How come racism, for the most part, is still associated only with whites? (Alabama, Sudanese)

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by jerseygal4u

I'm wasn't for or against your arguments but to say black africans owned slaves is off. As I said,Arabs and berbers,both white ethnic groups, and the turks(white too) had whites as slaves.

To say black Africans owned slaves is off? That statement goes against all recorded history and is a fallacy. Black Africans owns Black Africans to a WIDESPREAD degree, as well as taking part in owning whites as slaves.

THat is just history.

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by jerseygal4u

In those lands it was very likely that the turks had the money to buy the slave,and the turks lived in Ethiopia and the Sudan. Balcks were made slaves in those lands too. You do realize the sudan is 50% arab? Its not like they gave blacks rights. As a matter of fact,they wouldn't have black slaves now in Sudan if blacks were equal to them,right?

So in short,whites and blacks were both slaves of the Arabs.

YOU:
In those lands it was very likely that the turks had the money to buy the slave,and the turks lived in Ethiopia and the Sudan.
ME:
The fact of the matter is that the Ottoman Empire is known to have spread their slaves across the world. SOME Turks lived in those lands, but they were PREDOMINATELY obviously populated by their native peoples. That contradicts your theory to minimize the damage.

YOU:
Balcks were made slaves in those lands too. You do realize the sudan is 50% arab
ME:
Even using your numbers, that means its 50% black,no? Exactly.

YOU:
Its not like they gave blacks rights. As a matter of fact,they wouldn't have black slaves now in Sudan if blacks were equal to them,right?
ME:
The liberal mods hate it when I bust liberals, but this is another example of liberals not knowing the facts. Its a RELIGIOUS issue there, and there and MANY Black Muslims. Again the facts contradict your theory. This is hundreds of years later.

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by mistygrl092

Historically, this is the way it's been. And I say this as a descendant of very WHITE northern Europeans. Argue all you want, those are the facts.

It is the WHITE MEN of the world, in recent decades, who have had the pomposity to launch wars. No one else.

So, the Rwanda Genocide, the Congo civil war, the Sudanese civil war, the ongoing confict in East Timor, the ongoing civil war in Columbia, and of the other dozens of wars happening at any given time in Africa, what about WWII itself, essentially started by the Japanese by invading China? Have you heard of WWII? The Korean war, still officially on by the way ....how do you account for all of those in your theory?

[expect]

Originally Posted by speakingtruth

Wow, at this point, I have to wonder about your reasoning skills. First, lets state how you are trying to divert attention away from the FACT that Africans enslaved Europeans BEFORE Europeans enslaved, or rather bought from, Africans from Africans. The overall point is that slavery is far from unique to one group. When society acknowledges that, the ability for some on the fat Left to continue to use guilt as a weapon becomes non-existant. But, you know that, which is why you are trying to fight the spread of knowledge of history.


First, you qouted numbers of 1 million vs 12 million are the low estimation and the high estimation, and thus not reliable. Second, the 1 million has to be viewed through its percentage of population. The population of the world was much smaller when the African Barbary pirates started their conquests, and thus a greater share of the population. Refined further, it was harder to achieve that 1 million number as there were less people on the planet. Each passing century brought population explosions, and longer life spans. But you knew that, right?

Your next whole diatriabe:

"
because pirates were coming to the new world, wiping out north american natives, central and south american natives right?
pirates were enslaving people in the united states
pirates interned innocent japanese americans during world war II
pirates were hosing down and lynching blacks, denying them the right to vote, attend the same schools, eat at the same restaurants
it was pirates discriminating against the italians, irish, jews in new york city
so weird how white people are associated with racism. how could that idea ever form in people's minds, where do they get it from"

is irrelevant. The point is, if you want to play the historical race blame game, is that Africans actually started it FIRST. In fact, the Trans-Atlantic slave trade which you are talking about, was really just an extension of the existing slave trade that always existed in Africa, AND WAS CONTROLLED BY AFRICANS. The fact that you want to pin the blame on one racial group is both historically inaccurate and morally inconsistent. However, to destory your arguement some more, lets delve further:

YOU:
because pirates were coming to the new world, wiping out north american natives, central and south american natives right?
ME:
Never said they did, its out of scope of the point I made. It also doesn't address the fact that African Muslims enslaved Whites in mass numbers. You are trying to distract the issue, and wont get away with it.

YOU:
pirates were enslaving people in the united states
ME:
Again, see above, and I never made this arguement. You are employing what is known as a "straw man" arguement.
YOU:
pirates interned innocent japanese americans during world war II
ME:
See above
pirates were hosing down and lynching blacks, denying them the right to vote, attend the same schools, eat at the same restaurants
YOU:
See above
it was pirates discriminating against the italians, irish, jews in new york city

YOU:
so weird how white people are associated with racism. how could that idea ever form in people's minds, where do they get it from
ME:
Ah...the mind of a liberal. Notice this part: your use of the term "white people". First, you don't put a qualifier there, differentiating a percentage less than the whole. I know you're a liberal, so I will translate. Not all white people did the transgressions you've described, and this, not responsible. But you used an all-encompassing term: WHITE PEOPLE. That makes your arguement wrong on thefacts and immoral. For you to try and present a case that whites are racists, you need to establish that they either ALL do it, or that said behavior is unique to their population.

The single fact alone that racism and slavery have existed basically as long as their have been in the case of racism, different races, and in the case of slavery, human beings, negates your entire arguement. In short, you failed.


I will continue to tell people about the Barbary Pirates, and the fact that Whites do not have some kind of historical lock on slavery. My guess is taht it will continue to annoy the *** out of you. And there is not a thing you can do about it.

lol@ all this garbage
one- im not a liberal, 2 the topic title itself says "whites'' therefore the term "white people" can be used
[mod]Personal attack[mod]
lastly, you can tell everybody you want about the "barbary pirates".. as if anybody with any sense will suddenly change their minds lol

look at the effect WHITE europeans had on the new world and every civilization from north to south. the entire canadian and US native population, the Caribbean, central and south america.. was it the "barbary pirates" almost wiping out the american natives? was it the "barbary pirates" wiping out the olmec, aztecs, and almost all mesoamerican tribes and cultures?
was it barbary pirates burning centuries worth of Mayan advances in science and mathematics? forcing them to convert to "christianity" and burning them at the stake if they didn't convert?
wiping out their language and culture by killing them if they continued to practice their customs?
i don't know of any mass killings performed by barbary pirates in the great plains, i dont know of any torture and killings caused by the barbary pirates in mexico, guatemala, and the rest of central america


this entire continent has been raped by white europeans, period. only a fool would ask why racism is associated with whites. pick a country.. england, spain, portugal, france. centuries of killings and rapings aren't easy to forget
oh wait the barbary pirates went on and raped and killed entire cultures and continents right? yea you got me there

[expect]

again very simply, what other people have done what white europeans did to the new world in this scale..
canada- english
usa-english
central and south america- spanish and portuguese

natives make up less than 1% of the entire US population. what happened to them? did they disappear into thin air? did barbary pirates come and kill them? aliens?
just 10% of the mexican population is indigenous. where'd they go? did japanese conquistadors come and kill them? nigerian conquistadors?
1% of the population in el salvador is indigenous.
puerto rico= 0.4%
1% in argentina
what group of people is responsible for their downfall?
here are some choices:
a) The Chinese
b) Somalians
c) Europeans
d) aliens
e) vampires
f) terrorists

[Avengerfire]

Originally Posted by city_data91

...Example: If a white person says they don't like a certain black person, people would take that to mean he's racist and hates all blacks. When really, it just means he doesn't like that particular black person, and race has nothing to do with it.

That is exactly what is being employed against people that criticize Obama.

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by expect

lol@ all this garbage
one- im not a liberal, 2 the topic title itself says "whites'' therefore the term "white people" can be used
Moderator cut: Personal attack
lastly, you can tell everybody you want about the "barbary pirates".. as if anybody with any sense will suddenly change their minds lol

look at the effect WHITE europeans had on the new world and every civilization from north to south. the entire canadian and US native population, the Caribbean, central and south america.. was it the "barbary pirates" almost wiping out the american natives? was it the "barbary pirates" wiping out the olmec, aztecs, and almost all mesoamerican tribes and cultures?
was it barbary pirates burning centuries worth of Mayan advances in science and mathematics? forcing them to convert to "christianity" and burning them at the stake if they didn't convert?
wiping out their language and culture by killing them if they continued to practice their customs?
i don't know of any mass killings performed by barbary pirates in the great plains, i dont know of any torture and killings caused by the barbary pirates in mexico, guatemala, and the rest of central america


this entire continent has been raped by white europeans, period. only a fool would ask why racism is associated with whites. pick a country.. england, spain, portugal, france. centuries of killings and rapings aren't easy to forget
oh wait the barbary pirates went on and raped and killed entire cultures and continents right? yea you got me there

AAAAAAAA HAHAHAHA! Wow man, you really know how to avoid an arguement and try to prop up the straw man. By trying to recast the arguement as you want it, you avoid the facts as they are. Simply put, the facts slay your arguement. The issue of racism isn't decided by North America alone. That alone makes you ethnocentric,and isn't that bad? The fact that Africans owned white slaves BEFORE whites owned Black slaves alone kills your arguement and establishes the FACT that this issue isn't a white issue. You've studiously avoided addresses that head on. All of your garbage about specific examples of injustices in North America. I never said those examples happened in North America, so your questions are irrelevant. I can easily be countered by examples such as:

*It wasn't Whites that started the slave trade in Nigeria, or Congo, or Sudan, it was people of color. That happened long before your examples even existed.
*It wasn't whites that enslaved Chinese and Phillipines, and started rape camps,it was people of color.
*It isn't white people running slavery TODAY in Sudan, it is people of color.
*It wasn't whites capturing non-Muslims and forcing them to convert to Islam, it was the Ottoman Empire, which sold those Whites to many non-whites.
*It isn't whites in Japan that look at whites and blacks as less than Japanese, as they feel the Japanese are the master race, those are people of color.
*It wasn't whites that ran MASS KILLINGS AND ATTEMPTED GENOCIDE at the RAPE OF NANKING. Those were people of color.

I could go on and on and on and on. CENTURIES OF HISTORY are hard to deny.

Moderator cut: Personal attack

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by expect

again very simply, what other people have done what white europeans did to the new world in this scale..
canada- english
usa-english
central and south america- spanish and portuguese

natives make up less than 1% of the entire US population. what happened to them? did they disappear into thin air? did barbary pirates come and kill them? aliens?
just 10% of the mexican population is indigenous. where'd they go? did japanese conquistadors come and kill them? nigerian conquistadors?
1% of the population in el salvador is indigenous.
puerto rico= 0.4%
1% in argentina
what group of people is responsible for their downfall?
here are some choices:
a) The Chinese
b) Somalians
c) Europeans
d) aliens
e) vampires
f) terrorists

I'll make it through your non-linear linguistics, but it seems you are attempting to re-frame the arguement into an example you can't lose. If you think I denied the plight of Native Americans, here is a DIRECT CHALLENGE: Provide a qoute from me denying the blight of Native Americans. Please show it to both me and the other posters. If you cannot, you reveal that you are essentially putting words in my mouth, trying to assign an arguement to me that I did not hold.

Good luck on that. You won't, because I never made such an arguement. You try and do it to recast the debate. Sorry, I wont let that happen. Oh yeah, dont think your tactic of trying to use humor is going to get anywhere. Unless you can show I made such an arguement, all of your bizarre mutliple choice formulaic style is irrelevant.

[expect]

the question of this thread simply asks why WHITES are still mainly associated with racism

the answer is simple and self evident. what group of people came to this continent to rape and kill almost every indigenous culture.. you can type up a storm about barbary pirates.. or something that happened across the world 500 years ago
the answer is simple. WHITE EUROPEANS came to the americas and raped and killed their way to prominence.

again, the question: why is racism associated only with whites?
answer: because of what they did to THIS continent. what would a black person living in alabama in the 1960's know about barbary pirates? what would people in this country being terrorized by WHITES care about something that happened centuries ago?
personal experiences create that view in people's minds. put those 3 brain cells to good use. if you were being ostracized and lynched by whites, who would you associate racism with?

but yea keep reassuring yourself that your barbary pirates "arguement" is enough to counter an entire continent's experiences with whites. lol

[speakingtruth]

Originally Posted by expect

"arguement"

the question of this thread simply asks why WHITES are still mainly associated with racism

the answer is simple and self evident. what group of people came to this continent to rape and kill almost every indigenous culture.. you can type up a storm about barbary pirates.. or something that happened across the world 500 years ago
the answer is simple. WHITE EUROPEANS came to the americas and raped and killed their way to prominence.

again, the question: why is racism associated only with whites?
answer: because of what they did to THIS continent. what would a black person living in alabama in the 1960's know about barbary pirates? what would people in this country being terrorized by WHITES care about something that happened centuries ago?
personal experiences create that view in people's minds. put those 3 brain cells to good use. if you were being ostracized and lynched by whites, who would you associate racism with?

but yea keep reassuring yourself that your barbary pirates "arguement" is enough to counter an entire continent's experiences with whites. lol

I notice, you avoided the particular FACTS of my debate, but pick on a typo. FYI, I both type VERY fast, and was Dean's List. It must burn your pride you've lost this political argument on the FACTS and LOGIC.

Onward? Onward:

YOU:
the question of this thread simply asks why WHITES are still mainly associated with racism
ME:
Yes, exactly, and to properly answer the question, one needs to explore all of the relevant facts. A relevant question is, have other racial groups engaged in behavior that qualifies them to earn the term "racism". By looking through history, such as the history you use to slander an entire race of people, then the answer is simply yes. Examples? Re-read my posts. Google the examples provided.

YOU:
the answer is simple and self evident. what group of people came to this continent to rape and kill almost every indigenous culture..
ME:
Actually, not to be a stickler, or to excuse any untoward behavior, but the Europeans didn't come to the Americas to engage in that behavior, that behavior followed upon the clash of two civilizations. I am in no way justifying slavery, Jim Crow, etc, or the horrible treatment of Native Americans. However, it was not their goal, as common sense would have it. Their goal was westward expansion. But why let common sense get in the way when you're brainwashed by your tenured Leftist professor. Also, how is what they did worse morally than what the Barbary Pirates did, or the Nigerian, or Congolese, or Sudanese Slave Traders? I notice you never answered that question.

YOU:
you can type up a storm about barbary pirates.. or something that happened across the world 500 years ago
ME:
First, you seem angry, but your use of the term "type up a storm". Do you resent a different narrative, based in history, that actually sheds light on the HISTORICAL FACT that not only Whites have engaged in racist behavior? Could it be because it gets in the way of your offensive weapon known as the race/victim card? NAWWWW....couldn't be.

Also, you cite the period, 500 years. Is it not the logical equivalant, when you gave your own history dating almost from the same time period? You contradicted your own argument. What one racial group did in history is every bit as relevant as what another one did. Also, the date is irrelevant: either a racial group did what it is accused of, or it didn't. The fact is the examples I've given happened. By using historical examples, you opened the door for others to do the same.

Unless, of course, you weren't prepared for someone that can actually debate, and stand up to your race card.

YOU:
the answer is simple. WHITE EUROPEANS came to the americas and raped and killed their way to prominence.
ME:
Actually, your answer is based off a false premise of a question. To properly ascertain whether or not whites are more racist than another one needs to delve through history. But you knew that, right? Also, your use of all-encompassing terms reveals your racism. Not all WHITE EUROPEANS were or are the same. Some came here and did not engage in said behavior, while others did. Actually, I notice you can't stand it when I bring up the HISTORICAL FACT that the Barbary people (the term pirates is what stuck through history, truth is, they existed all over the Med sea AND North Africa) did exactly what you are accusing Whites of.

YOU:
again, the question: why is racism associated only with whites?
answer: because of what they did to THIS continent. what would a black person living in alabama in the 1960's know about barbary pirates?
ME:
Again, you need to read above. The scope of the discussion encompasses more than your American-centric views and knowledge base. Also, with all due respect, the discussion isn't limited to what a black person from Alabama knows. Furthermore, who are you to assume what they know? I actually think you are selling them short. It entails the proper logical process and historical examples to answer the question.

YOU:
what would people in this country being terrorized by WHITES care about something that happened centuries ago?
ME:
Because its relevant to the question.

YOU:
personal experiences create that view in people's minds.

ME:
I've handled you in this discussion,and unlike you, I dont need to resort to personal attacks. I am not the one avoided direct logical argument and historical examples. OK, this gets really good, and again, you reveal why you've list this debate:

YOU:
if you were being ostracized and lynched by whites, who would you associate racism with?
ME:
In that case, I would associate it with whites. But then again, the question isn't defined by just whites against blacks, its also a matter of blacks against whites, and all races considered. In short, the question doesn't revolve around just blacks. An easy counter to that question is: If you were a white person in 1490 being sold into slavery because of the imperialistic behaviors of Muslim Africans, who would YOU associate with racism and cultural warfare?

YOU:
but yea keep reassuring yourself that your barbary pirates "arguement" is enough to counter an entire continent's experiences with whites
ME:
The vehement anger you've expressed at the sheer thought that a diverse, well rounded, relevant discussion of inter-racial violence would take place, shows the potency of my discussion. To answer your question, I never said that discussing the Barbary Pirates would counter an entire continent's experience with whites. Thats your straw man of an argument, and never answered the question. You're petty attempts to put words in my mouth won't work. Oh yeah, I won't stop killing the race card and standing up to the Left's racism. No matter how much it bugs you.

I also notice you avoided my DIRECT CHALLENGE. I'm sure other posters did too. I won. Night night.