid to be trusted to manage ourselves. Unfortunately, those bankers really don't care about our best financial interests nearly as much as they are concerned about their own. So, given that they make money on every dollar we "borrow" from them ... the more the US government spends, the more the FED makes. Now, under those circumstances would you expect these crooks to discourage spending or encourage it? Would you expect their monetary policies to encourage a balanced budget or deficit spending? Would you expect them to promote peace or war? Come on ... not tough questions. The answer is obvious.
This set the stage for the extreme spending and budget deficits that have existed since I was born in 1957 ... the last year that the US government was actually in the black. Since then, the national debt has climbed to almost 14 Trillion, several Trillion in just the past 3 years going directly to the banker gangsters themselves ... moneys that the public is said to owe, including interest on each dollar directly to the FED. And it was the FED that doled out all of the dough to their banker buddies .. while refusing to tell congress who they gave it to and how much.
But you are right in that they are "Wizards" in their ability to convince the world (and the US public) to accept worthless, counterfeit paper instead of real money. But you'd also be correct in replacing the word "Wizard" with the word "Racketeer" .. "Crook" ... "Con Man" or "Criminal" too.
To explain this in even more simplistic terms ... there is a reason why the treasury goes to such lengths to create money that isn't easily duplicated and counterfeited. It's why the treasury department has a division for just such counterfeiting crimes ... and harsh penalties for doing so. They understand that the more money that is created out of thin air ... the less value all of the money has ... so they don't want "criminals" or "criminal countries" to make their own US Federal Reserve Dollars and flood the system with them, because it would destroy the value of the dollar.
This is why Ron Paul has a sign in his office that says "Don't Steal .. the Government doesn't like competition".
The Federal Reserve Act is not really a law as much as it is a license to counterfeit ... and to collect interest on every counterfeit dollar created. It's a fraud atop a fraud, making a gigantic fraud. And as they continue to create more money out of thin air, the currency continues to lose value.
The Federal Reserve is simply and purely the largest counterfeiting operation in the history of the world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucknow
How about this idea. It would be a very good thing for the American dollar to lose 25% of it's value against the other currencies right this minute. It would be the biggest stimulus the country has ever seen. It would cause all imports to rise in price 25% thereby making it profitable to make everything you consume right in the USA. there would be zero unemployment. All debts to be paid in American dollars would be discounted 25%. The nation would be flooded with foreign investment because everything in the country would become a good deal for those who now had 25% more money to spend. The Chinese built their entire economy based on this very idea. Why do you think the Chinese intervene in the money markets to push up the dollar every time it looks like it's going down a cent or two?
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And just a minute ago, you seemed confused about all of this economic "stuff". I think they may have a high level position waiting for you at the Federal Reserve ...another fvking Alan Greenspan you are!!!
Let me restate what you just said in more straight forward terms ... why not just take 25% of everyone's total net worth ... 25% of EVERYTHING ... and give it to the bankers. That is what you just said .. even though you may not realize it. I've got an even better idea .... why don't we create 30 Trillion more dollars and give every man woman and child in America a cool 1 Million in cash!! Then everyone would be a Millionaire, and we could all stop worrying about mortgages, and bills, and so forth? How bout that? No more financial worries .. no more class warfare ... no haves and have nots ... no more poverty ... no need for welfare, food stamps ... public housing ... and there would be a spending spree that would make the post war economic boom of the 50's look like a yard sale.
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Originally Posted by lucknow
Canada has been doing it for a long time too and every time our currency goes up it hurts us really badly. In the last 20 years or so our money has increased in value against the American dollar almost 40% and if it were not for great increase in productivity we would be dead in the water. That is the only benefit of our increasing value looney. Another benefit I suppose is that Canadian firns have started buying up American firms because it's good value at the moment anyways.
You go on and on about the need to base your currency against something of value like Gold. As has been already pointed out if that was the case the amazing growth in the worlds economy since the end of WW2 just would not have happened. Can you imagine this. Men toil and work and invest to bring up gold from the earth just to put it back underground into a vault somewhere. What nonsence.
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It is nonsense. All that gold men toil to bring out of the ground ... and hand it over to bankers who trade worthless pieces of paper for it that take way less effort to create (much of which are simple digits input on a computer terminal), and then they stash it into their vaults. I wonder why they do that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucknow
This rise in the value of gold though is good for my province. We have old gold mines all over the place that are reopening because all of a sudden they will be profitable and this is a real boon to northern Ontario where jobs are scarce. It makes me laugh though to think that this gold will end up in some vault under bay street LOL.
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Correction ... gold is not rising in value .. it's the paper money that is losing value which requires more of it to buy the same amount of gold. It's also the same mechanism which drives the prices of everything you need to survive up as well, including energy and food .. and that's not good for the vast majority, especially those unemployed or the elderly on fixed incomes, or the hundreds of Millions worldwide that live in abject poverty.
And ... just a small incremental increase in food prices may equate to an inconvenience at the grocery store for you, but to others may spell in death from starvation. But hey ... who cares ... as long as YOUR PROVINCE benefits from the crimes, am I right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucknow
Well I have lots more to say about your posts but that's quite enough for now I suppose, I want to go and check on my gold stocks.
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I'm sure you do ... hopefully it will make more sense than your past efforts.
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