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I'm sure we've all heard the new Hawaiian Governor proclaiming he is going to put the "birther" story to rest by providing more information about obama's BC.
Why do you avoid the fact that the Senate of the US agreed that McCain's birth was not anything to use against him since his parents lived in the Canal Zone because his Navy father was there on orders from his government? Even Obama supported that one and it was one of the few things of the nature that he ever voted on.
Quite frankly, I don't even know what you mean about this comment. Ignore? Hardly. I was using the John McCain case, since it was recent, to show that while there is a clause in the Constitution about being a natural born citizen, it has not been codified. As such, the courts have no method to determine the means of determining a natural born citizen, determining who can bring suit to challenge a President's statements that he or she is a natural born citizen, and no definitive means to provide proof that a person is indeed a natural born citizen.
Yes, the Judciary Committee determined that John McCain could run but a larger question is why do they not do that for each Presidential candidate? That is because of the lack of guiding rules and laws pointing to the need and/or requirement to do so. It does not say in the Constitution that the Senate needs to do so, just that the President be a natural born citizen. Again, when and how is this question determined and who is to confirm this citizenship? Seems somewhat ad hoc currently.
Understand that you have questions concerning Obama's citizenship. Fine. However, this is a non-starter unless either Congress or the Supreme Court better define how the requirement of being a natural born citizen to run for President is executed.
The Constitution does not mention Birth Certificates but it does call for natural born citizens and TheWon has spent too much of his early age days in other nations. The fact that he won't allow real proof of where he was born tells me that he may know something that he doesn't want any of us to know.
Does it make any sense that if he was a citizen of Indonesia when he came to the US to go to college he had given up his citizenship and would have to become naturalized to get it back? Well, I know it doesn't to you and others who fear he isn't qualified, but it sure does to close to half the people in this country.
If he has violated that part of the Constitution I can see progressives from this day on howling about it happening once so why not from now on?
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy
My God, woman, many more than 1/3 of our voters voted for McCain and you say that only 1/3 don't want TheWon to be our President. I guess you weren't around in 2004 when the grades of Bush and Carry were made public, were you? You weren't around when Rather told his lies about Bush and his service record. We know nothing about this man other than what was said in those two books that were written under strange circumstances. I don't think that one President before him was as little known as he is but then I may not be far enough left to be complaining.
Who decides who spends TOO MUCH TIME IN OTHER NATIONS? You? What about all those kids of American diplomats who spend hardly any time in the US?
A lot of people did not even go to the polls, others voted for independents, so I guess saying one third of the population do not want him is pretty accurate, the other two thirds are indifferent or like him.
Just because you know nothing, does not mean others don't, either.
Since you are accusing him of something, doesn't your law say that you have to prove he did something wrong, rather than he has to prove his innocence?
He might not be a great president, but still, he is quite intelligent. Do you really think he is so stupid as to even try to become president if he knew he was not eligible? He would have known that he couldn't silence everybody and hide everything from all the journalists etc.
I am not a woman, by the way, no idea why so many here think I am...
"We have to take a look at what we can do with that. But I can't imagine that we can't find some way to see to it that those who are honest about it, who don't have a personal agenda, could have no further argument about it," he said.
What's the problem? Ask obama to release his LF. What's so hard about that?
Now, if Abbie quietly forgets about this, stops trying to find ways to get more information out there, that would be very suspicious.
There was indeed questions about John McCains status to be president because of his location of birth.
I know that most Birthers have worked so hard to make simple statements by people mean the opposite of what they clearly say that they now have problems with simple English comprehension... but please. Take a breath and respond to what I wrote, not what the voices in your head tell you I wrote.
There was exactly zero controversy regarding the circumstances of McCain's birth. Everybody knew and agreed that he was born in the canal zone, and nobody ever requested documentary proof of that fact.
And in this way you demonstrate that you have been paying exactly no attention to the real discussions that have been going on now for more than two years. Here... I will number the points so you can keep up.
1. McCain has to this day never released his birth certificate in any form. In fact, he has explicitly refused to do so when asked.
2. The certificate you link to is not John McCain's birth certificate. It is a rather clumsy forgery which can be proven simply by comparing the typewriter fonts for numbers at different places on the image.
Compare for example the "6" in the date of birth ("AUGUST 29, 1936") with the "6" in the time of birth ("6:25 PM). All of the information that is specific to John McCain on this certificate was typed using a different typewriter from the one that originally filled out this form. It is not just a fake. It is a bad one.
3. The certificate has been directly contradicted by John McCain himself. He was not born in Colon (as the fake certificate says) but on the Coco Solo Submarine base within the Canal Zone.
So... bottom line is that unlike President Obama who has released his birth certificate to the public and allowed independent journalists to inspect and photograph it, John McCain has never released his birth certificate at all.
Who decides who spends TOO MUCH TIME IN OTHER NATIONS? You? What about all those kids of American diplomats who spend hardly any time in the US?
A lot of people did not even go to the polls, others voted for independents, so I guess saying one third of the population do not want him is pretty accurate, the other two thirds are indifferent or like him.
Just because you know nothing, does not mean others don't, either.
Since you are accusing him of something, doesn't your law say that you have to prove he did something wrong, rather than he has to prove his innocence?
He might not be a great president, but still, he is quite intelligent. Do you really think he is so stupid as to even try to become president if he knew he was not eligible? He would have known that he couldn't silence everybody and hide everything from all the journalists etc.
I am not a woman, by the way, no idea why so many here think I am...
Oh yes, the details of his birth, via location were indeed questioned. In fact, I believe the Senate voted on a resolution about his eligibility.
This is a complete and utter falsehood. The details of his birth were never questioned at all.. they were acknowledged by all and were never in question. The Senate Resolution was passed without anybody even asking to see a copy of his birth certificate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanrene
That was speculation on the part of Matthews and the others, since the poll never asked about those that "don't care". You should watch it again so you get it right. Next time pay attention.
Someday you will write something true and I will throw a party.
Rather than "speculation" it was a correct observation that the polling questions could not distinguish between between "don't know and have doubts" and "don't know and don't care).
It is meretricious spin to assert that 43% of Americans have actual doubts.
If TheWon was a citizen of Indonesia when he came to Occidental College then he had been naturalized there and that calls for giving up US citizenship.
Even ignoring that the US State Department has testified under oath and in court that President Obama was never an Indonesian citizen, no. It does not. You have been misinformed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy
What records from Columbia do you know about? Have you read his Master's Thesis, just to learn the topic?
I do not know the Master's theses of any American presidents. But then again, since there is no Constitutional requirement that Presidents even be college graduates (Truman was not one) I really do not particularly care.
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy
Too much there for him to keep from us and it bothers me that so many, like you, don't want to know about the man's early days, just in case we would learn about his socialistic tendencies.
There is more available writing about this President's "early days" (to include two autobiographies) than any modern President since Kennedy. Please, do not mistake your personal willful ignorance concerning his "early days" with an actual lack of information on the subject.
Does it make any sense that if he was a citizen of Indonesia when he came to the US to go to college he had given up his citizenship and would have to become naturalized to get it back?
the "indonesian citizenship" myth can be debunked in 2minutes by anyone willing to do a simple web search. look up two things:
A): indonesian citizenship requirements.
- must be at least 18 or married ( presumably to an indonesian citizen ).
- must have lived in country 5 consecutive years or 10 non-consecutive.
- must be employed.
- may not have dual citizenship ( obama would have to renounce US citizenship )
obama met none of these requirements.
B): renouncing US citizenship
- the US state department does not allow a 6-10 year old to renounce citizenship and nothing a mother, father or step-father can do will affect that.
So you don't think that there was a really "good" reason for him to seal all records about his earlier life.
Not a single record of his early life has ever been "sealed." This is merely a Birther lie that never dies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy
You think that a book, that may well have been written by a man who was one of the worst rebels of the 1960s, but is supposed to have been written by TheWon has to be the only record we have about his early life. I wish the Constitution could be seen as a base for our government and not something to run around when it works well for some people.
Search Amazon. His autobiographies (which he actually did write himself) are hardly the only record.
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