Corporate America owns the tea party--they spent more than twice the Dems on midterms

[mb1547]

Originally Posted by TnHilltopper

Actually I don't think it is a Republican controlled movement, only that in most cases it is a Republican supported movement and it was money that paid off.

It is no secret that the Tea Party is well funded by a variety of corporate and ideological groups, as it could never have made it this far without such funding. It didn't give them the Senate but it did give them the House and the House has powers of impeachment, which to the ideologically driven is far more important than governing.

Keep in mind how much was spent on investigating Clinton compared to what was spent on the 9-11 commission, and you have your answer.

I agree that there needs to be total transparency in campaign financing and in politics in general, but the rules what they are now is what folks should be most focused on. Its hard to blame Republicans for taking advantage of the current laws to their advantage, and if anything it seems a bit of sour grapes on behalf of Democrats for not doing the same.

Its kind of like back during the Bush administration when I would warn people about the consolidation of powers into the Executive Branch and was scoffed at. My point was that one day an oppositional party will hold that office will all those powers and then your attitudes will change. Its the system that needs to be fixed, not those taking advantage of what the system allows.

I'm not blaming the TP--I'm blaming the R's. I may disagree with the platform issues of many of the grassroots TP people (although I'm all for more efficient government), but I can't say that many of them aren't frustrated, angry, and at heart well intentioned. The problem--they have a complete leadership vacuum (it's a movement, not a party) and the R's have stepped in to run the show. The Rs didn't do that out of any sense of ethics or kindness--they did it because they saw an opportunity to fill spots with folks they could manipulate and control down the road. It was a numbers game for them, and all about winning as a party. They could care less about the TP agenda--you'll see lots of lip service and no action. I don't think it's sour grapes to be concerned about the corporate buyout of our elections--that scares the heck out of me. When the message is controlled by a very small group of people, on either side, it opens the door for unlimited abuse of power. He who shouts longest and loudest usually gets heard. I shared similar concerns over concentrating power in the executive branch, and look where that took us under Bush. I agree that the system needs to be changed--but that doesn't change the fact that the tea party was bought and sold by corporations this election cycle, whether they wanted that to happen or not.

[TnHilltopper]

Originally Posted by mb1547

I'm not blaming the TP--I'm blaming the R's. I may disagree with the platform issues of many of the grassroots TP people (although I'm all for more efficient government), but I can't say that many of them aren't frustrated, angry, and at heart well intentioned. The problem--they have a complete leadership vacuum (it's a movement, not a party) and the R's have stepped in to run the show. The Rs didn't do that out of any sense of ethics or kindness--they did it because they saw an opportunity to fill spots with folks they could manipulate and control down the road. It was a numbers game for them, and all about winning as a party. They could care less about the TP agenda--you'll see lots of lip service and no action. I don't think it's sour grapes to be concerned about the corporate buyout of our elections--that scares the heck out of me. When the message is controlled by a very small group of people, on either side, it opens the door for unlimited abuse of power. He who shouts longest and loudest usually gets heard. I shared similar concerns over concentrating power in the executive branch, and look where that took us under Bush. I agree that the system needs to be changed--but that doesn't change the fact that the tea party was bought and sold by corporations this election cycle, whether they wanted that to happen or not.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that the Republican establishment will only pay lip service to the Tea Party folks, but I just think the concern should be focused on the structure and laws which allow campaigns to be funded in the manner in which they are. The Supreme Court ruling in my opinion put the American political system up for sale on eBay, and that is where I would focus my anger at. Those who took advantage of the current system are now empowered to continue this and I suspect we won't be seeing any changes soon, although I wish we would. Democrats had the same opportunity to work within the current system as well, but I think because many Democrats and moderates just had the wind let out of them over the past two years and simply weren't inclined to support the left.

[mb1547]

Originally Posted by TnHilltopper

Don't get me wrong, I agree that the Republican establishment will only pay lip service to the Tea Party folks, but I just think the concern should be focused on the structure and laws which allow campaigns to be funded in the manner in which they are. The Supreme Court ruling in my opinion put the American political system up for sale on eBay, and that is where I would focus my anger at. Those who took advantage of the current system are now empowered to continue this and I suspect we won't be seeing any changes soon, although I wish we would. Democrats had the same opportunity to work within the current system as well, but I think because many Democrats and moderates just had the wind let out of them over the past two years and simply weren't inclined to support the left.

Here's where we have to respectfully disagree--I was a life long R, and I'm disgusted by them right now. I'm not exactly fond of the Democrats either, but I think the R's played games with these people that are inexcusable. One of the last straws for me as a republican was when I finally figured out they were manipulating the terror alerts to control voters--it was a total betrayal of trust. I see this as more of the same--people are frustrated and angry, and they want change. The R's have absolutely no intention of creating policy that helps the average American--nothing is going to change from the Bush years--but they lied to the tea party, and used them to walk back into power. They'll toss them to the side when they're done with them. It doesn't get any lower than that.

[TnHilltopper]

Originally Posted by mb1547

Here's where we have to respectfully disagree--I was a life long R, and I'm disgusted by them right now. I'm not exactly fond of the Democrats either, but I think the R's played games with these people that are inexcusable. One of the last straws for me as a republican was when I finally figured out they were manipulating the terror alerts to control voters--it was a total betrayal of trust. I see this as more of the same--people are frustrated and angry, and they want change. The R's have absolutely no intention of creating policy that helps the average American--nothing is going to change from the Bush years--but they lied to the tea party, and used them to walk back into power. They'll toss them to the side when they're done with them. It doesn't get any lower than that.

Hey, the party left me when Bush ran on a platform of humble foreign policy and no new nation building. I bought that message after having witnessed Clinton's penchant for foreign interventionism. I know the feeling of having actions not meet the words, especially on an issue that is important to me.

I've since embraced political cynicism as it thus far is the only reliable truth in politics today.

However the law remains and either political party can use shady front groups to fund these massive campaigns and have since removed democracy from our democracy and replaced it with an auction.

[mb1547]

Originally Posted by TnHilltopper

Hey, the party left me when Bush ran on a platform of humble foreign policy and no new nation building. I bought that message after having witnessed Clinton's penchant for foreign interventionism. I know the feeling of having actions not meet the words, especially on an issue that is important to me.

I've since embraced political cynicism as it thus far is the only reliable truth in politics today.

However the law remains and either political party can use shady front groups to fund these massive campaigns and have since removed democracy from our democracy and replaced it with an auction.

Here's where we agree--I think being a complete cynic is the only way to survive politics at this point in our history. My point with this thread was simply this--call the TP wins in the midterms what they are, and don't sugar coat things. The neocon/corporate Rs own their votes now. Are individual tea party members grassroots participants--absolutely. Are they trying to involve more people in the democratic process--yes. Are they being taken advantage of and manipulated by corporate controlled R interests--absolutely. Will those newly elected people have to be accountable to the people that paid to put them in power--you bet. As long as they don't step on toes with the corporate guys, they'll let the tea party act like they belong, but if they step out of line, that will be the end of that. As I've said, I think we'll see a real shift to social conservative policy proposals that never go anywhere (because of obstruction by the Dems, of course, even though the neocons don't want them either), and a flurry of investigations to try to keep the base preoccupied--if they can pull it off, 2012 will be all about the social conservatives. I actually feel badly for many of the tea partiers, because they think they're changing the R party from within. They may be moving the moderates out, but the big spender neocons are here to stay. The neocons wanted the moderates out too, so everyone was on board. The bottom line--the money and the power are in the hands of the neocons, and they're not going to give it up any time soon. The tea party danced with the devil, and now they have to pay the price.