Social Studies teacher using the word "Stupid" to describe political beliefs, contrary to his own (generation, school)

[sskkc]

The principal has called. They questioned my son, but not in front of the teacher. They say they will be keeping his identity private. They said that after speaking with my son, they agreed those statements "do not belong on this campus". They did not question his version. My son has a cell phone. We told him this morning that if they spoke to him and he felt uncomfortable, he was to call us and we'd be there.

I am not looking for revenge (though initially I was angry, I calmed down BEFORE I acted. I have come to realize that this man is so insecure in his own beliefs that he has to resort to trying to convince CHILDREN of his superiority)

I want a retraction. If that will undermine his authority then he should've kept his personal beliefs to himself. A teacher should not be allowed to tell 10 year olds that their parent's political beliefs are stupid, then not have to answer for it. The principal has said she agrees.

I acknowledge that I would not be leading the charge if it had gone the other way. I would agree though that it was inappropriate though.

OT -I disagree that evolution is 'proven science'. Evolutionist themselves acknowledge this by their very own phrasing. Evolution is a THEORY. I was taught evolution in school. I also studied creationism, after meeting my husband - my MIL was the curator at a Creationism Research museum for many years. My children know both sides.

The idea that 'liberal' areas are more tolerant is laughable. And extremely small minded. By your own example, there was no outrage at a HIGH school. Your elementary social studies teacher wasn't forcing their agenda on you and insulting your parents, by your own words. There is a HUGE difference between 10 and 16.

[mlassoff]

Originally Posted by sskkc

OT -I disagree that evolution is 'proven science'. Evolutionist themselves acknowledge this by their very own phrasing. Evolution is a THEORY. I was taught evolution in school. I also studied creationism, after meeting my husband - my MIL was the curator at a Creationism Research museum for many years. My children know both sides.

The idea that 'liberal' areas are more tolerant is laughable. And extremely small minded. By your own example, there was no outrage at a HIGH school. Your elementary social studies teacher wasn't forcing their agenda on you and insulting your parents, by your own words. There is a HUGE difference between 10 and 16.

You may disagree that about evolution being proven science. However, actual science seems to disagree with YOU. There is zero verifiable science behind creationism. Zero as in none. It's a religious theory based on faith. Evolution is a scientific theory. A scientific theory has been through the scrutiny of the scientific process. I don't believe for a second that you don't know the difference between religion and scientific theory. Gravity is a theory too, do you doubt that? If my child were taught creationism as science I'd be in school in a second.

Lying to children about what is and isn't science is far more damaging in the long run than a teacher calling some abstract set of politics stupid.

I've lived in the liberal suburbs of Connecticut and conservative suburbs in Texas. I guess I have some perspective that people who haven't lived in both places have about which area is more tolerant.

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by captain_hug99

I would ask to make sure that the child got it right. Whenever we talk about religious music, I have a statement that I use all the time, "I am not telling you what to believe, I am a music teacher." etc... A parent heard from her child that I said that no one should believe in religion. My principal came to me and asked me what I had said, I gave her the speech verbatim and she said, "I figured."

I think your situation is a little different. If this is the way it happened, (the child misunderstood) then meeting with the teacher and princpal would do no harm and maybe help everyone understand.

We had a similar situation with our daughter when she was in middle school only it was a sexual harrassment problem. I met with her councilor and the teacher together. Little did I know this was not the first time he had been involved in a charge. It was verbal, I will add. Anyway, he had some **** and bull story, we let it drop, but he never made another inappropriate comment to our daughter or any of her friends.

Nita

[sskkc]

Lying to children about what is and isn't science is far more damaging

How tolerant of you to call me a liar.

I've lived in the liberal suburbs of Connecticut and conservative suburbs in Texas. I guess I have some perspective that people who haven't lived in both places have about which area is more tolerant.

I've lived in Chicago, rural southern Illinois, Grand Rapids Michigan, Detroit, San Diego, St Louis, San Bernadino County California, Albuquerque New Mexico, Colorado Springs, Columbus Ohio, Jacksonville Florida and now near DFW.

Perhaps some people who have lived in more than one or two areas/states have a broader based experience than that of those who have not.

Zero as in none.

That's your ignorance showing. Have you ever been to the Grand Canyon? A Creationism museum? Studied rather than just judged based on your childhood classroom experiences?

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by mlassoff

Just a question for the OP--

Would you be this upset if the teacher called Obama stupid and/or people who voted for him 'stupid'?

I can't speak for the Op, but my guess is, yes. The point is, teachers should never and I mean never allow their personal political views to influence their teaching. This holds true with clergy as well. Their views should be kept pretty much to themselves. There are times and places to discuss politics, certainly in the classroom is not the place unless your are discussing them in an objective way.

Nita

[Quick Enough]

Originally Posted by sskkc

This evening, my son told us that his Social Studies teacher informed his class earlier this week that anyone who voted for *presidential candidate* is "stupid". He went on to explain that members of a certain party are stupid - ... really?

Is this okay for a teacher, a Social Studies teacher, a teacher of 10 year old children to be saying to his classroom? If this were your child, and the teacher had called YOUR beliefs "stupid", what would you do?

Seriously, I'm asking. I have every intention of discussing this with his principal tomorrow. Is this acceptable to anyone?

Now we know where all the posters on here who disagree with someone elses opinion, calls them stupid.

[Strel]

Originally Posted by sskkc

So, you believe that teachers should tell 10 year olds that their parent's beliefs are stupid?

No I don't, and moreover, I didn't say that I did. This teacher handled the controversy inappropriately.

That doesn't mean that kids shouldn't be exposed to controversy, including political controversy, as many here are arguing. I was a teacher myself once upon a time, and felt that it was my responsiblity to present all sides of a controversy, and I did my best to stay neutral about it.

But if a student came up to me after class and asked me what my personal opinion was, I would be honest with them about it, while being sensitive to their beliefs, if they differed.

You believe that a 10 year old should be subjected to a biased rant by someone in a position of authority over him, other than his parents? Really?

I think you should stop guessing what I believe and instead stick to what I actually wrote.

Well, in the interest of a 'marketplace of ideas', shouldn't a teacher be allowed to explain to 10 year old students that evolution is a flawed THEORY and that anyone who believes that mankind evolved from fish is a moron?

No, because that really isn't a controversy. It's a faux controversy that exists only in the minds of Creationists. Evolution is a scientific issue, not a controversy regarding differing political philosophies. The standards are different precisely because it is science. Evolution is supported by empirical evidence. In science class, students should be taught science. Teaching the debate is tantamount to assigning some validity to Creationism, which violates the Establishment clause because it constitutes the promotion of religion. The courts have been very clear about that.

But this is a SOCIAL STUDIES class. What little science there is in it is "soft" science and more property the subject of debate. The same standard would apply to a literature class. The subject matter permits a larger degree of subjective interpretation, unlike science or math.

I mean if it's a 'marketplace', then why aren't ALL ideas welcome?

Because promoting religion in public schools is outlawed, that's why. That doesn't mean it cannot be discussed or studied, but religion is subject to a different standard under the law, so dealing with it in a public school can be very tricky. No such prohibition exists regarding political subjects per se.

[Jadex]

Originally Posted by sskkc

This evening, my son told us that his Social Studies teacher informed his class earlier this week that anyone who voted for *presidential candidate* is "stupid". He went on to explain that members of a certain party are stupid - ... really?

Is this okay for a teacher, a Social Studies teacher, a teacher of 10 year old children to be saying to his classroom? If this were your child, and the teacher had called YOUR beliefs "stupid", what would you do?

Seriously, I'm asking. I have every intention of discussing this with his principal tomorrow. Is this acceptable to anyone?

No its not acceptable and I would speak with the principal. I would have already done it

[Strel]

Originally Posted by sskkc

OT -I disagree that evolution is 'proven science'. Evolutionist themselves acknowledge this by their very own phrasing. Evolution is a THEORY.

Then you are clearly ignorant of what "theory" means in a scientific context, like most Creationists.

I was taught evolution in school. I also studied creationism, after meeting my husband - my MIL was the curator at a Creationism Research museum for many years. My children know both sides.

Oh boy. Wow. Really? Why would someone educate their children wrongly on purpose?

The idea that 'liberal' areas are more tolerant is laughable. And extremely small minded. By your own example, there was no outrage at a HIGH school. Your elementary social studies teacher wasn't forcing their agenda on you and insulting your parents, by your own words. There is a HUGE difference between 10 and 16.

Yes there is, and that should be a factor in how controversial material is presented. That does not necessarily mean it shouldn't be presented at all, however.

Our kids are dumb enough, why do you want them to be dumber?

[mlassoff]

Originally Posted by sskkc

That's your ignorance showing. Have you ever been to the Grand Canyon? A Creationism museum? Studied rather than just judged based on your childhood classroom experiences?

Yes, I have been to the Grand Canyon.

A Creationism Museum? No. I would not go to such a place that promotes myth as science. Such a place would be damaging to REAL science. Have you been to a community college biology class? Maybe that would help.

Perhaps instead of me studying at a creationism museum, you should take some college level courses in science, learn about the scientific method, biology, geology and genetics. That might help YOU to rely on actual science versus myth. Hell, even take a college level theology class and see the professor's perspective on biblical stories versus verifiable science. I think you'd be surprised what people educated in such matters think.

I have a feeling that the professors would say a lot of things that would offend your religious and political sensibilities. But since you claim to have an open mind, I'm sure you could handle it.