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We are discussing the judge's refusal to grant a restraining order. His ruling included the following:
a6107-08.opn.html (http://lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/courts/appellate/a6107-08.opn.html - broken link)
Which 'belief' was referred to in the above judgment? According to Sheikh Sayeed, president of the UK's Islamic Sharia Council, that 'belief' is Islamic Sharia law.
It doesn't matter WHAT his beliefs are, only that the judge was told and believed that the man's beliefs had CHANGED.
That's what judges do when modifying restraining orders. They try to determine if the circumstances have changed since the original restraining order was issued.
It DOES matter when it influences a judge's ruling, as it did here:
Quote:
This court does not feel that, under the circumstances, that this defendant had a criminal desire to or intent to sexually assault or to sexually contact the plaintiff when he did. The court believes that he was operating under his belief that it is, as the husband, his desire to have sex when and whether he wanted to, was something that was consistent with his practices and it was something that was not prohibited.
It DOES matter when it influences a judge's ruling, as it did here:
a6107-08.opn.html (http://lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/courts/appellate/a6107-08.opn.html - broken link)
And that reference was in the past tense. Past tense. The husband then believed something. The husband now knows that belief was wrong. Since the original restraining order was issued, the situation has changed.
The judge was ruling on the change in the situation.
For instance, if someone was schizophrenic and their behavior was dangerous a restraining order or an order to confine that person to a hospital might be issued. When that order comes up for modification, the person might point out that they are taking effective medication, and being monitored by a physician, so the order is no longer needed. The judge has to determine if the situation has CHANGED, and thus merits a modification of the order.
I truly do appreciate your sense of humor. I laughed out loud when I read that, but I knew from our previous exchanges that it was either wordplay or a typo.
the voice in the head rules the keyboard. I slip up cognitive from time to time, but it is all in good fun. Sometimes I will go back and correct that southern voice, then there are times, I will let it play out.
My interest in this thread (speaking of past conversations you and I have had)
Awad's lawsuit, based on his own Shariah-compliant will, said SQ 755 violates the First Amendment's Establishment Clause that bars government bodies from making laws "respecting the establishment of religion."
Remember a conversation you and I had that I said, 'perhaps it is for the best' well, this is where it is for the best a specific definition of the 1st Amendment, it is for the best Separation of Church and State and Madalyn Murray O'Hare's mission steady it's course.
This is where the atheist voice and the secular voice should be heard loud and clear. It is not the spiritual establishment that needs to be understood in our courts, but the physical establishment of life in the United States.
And that reference was in the past tense. Past tense.
Correct, as would any events entered as evidence when wishing to obtain a restraining order.
Perhaps this needs to be more clear:
Quote:
While recognizing that defendant had engaged in sexual relations with plaintiff against her expressed wishes in November 2008 and on the night of January 15 to 16, 2009, the judge did not find sexual assault or criminal sexual conduct to have been proven. He stated:
Quote:
This court does not feel that, under the circumstances, that this defendant had a criminal desire to or intent to sexually assault or to sexually contact the plaintiff when he did. The court believes that he was operating under his belief that it is, as the husband, his desire to have sex when and whether he wanted to, was something that was consistent with his practices and it was something that was not prohibited.
After acknowledging that this was a case in which religious custom clashed with the law, and that under the law, plaintiff had a right to refuse defendant's advances, the judge found that defendant did not act with a criminal intent when he repeatedly insisted upon intercourse, despite plaintiff's contrary wishes.
The judge ACKNOWLEDGED the influence of Islamic Sharia law on his decision to rule a lack of criminal intent. Not only that, he also vacated the temporary restraints previously entered in the matter and dismissed plaintiff's domestic violence action.
The Islamic refusal to accept any kind of criticism of Islam is one of the least attractive feature of Islam. Right up there with the tendancy to play the perpetual victim when any demands for change are ever brought up. I'll live and let live when Muslims stop treating half their population like dirt, allow freedom of religion for ALL faiths in their own countries and stop preaching hatred against their fellow human beings just because they don't have the misfortune to be Muslim men.
In the meantime I'll keep myself and my tourist dollars in places where I don't have to shroud myself just because I'm a woman or worry that my gay friends are being killed just because they're gay or enter a mosque with Death to America and Death to Israel signs all over the place thankyouverymuch.
Yes actually Eleanora. I talk my advice back. You sound like a hate-filled, ignorant, fear-driven person and I wouldn't wish that kind of person in anyone's backyard, even as a tourist.
All of your ideas about muslims and how they treat "the other half" are completely misguided by directed propaganda at exactly your kind of type. The kind that wants to believe that their WAY is the ONLY WAY and they are therefore superior to others for it and they don't want anything to burst that little bubble of self-delusion built on bigotry and hate, and that is why you seek out sources of information that confirm what you would like to believe rather than face the cognitive dissonance that comes when someone is faced with the realization that nothing is what they thought it was.
Yes actually Eleanora. I talk my advice back. You sound like a hate-filled, ignorant, fear-driven person and I wouldn't wish that kind of person in anyone's backyard, even as a tourist.
All of your ideas about muslims and how they treat "the other half" are completely misguided by directed propaganda at exactly your kind of type. The kind that wants to believe that their WAY is the ONLY WAY and they are therefore superior to others for it and they don't want anything to burst that little bubble of self-delusion built on bigotry and hate, and that is why you seek out sources of information that confirm what you would like to believe rather than face the cognitive dissonance that comes when someone is faced with the realization that nothing is what they thought it was.
May you be guided to peace and light. Peace out.
Yeah silly me and "my type." I realize that concepts like equality between the sexes, separation of church and state and media that aren't filled with Nazi like hate against Christians and Jews are nothing more a pipe dream in most Islamic nations but I'll stick to standing up for them anyway.
Much better to worship a seventh century pedophile instead. Yeah.
Pointing out the terrible conditions that govern women, gays and non-Muslims in Muslim countries is merely a statement of fact. The fact that you take such over the top offense at such statements is yet again an illustration of the terrifyingly deep problems within the Islamic world.
Consider taking the burqa off. You might see the world far more clearly. Calling me a bigot does nothing to refute anything I've accurately stated about what goes on the Islamic nations and even less to make Islam anymore attractive as an ideology.
I'm sure most Muslims are nice people. But that's despite Islam and not because of it.
Yes actually Eleanora. I talk my advice back. You sound like a hate-filled, ignorant, fear-driven person and I wouldn't wish that kind of person in anyone's backyard, even as a tourist.
All of your ideas about muslims and how they treat "the other half" are completely misguided by directed propaganda at exactly your kind of type.
The vast majority of the worst-scoring countries are Islamic, most of them Arab states. Seventeen of the 20 countries at the bottom of the gender gap scale are Islamic – Lebanon (placed at 116), Qatar (117), Nigeria (118), Algeria (119), Jordan (120), Oman (122), Iran (123), Syria (124), Egypt (125), Turkey (126), Morocco (127), Benin (128), Saudi Arabia (129), Mali (131), Pakistan (132), Chad (133) and Yemen (134). Only three non-Muslim countries ranked in the bottom 20 -- Nepal at 115, Ethiopia at 121 and Cote d’Ivoire at 130.
Your post, m92tiger, speaks volumes... How could you be so uninformed? Serious question.
Yes actually Eleanora. I talk my advice back. You sound like a hate-filled, ignorant, fear-driven person and I wouldn't wish that kind of person in anyone's backyard, even as a tourist.
All of your ideas about muslims and how they treat "the other half" are completely misguided by directed propaganda at exactly your kind of type. The kind that wants to believe that their WAY is the ONLY WAY and they are therefore superior to others for it and they don't want anything to burst that little bubble of self-delusion built on bigotry and hate, and that is why you seek out sources of information that confirm what you would like to believe rather than face the cognitive dissonance that comes when someone is faced with the realization that nothing is what they thought it was.
May you be guided to peace and light. Peace out.
The propaganda you speak of, is that where the United States and all western countries is the blame for all that is wrong in Islamic countries and their human rights laws? That which is printed in their papers for those people to see that which they believe to be true.
The cognitive dissonance that nothing is as it appears to be is a philosophy serving best served on all plates.
Those who believe in Christ know that it isn't about the laws established by man as it is man's law we follow while we are alive, but about the spiritual law of Christ and in the afterlife we are to adhere to in understanding.
If Islamic culture can not enjoy the United States human rights laws and the established Separation of Church and State, perhaps they should be looking at the real estate sections of the middle eastern countries. Let their physical selves dwell in a land that is better understood by them.
Oklahoma is not adopting an Anti-Islam Amendment, they are taking the necessary steps to insure the United States Constitution and the Establishment Clause for the best interest of all people who live, here, remains true for their state. (this is just the beginning)
Last edited by Ellis Bell; 11-10-2010 at 12:23 PM..
Reason: spelling
Correct, as would any events entered as evidence when wishing to obtain a restraining order.
Perhaps this needs to be more clear:a6107-08.opn.html (http://lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/courts/appellate/a6107-08.opn.html - broken link)
The judge ACKNOWLEDGED the influence of Islamic Sharia law on his decision to rule a lack of criminal intent. Not only that, he also vacated the temporary restraints previously entered in the matter and dismissed plaintiff's domestic violence action.
He DID NOT RULE on the criminal proceedings. He was a civil courts judge, and he could not rule on the criminal proceedings.
I'm not going to keep arguing this with you. You don't understand what happened, that's clear.
The husband wants the restraining order lifted. He's not going to go to court and argue that he still poses a threat to his wife. He's going to argue that he doesn't pose a threat to his wife. He's arguing that he no longer believes what he believed when he assaulted his wife.
And the criminal proceedings are on-going. The man is still charged with raping his wife.
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the voice in the head rules the keyboard. 
