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so we agree to disagree.....
but this has been one of the biggest chest thumping p$ssing match I have read in a while but by stating I have an opinion and you have the reality is just more of the same,you dont wish to learn from any of this you only want to enforce your beliefs on those who think different.......much like my Ole profs tried it didnt work way back then and it taint workin now
good night
This is something you're 'proud" of? That you learned nothing.
He should have attacked Saudi Arabia, which is where the majority of the hijackers came from. So no, he did not do the right thing...
Did he do everything that cold be defined as "right". of course not - the premise is silly on its face. Me thinks you like to play silly word games instead of engage in rational debate.
This is something you're 'proud" of? That you learned nothing.
ahh once again if someone doesn't agree y'all attack....I didn't take part in the political agenda they were peddling,I feel they should have taught responsibility rather than rewarding people for irresponsible action so you interpret it as not learning...... a standard response is if you dont think as I do your not in reality or stupid and didnt learn.........g o figure!
I didn't claim I had the reality, nor did I begin talking to you about your experience with liberal brainwashing college profs. Feel free to keep your opinion to yourself next time.
and I offer you the same choice you are all getting to worked up over sumthun 40 years ago....get a life
I gave my thoughts on the "great society " which you dont agree cant you except people are all different? I dont think you are stupid or uneducated for your thoughts why do I receive this rant from you
Only the Commander in Chief can make the decision to commit troops. We were attacked and Bush did the right thing by responding to ALL threats from that region.
Wow... for real?
Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11. Saudi Arabia had far more to do with it and nothing has been addressed there as it would destabilize the region. and while some whackballs think we can handle it. you have no idea what fervor would be seen until the West attacks Mecca...
and no Johnson didn't start the war nor did he cause the poverty among blacks.
I also don't agree that he would not have won reelection had he run. It would have been a totally different outcome had he run against Nixon.
For Bush, he lied about the reason for the war for whatever purpose. He caused the deaths of over a million people and for what? We are not more secure, we haven't stabilized the area, we devastated our deficit and economy, we have no real end in sight, a billion dollar embassy is a long term commitment as are the multiple bases established. Our plight in Afghanistan will be no different that that of the USSR. We have nothing that will be gained and we will continue to sacrifice our young...
It was a bad decision then and even more so now. This thread was started on poor history and has declined further.
We were involved there long before whatever may have happened in the Gulf of Tonkin for no reason other than an inane fear of the mere word Communism and the baseless 'Domino Theory'. I tried reading Robert McNamara's book, hoping I might find something to justify Vietnam, not far into it he basically admits we knew little about Vietnam but went anyway, I read no further. I sincerely hope he spends two eternities in hell for sending people off to a war with no purpoise.
Over the last couple of months I have been investigating the possible role that Lyndon Johnson played in the assassination of John F. Kennedy. Several writers have pointed out that LBJ was the main beneficiary of Kennedy’s death. He was also involved in persuading Kennedy to visit Texas. At the time there was a bitter dispute going on in the Democratic Party in Texas. Johnson and John Connally were seen as the leaders of the right-wing faction, whereas Ralph Yarborough led the liberal wing committed to civil rights (so much so that Connally and Johnson accused him of being a communist). Conservatives were also concerned that Yarborough was having a growing influence on Kennedy’s views on civil rights. (Yarborough was the only member of the Senate representing a former Confederate state to vote for every significant piece of civil rights legislation during the 1950s and 1960s).
Johnson and Connally went back a long way. Connally had ran all of Johnson’s election campaigns. In 1948 Connally was accused of fraud when he discovered at the last moment the existence of 200 votes for Johnson from Jim Wells County. It was these votes that gave Johnson an eighty-seven-vote victory.
On the morning of the assassination Johnson attempted to get the seating arrangements changed. For some strange reason he wanted Connally to be in his car and for Yarborough to go with Kennedy. This was a surprising idea as this would have given extra status to his political opponent. Connally clearly was not part of the conspiracy as he insisted in going in Kennedy’s car.
The first person to accuse Johnson of being involved in the conspiracy was a historian and failed politician called James Evetts Haley. His book ‘A Texan Looks at Lyndon’ was a best seller and it is claimed that in Texas only the Bible outsold Haley's book in 1964. In the book Haley attempted to expose Johnson's corrupt political activities. This included a detailed look at the relationship between Johnson and Billie Sol Estes. Haley pointed out that three men who could have provided evidence in court against the corrupt activities of Estes, George Krutilek, Harold Orr and Howard Pratt, all died of carbon monoxide poisoning from car engines. (He gave it the name “a Texas suicide”).
Haley also suggested that Johnson might have been responsible for the death of John F. Kennedy: "Johnson wanted power and with all his knowledge of political strategy and his proven control of Congress, he could see wider horizons of power as Vice-President than as Senate Majority Leader. In effect, by presiding over the Senate, he could now conceive himself as virtually filling both high and important positions - and he was not far from wrong. Finally, as Victor Lasky pointed out, Johnson had nursed a lifetime dream to be President. As Majority leader he never could have made it. But as Vice-president fate could always intervene."
The book received little publicity outside Texas (Haley had published it himself rather than use a national company). The journalist, Joachim Joesten, read the book and quoted extensively from it in his book ‘The Dark Side of Lyndon Baines Johnson’ (1968). Joesten argued that Johnson was embroiled in two major scandals in 1963 (the cases of Billie Sol Estes and Bobby Baker). Johnson was now a political liability and was seriously considering replacing him as his running mate in 1964. This appeared to be the case as Robert Kennedy had already started briefing against Johnson concerning the cases of Billie Sol Estes and Bobby Baker.
Joesten also took the view that Texas oil barons led by Haroldson L. Hunt and Clint Murchison had helped to fund the assassination. In 1963 Kennedy was talking about bringing an end to the oil depletion allowance (27.5 per cent). It remained unchanged during the Johnson presidency. This resulted in a saving of over 100 million dollars to the American oil industry. Soon after Johnson left office it dropped to 15 per cent.
Joesten’s book could not find a publisher in America but it eventually found a small company in England to take a chance with the book. In America Joesten was accused of working for the KGB (Joesten had been a member of the Communist Party in Germany before leaving the country when Hitler gained power). It was claimed by the extreme-right that Joesten’s book was an attempt to cover-up KGB’s role in the assassination.
Although James Evetts Haley and Joachim Joesten are able to explain why Johnson and his backers wanted Kennedy dead, they were unable to provide any actual evidence that he was involved in the assassination.
The campaign against Johnson as the man behind the assassination of Kennedy appeared to come to an end by the end of the 1960s. However, there was one man who was still working on the case. His name was Clint Peoples. As a Texas Ranger he was involved in the original investigation of Billy Sol Estes. He retired from the force in March, 1974 but continued to work on the case. He was especially interested in the death of a Department of Agriculture official called Henry Marshall. Peoples was interested in Marshall because at the time he was investigating the corrupt activities of Estes. Marshall was found dead on 3rd June 1961. Officially he had committed suicide but Peoples suspected he had been murdered.
In 1984 Peoples convinced Estes to give evidence before the Robertson County Grand Jury. Estes testified that Lyndon B. Johnson, Mac Wallace, Cliff Carter and himself met several time to discuss the investigation being carried out by Henry Marshall. According to Estes, Johnson eventually said: "Get rid of him," and Wallace was given the assignment. In 1984 the Grand Jury changed the verdict on the death of Henry Marshall from suicide to death by gunshot.
On 9th August, 1984, Estes' lawyer, Douglas Caddy, wrote to Stephen S. Trott at the US Department of Justice. In the letter Caddy claimed that Billie Sol Estes, Lyndon B. Johnson, Mac Wallace and Cliff Carter had been involved in the murders of Henry Marshall, George Krutilek, Harold Orr, Ike Rogers, Coleman Wade, Josefa Johnson, John Kinser and John F. Kennedy. Caddy added: "Mr. Estes is willing to testify that LBJ ordered these killings, and that he transmitted his orders through Cliff Carter to Mac Wallace, who executed the murders."
The problem with this evidence is that Billie Sol Estes is a convicted ****** and very few people took his claims seriously. Once again the attempts to link Johnson to the assassination appeared to have come to a halt. Although the publication of the transcripts of Johnson’s telephone conversations revealed that he was heavily involved in the cover-up. The conversations between Johnson and Hoover are particularly illuminating. (For more details see Michael R. Beschloss’s book, Taking Charge: The Johnson White House Tapes: 1963-64, Simon & Schuster, 1997). An interesting aside, the Johnson and Hoover friendship dated back to the FBI investigation of the 1948 ballot-rigging case.
On 24th February, 1992, Madeleine Brown gave an interview on the television show, A Current Affair. Brown claimed that on the 21st November, 1963, she was at the home of Clint Murchison. Others at the meeting included J. Edgar Hoover, Clyde Tolson, John J. McCloy, Richard Nixon and Haroldson L. Hunt. At the end of the evening Lyndon B. Johnson arrived: "Tension filled the room upon his arrival. The group immediately went behind closed doors. A short time later Lyndon, anxious and red-faced, re-appeared. I knew how secretly Lyndon operated. Therefore I said nothing... not even that I was happy to see him. Squeezing my hand so hard, it felt crushed from the pressure, he spoke with a grating whisper, a quiet growl, into my ear, not a love message, but one I'll always remember: "After tomorrow those goddamn Kennedys will never embarrass me again - that's no threat - that's a promise."
He did the right things, plural. Get over it and be thankful that your hide is still intact.
Oh yea...what right things? He tanked the war in Iraq for nearly 4 years before deciding on a surge to fix the problem. He didn't pacify Afghanistan before pulling out resources to attack Iraq. He strengthened Iran's hand in the region. And oh yea...Iraq's oil was going to pay for the whole shebang.
Right thing? Stop it....just..stop!
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it didnt work way back then and it taint workin now
...I didn't take part in the political agenda they were peddling,I feel they should have taught responsibility rather than rewarding people for irresponsible action so you interpret it as not learning......
a standard response is if you dont think as I do your not in reality or stupid and didnt learn.........
