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What's the practical difference? How's it play out in real life?
The way it plays out in everyday life is I personally refrain from forming concrete conclusions about people based solely on their race, gender, back-ground, and apearence. I give people the benifet of the doubt, probably more often than I should but never-the-less I do.
This helps me free my mind and heart from negativity. How many times have you had a homeless person or person in general approach you and ask for change, only for you think to yourself "Get a damn Job" I have to work, so should you??
I've done this many times, until recently when I taught myself not to "judge people" for the things that I would or wouldn't neccessarily do. This doesn't mean that I'm handing out money like flyers, but in the simplest form it means I refrain from initially passing judgement. I realize this has little bearing on the debate and topic at hand, but you asked how it plays out in real life, and that's just a small example
The way it plays out in everyday life is I personally refrain from forming concrete conclusions about people based solely on their race, gender, back-ground, and apearence. I give people the benifet of the doubt, probably more often than I should but never-the-less I do...
Yes I can form my opinion on why people do things (which is just my own opinion), but I cannot come to a conclusiong as to why people do things without "walking a mile in their shoes"? No I can't
Com'on now were just going round and round....lol. Like I said let's agree to disagree and MTF on.
So how's the weather in MI lately? I've been out in AZ for the past year and half and I must say I miss the greenery, but definately don't miss the bleek job market
My biggest beef is with Bush and "I" don't support him. Enough of the political stuff.
Fair enough. Conclusion: Your disdain for Thomas and Rice have nothing to do with calling spades "spades," but with political disagreements and therefore, you do not respect them as successful black people. (This in consideration of what started the exchange.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by trudawg
Com'on now were just going round and round....lol. Like I said let's agree to disagree and MTF on.
Don't abandon me yet, I just wanted to make sure we were still on the same page.
What's the difference between a conclusion and an opinion? Also, how does one go about forming an opinion? Do you gather information so that you can develop the most informed opinion possible given the circumstances?
I would say forming an opinion is to decide whether or not you agree or codone a situation. It is indeed a judgment. I think all "opinions" are judgments... whether you voice your opinion or keep it private... it is still your judgment.
Conclusion on the other hand, to me means, to explain the reason WHY a situation exists, to place blame on an individual or circumstance.
You can have an opinion, for instance "Detroit traffic is very bad" as opposed to a conclusion, "detroit traffic is bad because the drivers in detroit are careless drivers".
the traffic could be bad because of excess of cars, bad highway design, ill timed traffic lights... the other one is placing blame on the drivers without regard to other reasons.
I think this is what trudawg meant is don't draw conclusions on a person without walking a mile in his shoes... meaning look at all possible reasons for a situation instead of just going the easy way (and possibly faulty way) and just blame the closest person.
Just my 2 cents to possibly shed some light on your question... "What's the difference between a conclusion and an opinion?"
1967 Detroit Riots and other things to rant about! Warning: LONG!
[quote=Torrid;1046778]OK, here are some FACTS about "White Flight".
1. July 12, 1967, a black cab driver (John Smith), in Newark NJ. was beaten by white police officers <snip> Thus, starting a 6 day riot and then, the infamous "White Flight" in many cities including Detroit and Chicago.
2. The cause......poverty and police brutality.
I could go on and on about this. And, I know this isn't directly FOR Southfield BUT, it is what began the nationwide flight of white people to "safer" more "secure" neighborhoods. MY personal opinion is whites created the problem back when slavery was still legal. Blacks continue to hold a grudge. And, whites continue to hold a lot of the cards. However, I feel if blacks feel the need to hold grudges, they should also hold some grudges against "their own people". It was the richer, higher powered tribes in Africa that sold the less fortunate blacks to be used as slavery.
My late father-in-law was a firefighter for the City of Detroit and his station was located on Cass St., only blocks from where the Detroit riots started (I was told, anyway!) He and the rest of his battalion were often called out during that time and would be fighting the resulting fires with his only weapon: a fire hose.
His "thanks" for his public service? Being pelted with bricks by angry black bystanders.
After YEARS of putting-up with that kind of hatred and being forced by city mandate to live in the "white corridor" along the edge of Old Redford, he finally "escaped" in the early 1970's to Fowlerville -prolly 100 miles from Detroit- to finish raising his three children in relative small-town safety.
Could anyone really BLAME him? He never really talked about it; he was a man of few words, but I think he carried a LOT of bitterness of his experiences like that, and rightly so.
OTOH, in my profession, I deal with a LOT of folks of all colors and one of my happiest and rewarding experiences was working for a group of black people in an AME church here in central IL. They are some of the finest, most upstanding people I have ever done business with!
Like others have said: anyone with reasonable intelligence would GLADLY live next door to a black family that was doing their part to keep up their property values and make a positive contribution to society in whatever way they are able to.
We ALL have a personal responsibility for making the best lives for ourselves that we possibly can. Some do well, while others don't do as well, but that's the beauty of the American way and at the end of the day, this really has NOTHING to do with a person's origins or skin color. America IS still the best "land of opportunity" there is in the free word, despite our problems.
Slavery ended over 120 years ago now and it seems to me that the venomous, hateful attitude pitched by the likes of Rev. Jeremiah Wright do nothing but poison the minds of would-be successful people to try to "get even with whitey" for something that no one who is alive is personally and directly responsible for having caused. Most reasonable people are certainly sorry that it happened, but that's ultimately where our responsibility ends. "Making it" is up to you and me individually; no matter who you are and what your background is, and NOT up to the government. All people have to do is look to black role models who have "made it", such as Bill Cosby. Here is a black man who grew-up in the "projects" in Philadelphia and today has become one of the finest role-models there is.
Truth be told: the WORST MISTAKE that this government has EVER made was "the dole", because it makes it so easy to meet life's needs without ever having to get one's sorry ass off the couch and their trigger finger off the remote!! What's the incentive to work when you can get what you need so easy? Entire generations have been raised not knowing anything else except getting a welfare check from Uncle Sam every month. The cycle REALLY needs to be broken.
Let me state that I'm a white person who, for the past several years, due to a confluence of some personal bad decisions and factors beyond my control has seen my personal economic situation erode to the point of destitution and poverty. I'm sure that if I "worked at it", I could qualify for SOMEthing, in terms of government assistance.
However, I don't intend to do that. That said, I certainly *don*t* qualify for the government handout under the guise of an economic stimulus package that everyone else who made more than $3,000.00 in earned income will be getting this year because of losses that my wife's baby-sitting business suffered due to the expense of driving long distances at current gas prices.
Is it someone else's fault? I'm sure I could point fingers at the world events that created the ridiculous gas prices we are now suffering from, but ultimately, if I want our personal financial situation to improve, it's up to US to figure-out a way to MAKE it better ourselves and NO ONE ELSE's! Period.
The solution? We just completed the renovation of a house located MUCH closer to us for our daughter, for whom my wife baby-sits, to move to, so my wife didn't have to keep driving 45 minutes one-way to her house.
I've always taught my three kids that: "If it's to be, it's up to ME!", and gratefully, they've all learned that valuable life lesson and put it to good use in their adult lives. We even had a neighbor boy who is the son of a single "welfare mom" spend most of his growing-up years around our kids and us. One day, he thanked us for "teaching him how to work", and has make quite a successful life for himself. Every time I think of that experience, it just blows me away.
Would more people, no matter what their skin color, would teach the same to THEIR offspring! Like the Bible says: "If a man does not work, neither should he EAT!"
Maybe we just communicate differently because of the way we were raised? What you consider hatred, we consider constructive criticism.
Is that possible? What you consider soul, I consider childish romanticism.
Why can't we just be different without color being relevant to you?
The original poster was correct - you are rude, not to mention full of yourself. There are other ways of looking at the world - don't assume your view is automatically the correct one and that we all have to abide by it.
Do you want to know what is "childish romanticism?" Your assertion that any person, regardless of race or background, can just look past daily prejudice and create that good 'ol American business with gumption! Please. Most likely, you have lived a privileged life. And yes, being born "white" automatically gives you privilege over any other race.
Even your hero, Clarence Thomas, couldn't have gotten ahead without affirmative action policies. The reason he, and other black conservatives, have gotten ahead is because they have melted into the majority. People like Ms. Rice are naturally advantaged - she was gifted with intelligent, which allowed her to attend and graduate college years ahead of her peers. And do I even dare say that many successful blacks in a white society usually have a white ancestor or two?
And "constructive criticism" is wanting to get away with saying what you want without input from others who disagree with you. I fail to see how anything you have said has been "constructive" to anybody here, since you seem to brush off what anybody else has to say around here.
Last edited by American Aries; 04-15-2008 at 03:57 AM..
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1967 Detroit Riots and other things to rant about! Warning: LONG!
