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I hope I'm just misunderstanding you here. Radiology is a competitive specialty that isn't easy to match into. Lifestyle for a radiologist might be considered less demanding than some other specialties, however the typical applicant for a radiology residency slot is definitely not going to be a "lesser performing student". (If you meant radiology tech then ignore all of this)
I'm not trying to insult other professions. I'm just pointing out how the rigors of medical school far exceed many other health care professions and often times medical school flunkies get redirected. Some that have aspergers mentalities really have no business being proximal to patients so they're better suited for lab work or research. Takes all kinds to make the world turn is what I'm getting at. I'm not qualified for the olympics or for rocket science and there's no shame in admitting that fact. I have other gifts and serve humanity in a different way is all.
I had an organ removed due to a 'mistake' at a teaching hospital, so I've experienced bad medicine first hand.
If you want a feel good doctor, go for it. I've had enough of those... from my experience they simply don't have the cajones (if you will) to stand up for their patients in times of need. They don't have the urgency that other doctors have and I prefer not to deal with them.
I had a 'feel good' doctor that I fought with for nearly 2 years to get a simple MRI done... swapped doctors and he had it approved and scheduled within a week. The MRI wasn't frivolous either, it had been a yearly occurrence since I was 11 years old, so for over a decade I've been getting one done once a year due to some chronic problems. She didn't have the forcefulness to get stuff done in a timely manner.
Like I said, it's personal preference.
From everything you've said above I'd have to say it's less personal preference than it is dire medical necessity. I hope your ex female doc learned something from this experience. Don't spare her the criticism. Clearly she failed her mission and I'd hope she'd live up to the rigors of the profession better in the future. There's a delicate balance to maintain IMO. I know what you mean about the extreme feel good docs because I shouldn't be leaving a dr's office less informed than when I came in. Sometimes I've felt compelled to blurt out-- enough with the poetry-- because they were soft pedaling far too much. Cancer is a frightening word but avoiding it's usage for fear of emotional outbursts or whatever doesn't serve the patient.
I just had surgery and my surgeons were an American woman who came from Russia as a child, and Vietnamese man who has been here for quite awhile. I'm not exactly sure where they went to school but both are well respected in their field. One of my CNA's was a young guy from Nigeria and he was super friendly but a little hard to understand. Now that I'm home it's funny to think about it all. Being in CA I am used to everyone being from somewhere else.
Now researchers from the Foundation for Advancement of International Medical Education and Research in Philadelphia have published the first study incorporating new research methods for evaluating the performance of large groups of physicians. And it turns out that contrary to certain individuals’ worst fears, accent or nationality did not affect patient outcomes. Rather, the main factor was being board-certified: completing a full residency at an accredited training program, passing written and, depending on the specialty, oral examinations, and having proof of experience with a defined set of clinical problems and technical procedures.
As an aside I have to mention it's gotten harder and harder to know who and what you're talking to. Used to be you went to a doctors office and no one doubted they were talking to a doctor. When I go to a doctors office I expect it, only to find out after the fact it was a nurse practitioner & the real doctor was a rubber stamp room. Similarly in teaching hospitals-- there were so many different colored scrubs I couldn't tell a nurse from an orderly from a specialist. There was such a non stop parade of colors hounding me while heavily medicated I finally lost my temper, got mean about it and kicked them all out with the help of a patient advocate. They flagged a few special markers on my closed door but I should have put one of my own. <--- has teeth.
I am stuck in a small town where most of the doctors are foreign. The only ones that take Medicare here are foreign. I saw my third foreign doctor today. He didn't introduce himself. He left without saying anything. All three just up and leave without saying anything. No bedside manner whatsoever. They only spend about 10 minutes per visit with me. They don't really volunteer any information. One said he would do a digital prostate exam the next time I saw him, then refused to do it. A neighbor also sees him and he wouldn't give him one either.
There is a huge difference between American and foreign doctors. Don't get me wrong. They are very smart, but they are very poor communicators. My goal is to move to a large city where I can find an American doctor.
Maybe I should complain to the medical board and ask them to give foreign doctors some sensitivity training in how to treat patients. No, that would be discriminatory. They will have to give all doctors this training.
It is routine to discuss lab results with the patient in a follow-up visit regardless of what the results are. Lab results can be in the normal range but be high normal or low normal which could indicate a trend given a certain family history such as your glucose or blood pressure. If following up with your physician is too arduous for you then why even see one? If all you want is a set of labs, go to an urgent care. They will require you pay them a standard cash fee ($80-$100), they will run labs for you and fax it to you without asking you to follow up. Seeing a physician is not for everyone. It's only for those people who want to be properly evaluated and have the patience to do so.
That is because the risks associated with general anesthesia far outweigh the risks of getting a prostate biopsy in an office setting. Prostate biopsies are routinely done in the office and takes less than 15 minutes. He didn't offer that option because the standard of care is to perform it in the office. General anesthesia has complications of its own and most insurance will not cover a huge hospital bill just to get a procedure that is routinely done in the office in less than 20 minutes. Without trying to sound rude, asking to get a prostate biopsy under general anesthesia is similar to asking to be under general anesthesia for 1 cm laceration sutured. People are awake for far worse things like getting a central line placed.
As long as its in the normal range, I don't care if its high normal or low normal. I was just trying to save Medicare some money. I think Medicare pays him about $175 for an office visit.
Medicare will also cover the in hospital general anesthetic procedure. It is not the expensive overnight visit since I will go home the same day. If there was not a valid reason to have this done in a hospital, Medicare would not pay for it.
a new study published in the August issue of Health Affairs. The study, which analyzed 244,000 hospitalizations of patients with congestive heart failure or acute heart attack in Pennsylvania found no notable difference in the death rates of patients treated by non-U.S.-based medical school graduates vs. those treated by U.S. medical school graduates.
Perhaps one of the most provocative findings raised questions about U.S.-born doctors who trained abroad. Patients of foreign nationals who trained abroad had the lowest death rates, while those of U.S. citizens who trained abroad had the highest.
Now researchers from the Foundation for Advancement of International Medical Education and Research in Philadelphia have published the first study incorporating new research methods for evaluating the performance of large groups of physicians. And it turns out that contrary to certain individuals’ worst fears, accent or nationality did not affect patient outcomes. Rather, the main factor was being board-certified: completing a full residency at an accredited training program, passing written and, depending on the specialty, oral examinations, and having proof of experience with a defined set of clinical problems and technical procedures.
Finally, some evidence to support one's claims as opposed to anecdotal accounts. This is by far the best and only relevant response here. I rep'd you. Well done!
As long as its in the normal range, I don't care if its high normal or low normal. I was just trying to save Medicare some money. I think Medicare pays him about $175 for an office visit.
Medicare will also cover the in hospital general anesthetic procedure. It is not the expensive overnight visit since I will go home the same day. If there was not a valid reason to have this done in a hospital, Medicare would not pay for it.
You should care if it's high normal because it means it could be trending upwards meaning it could be abnormal in the future. You should be more concerned with your health than "saving Medicare money". Furthermore, Medicare is not paying him $175 for a followup office visit. To go over labs is a level 2 or a level 3 followup visit which is about about $50. The anesthesia itself will cost twice as much as that $175 and who do you think gives you the anesthesia....that's right an anesthesiologist and do you think that his services will be cheap? Do you think he is going to put you under for free? You are going to cost Medicare 3 times as much to be put under general anesthesia in a hospital (even if you aren't staying overnight) and have a biopsy done as opposed to doing it outpatient.
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Originally Posted by amerifree
Foreign doctors have substandard education and very often faked credentials. Be very wary of degrees from "Sacred Cow University".
This is just more contrived b.s. from bigoted individuals. Let's interject some facts and clear myths like this. Medical schools from overseas have to be accredited and follow strict credentialing. There are many medical schools overseas that are not approved. So someone can't just type "Sacred Cow" on their resume to apply. Furthermore, foreign doctors can't just move here and hang up a shingle. They have to complete a residency in the United States....yes the same residencies that American grads have to complete. FURTHERMORE, they have to pass the United States Medical Licensing Exam which consists for 3 exams (step 2 has two components) and is an extremely difficult exam just to PASS let alone excel on. A lot of FMG's have achieved a 99% on this exam. FURTHERMORE, they have to pass their BOARDS aka a U.S. test. If you want to argue they have poor bedside manner, that's understandable, if you are going to argue they are not trained, then that is just is pure stupidity on your part.
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Besides substandard care, they are 400% more likely to overprescribe procedures and inpatient treatment.
Uh huh, and if they didn't "overprescribe these procedures and treatments" and you suffered as a result, you would be the first person to hire a lawyer and sue for 200K. And your statement shows you can't please everyone. I've had patients criticize me for being too conservative and too aggressive. People will complain if you aren't aggressive and will say you are being lazy and some patients will criticize you for being too aggressive and greedy if you do treatments. It just shows you that it depends on the patient. If you feel your doctor is too aggressive, go see a more conservative one. There are plenty of doctors who patients complain about "not doing anything". You just have to find one that works with your style and philosophy.
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It should have nothing to do with being busy, what kind of insurance you have if any - it's an attitude of mutual respect that seems to be missing, and you can do that in 30 seconds.
You also don't see people telling their lawyers and accountants how to do their jobs but with doctors, you have no problem telling someone who has 7-12 more years of formal training and multiple more years of job experience what they should be prescribing you. I agree that respect goes both ways and it's unfortunate there are rude doctors who feel they are above being polite. However, patients don't treat their doctors like they did in the past either. In the past, patients respected their doctors and their decisions. In the past, patients didn't bring articles and argue with their doctor or demand an antibiotic when they are having a cold. Many patients are extremely rude and I have just as many examples of patients acting like prima donas and thinking they walked into a McDonalds in which they can order medicine a la carte. If I could just show you how some patients behave, you would be shocked. Sorry but walking into your doctor's office is not like walking into Burger King. Our job is improve your health, it's not to give you whatever you want.
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Originally Posted by harborlady
I'm not trying to insult other professions. I'm just pointing out how the rigors of medical school far exceed many other health care professions and often times medical school flunkies get redirected. Some that have aspergers mentalities really have no business being proximal to patients so they're better suited for lab work or research. Takes all kinds to make the world turn is what I'm getting at. I'm not qualified for the olympics or for rocket science and there's no shame in admitting that fact. I have other gifts and serve humanity in a different way is all.
I agree that physicians are absolutely required to treat patients with respect and professionalism. There is no excuse. At the same time, patients are also required to respect their physicians. My advice is simple. If you don't like your doctor, go see another one. The only way rude physicians are going to understand that they have to change their behavior is if patients stop seeing them. Rate them on websites like www.ratemds.com Reward the physicians that do treat you with respect by seeing them. But like many dysfunctional relationships, patients stick with certain doctors and will deal with being treated unprofessionally rather than switching to a different doctor.
Last edited by azriverfan.; 10-23-2010 at 05:05 PM..
You also don't see people telling their lawyers and accountants how to do their jobs but with doctors, you have no problem telling someone who has 7-12 more years of formal training and multiple more years of job experience what they should be prescribing you. I agree that respect goes both ways and it's unfortunate there are rude doctors who feel they are above being polite. However, patients don't treat their doctors like they did in the past either. In the past, patients respected their doctors and their decisions. In the past, patients didn't bring articles and argue with their doctor or demand an antibiotic when they are having a cold. Many patients are extremely rude and I have just as many examples of patients acting like prima donas and thinking they walked into a McDonalds in which they can order medicine a la carte. If I could just show you how some patients behave, you would be shocked. Sorry but walking into your doctor's office is not like walking into Burger King. Our job is improve your health, it's not to give you whatever you want.
My take on the OP's post was again, not so much a matter of training etc, but more one of attitude and manner.
I come from a medical family - though I didn't choose to follow that path. None of the physicians in my family have any less respect for my intelligence because I didn't choose to go to med school. I guess what I resent from this post is some of that same attitude the OP suggested. Because they are concerned with our physical well-being and "appear" to have the power of life and death does not elevate them to god-like status. My personal experience has been that that attitude is more frequently seen in some cultural backgrounds than others.
I was spoiled by having the same Dr [not a relative] from the day I was born till the day I got moved away from home. Many people who had that experience are having a hard time moving from that atmosphere to one where your "history" is on a chart passed from HMO to HMO. It's difficult to treat a Dr as you "did in the past" because for many of us, that meant having a Dr who knew you, your family, your history, and treatment was contextual. You also knew your Dr. Years of a successful relationship build trust & respect. More than likely now, every other visit is some new Dr you don't know & doesn't know you. In that sense it IS like walking into Burger King. All I know about them is that they got a license to practice in my state. Physicians should accept and take that new reality into account when expecting instant respect from patients.
Some health-care personnel also become victims of the same thing that police and social workers do; they are seeing people everyday at low points in their lives, vulnerable, scared, angry, and they begin to loose perspective. Their world view changes to one of "us" and those ignorant people we deal with. They become judgmental and impatient, their original humanitarian motives corrupted. It's the nature of the game - be aware of it and you can at least stop it from showing on your face while you're lecturing Aunt Bee on all that fatty food she cooks.
I don't tell physician's how to treat this or that condition, but I do offer them insight into how to treat ME. I think it's important to treat the whole person, not just the condition. But that's just me. I don't expect them to dismiss my questions or input as beneath their consideration because there is no MD after my name. No, I don't tell a lawyer what procedures to follow in court either, but yes I do tell them when they suggest some tactic which I have problems with, even if the law books say it's OK.
As the designated medical advocate in my family who happens to live in a small town full of foreign doctors, who has had a couple of serious medical problems myself, and having worked in training and testing of student doctors, I have experienced a lot.
I have had foreign doctors call me at home and step up to the plate when others refused care which earned them my respect in a town that felt the same was as the OP, and others who were not up to par. My own doctors of both types are personality nazis, super efficient and saved my life; one answers questions and the other doesn't, and the first time in my life I consented to that much trust of another human being without details. I have stumped one of them once. I tested an American female med student who was far and away better than any others, a middle eastern male that refused to touch women, and those of every aptitude inbetween.
The bottom line is doctors are people of varying skill, intelligence, and empathy. Search until you find a doctor you can respect and then stick with them.
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<--- has teeth.
