Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
"In 1985, while Hawking was working on his first book A Brief History of Time, he fell ill with pneumonia while at CERN (a large particle accelerator) in Geneva, Switzerland. It was suggested that Hawking be taken off life support, but his family chose against this. He was flown to Addenbrooke's Hospital in Cambridge, England where a tracheotomy was performed. The tracheotomy saved his life, but left him without use of his voice. As a supplement, he uses a computer system equipped with an electronic voice."
That was 1985. He has already lived another 25 years beyond the point at which this "death panel" wanted to pull the plug, and he is still alive today.
We, as humans, are not capable of making these decisions for others.
The Eskimos had enough sense to put their older folks on a block of ice and let them float away when they could no longer fend for themselves. People who retire at 60-65 and live to 90-95 are a non productive block of our society and we keep living longer.
My mom is 98 and still walks every day. We visit her and two hours later she might remember that someone came by but she gets it mixed up about which one of us it was. She may live five more years and not be able to remember anything. Should she be granted a heart bypass or transplant at a cost of 10's or 100's of thousands?
My wife and I are well into the "aging" group. We both have a living will with DNR clause and have stated that we do not want to be kept alive by machines or artificial methods. Each has appointed the other with "power of attorney."
Everybody's gonna die and if we let our elderly take down the remainder of our system we're fools and deserve what we get.
I'll challenge you, just like Obama should have challenged the purveyor's of Republican lies about "death panels," to show me just how, and where in the proposed rule, a VOLUNTARY Doctor/patient discussion about how the patient wishes to be treated at the end of his life is in any way, shape or form, a denial of services?
This is an inflaming issue, used just to rile people up, for and against. It is not an issue of any real major significance.
It's only an issue of significance because the President never fought back against the "death panel" lie.
Here's the REAL problem though: The GOP has vowed to overturn the health care reform act and have even scheduled a vote on it next week. I once said it didn't have a chance in hell of passing, but I'm not so sure now.
If the President won't even defend the least, insignificant part of what he himself calls his "signature" achievement as President, can he be expected to defend the rest of it? It certainly looks doubtful at this moment, doesn't it? Worse, his Democratic supporters in Congress can see his lack of spine as well as anyone else. How much to you think they'll rush to support a President who's a wimp in the face of opposition and might run off and leave them dangling again, just as he did during the past election?
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,327 posts, read 54,350,985 times
Reputation: 40731
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphamale
Yet again, liberal/progressive's show their lack of respect for innocent life.
This of course as opposed to those true humanitarian Republicans doing their absolute best to improve health care for every American, right? How much longer 'til you're offering a fine deal on a bridge in Brooklyin?
Just another case of the squeky wheel getting the grease. I wish the President had not backed down on this issue, maybe he has a good reason I sure would like to hear what it was. One More Time, end of life planning has nothing to do with cutting off funds to those in need, the death panels never existed, it is nothing more than pandering to a bunch of rightwing right to lifers that do not want the elderly to make the choice to stop their own treatments and live out their life as thy see fit. FYI, next time anyone whines on about the costs of Medicare or Obamacare, remind them that they added Millions or is it Billions to the cost because some doctors will have to treat a patient even if that treatment will not do a thing except prolong the suffering for a couple more months of life at best. Get a living will, make sure your doctor has a copy.
Casper
This of course as opposed to those true humanitarian Republicans doing their absolute best to improve health care for every American, right? How much longer 'til you're offering a fine deal on a bridge in Brooklyin?
Health Care could be improved by doing two things.
Tort reform and allowing FULL competition between states.
Much better than a 2000+ page bill which nobody understands.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,327 posts, read 54,350,985 times
Reputation: 40731
Quote:
Originally Posted by florida.bob
Any responsible Doctor does end of life counseling anyway, they are just not yet going to be allowed to bill for their time. When this no longer becomes a hot button phony issue, our HC system will deal with it correctly. The Doctors should be paid for their efforts, eventually, they will when it no longer is a political ping pong ball. Basically, when FOX decides it's OK for the GOP to let this go.
I don't know, my personal experience dealing with end of life issues with family members seems to indicate some doctors are as concerned with the bottom line as they are with life. Otherwise, why continue expensive treatment(s) contributing absolutely nothing to quality of life?
The Eskimos had enough sense to put their older folks on a block of ice and let them float away when they could no longer fend for themselves. People who retire at 60-65 and live to 90-95 are a non productive block of our society and we keep living longer.
My mom is 98 and still walks every day. We visit her and two hours later she might remember that someone came by but she gets it mixed up about which one of us it was. She may live five more years and not be able to remember anything. Should she be granted a heart bypass or transplant at a cost of 10's or 100's of thousands?
My wife and I are well into the "aging" group. We both have a living will with DNR clause and have stated that we do not want to be kept alive by machines or artificial methods. Each has appointed the other with "power of attorney."
Everybody's gonna die and if we let our elderly take down the remainder of our system we're fools and deserve what we get.
At this point you and your wife are going to cost me more than your Mother . Why don't you drop off your sweet old Mom at my house , to sit with my rehabbing from cancer Mom .
Then you and your wife can take poison and drop dead.
The Eskimos had enough sense to put their older folks on a block of ice and let them float away when they could no longer fend for themselves. People who retire at 60-65 and live to 90-95 are a non productive block of our society and we keep living longer.
My mom is 98 and still walks every day. We visit her and two hours later she might remember that someone came by but she gets it mixed up about which one of us it was. She may live five more years and not be able to remember anything. Should she be granted a heart bypass or transplant at a cost of 10's or 100's of thousands?
My wife and I are well into the "aging" group. We both have a living will with DNR clause and have stated that we do not want to be kept alive by machines or artificial methods. Each has appointed the other with "power of attorney."
Everybody's gonna die and if we let our elderly take down the remainder of our system we're fools and deserve what we get.
I love the compassion of the left.
Nice to see you put money ahead of people.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Instead, we've got a President whose first impulse is to run for cover when the going gets tough...
