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Location: Somewhere gray and damp, close to the West Coast
20,955 posts, read 5,545,820 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayland Woman
Because it's true. Being teased by a bully is temporary. Going through a divorce is temporary. The depression of dealing with a new disability is temporary, etc. etc. 99% of the reasons why people think about committing suicide are temporary problems that can be overcome with help. If a person is interested enough they can educate themselves on what to look for in a person who is suicidal so they can evaluate them enough to know when intervention is appropriate. Lots of online tools out there to help with that. Family members, friends, teachers, etc., CAN with accuracy judge when it's time to step in and get their loved one some help.
What if the disability is an issue of lifelong diminished quality of life? I took a prescribed drug that left me in severe, chronic, intractable pain and depression which may very well be the case for the rest of my life. There is a strong movement away from providing adequate pain relief -- basically doctors are getting more and more reluctant (read: "chickenchit" due to pressure from big pHARMa) to prescribe strong pain medication. Couple that with the stigma attached to dependency on opiates, which may vary depending on what part of the country you live in -- the stigmatization is rampant in the small town I live in.
Now, take a look at this forum and read the cruel comments people make about people like me. I can be functional and productive when I have adequate pain relief, which is about three hours a day on average right now. How many posters in C-D consider me a burden on the system because I depend on disability payments from the government? From what I've read, A LOT OF THEM!
I am also acutely aware of and realistic about the burden that I place on an overloaded system, and I don't like it. Add the fear, which I think is a very realistic fear, that the system is going to eventually dump me because I'm not a "productive" member of society.
Now add the fact that I am an intelligent person who absolutely understands the facts about the commonest forms of depression, which can be mitigated by many things. I've lived and coped pretty well with depression all my adult life, no big deal. But the depression I have now does not respond to medication -- I've tried literally dozens of them -- and it does not respond to any kind of therapy I've gone through. Just take my word for it, the drug that my doctor prescribed for me pretty much rewired my brain and the depression is not going away.
Add to that the fact that I have no legal recourse for trying to get some restitution from the drug company. I have attempted to get a consultation with uncounted numbers of firms that advertise their class action suits on behalf of people who have taken the drug that injured me. Basically, they all say they only wish to represent the survivors of people who have committed suicide as a result of taking this drug. A settlement from the drug manufacturer would go a long way towards easing the burden I am to the system. However, the law profession says I'm worth more dead than alive.
Now, paint a rosy picture of recovery for me. Tell my loved ones what signs to look out for and what to do when I feel suicidal.
Nevermind, because they are realistic about it and support my right to decide when I am done dealing with this. My brother decided to discontinue cancer treatment which, in effect, was suicide. No one would have dared to step in and try to stop him from doing just what he did. What's the difference? Did I leave anything out?
No they didn't "seek out my assistance." They weren't on a suicide prevention hot-line if that's what you're getting at. Hooking people up with resources, whether they ask for them or not, is not "forcing" help on anyone. However, there were a few occasions where the police were called to intervene and that decision was made by a three person panel who reviewed the chat transcripts with a suicidal person against our 'suicide threads' policy before that call was made.
So some did it of their own free will and some were forced to seek help.
so the term is use din contemempt .
Typical of that poster to label all religions with contempt and all people who believe in religions in contempt. with that much hate for religions i guess civil talk with that poster is not possible
Should someone with Alzheimers be able to kill themselves if they so chose?
People with Alzheimer's often kill themselves by not eating. Sometimes on purpose, sometimes because they can't remember how and/or when to eat. It's not a choice if they cognitively can't find their way to the kitchen. This is not in the same category as someone who is clinically depressed and suicidal. Nursing homes don't force feed Alzheimer's patients or people with terminal illnesses. They don't intervene in the same way families, friends, caring strangers and the medical community does if a teenager is playing Russia roulette with a gun in his hand.
But Alzheimers affects your mental condition,it is also not of your own doing and so I would guess should fall under the 'take away their rights for their own good' category.
Of course isn't substance addiction also out of a person's control?
Suicidal behavior - not a symptom of Alzheimer's. So we're moving into the apples and oranges category.
The underlying disorder involved in some substance abuse is out of someone's control; the choice to use (although much stronger urges in some than others; not trying to minimize the difficulty here) is still a choice. Recovering alcoholics have an underlying disorder and choose not to use alcohol - see what I'm saying?
While we're straying off topic, what are your thoughts on drunk driving?
Quote:
Originally Posted by oz in SC
Surely you believe the written word can influence behavior?
Whether for good or bad.
What I believe and what I can support with facts are two different things. So what I believe is pretty irrelevant here. Unless we can talk about documented reliable evidence of books causing harm, I'm not interested in pursuing this line of conversation.
People with Alzheimer's often kill themselves by not eating. Sometimes on purpose, sometimes because they can't remember how and/or when to eat. It's not a choice if they cognitively can't find their way to the kitchen. This is not in the same category as someone who is clinically depressed and suicidal. Nursing homes don't force feed Alzheimer's patients. They don't intervene in the same way families, friends, caring strangers and the medical community does if a teenager is playing Russia roulette with a gun in his hand.
There is an increased risk of suicides amongst Alzheimers sufferers.
http://www.suite101.com/content/older-people-with-dementia-at-high-suicide-risk-a193866 (broken link)
It is an illness affecting the brain.
Should their right to choose be taken away like you want to take away the right to choose from mentally ill people?
There is an increased risk of suicides amongst Alzheimers sufferers.
Older People With Dementia at High Suicide Risk: High Risk of Suicide in Elderly With Alzheimer's Disease (http://www.suite101.com/content/older-people-with-dementia-at-high-suicide-risk-a193866 - broken link)
It is an illness affecting the brain.
Should their right to choose be taken away like you want to take away the right to choose from mentally ill people?
Just because there is an increased risk of suicide does not make it a symptom.
There is a difference between something correlated with and something symptomatic of.
Well, then you haven't been on some of the forums I've been on where there is an entire section devoted to those intend to do just that or another forum splattered with the Nat'l suicide prevention phone number all over the place.
As to why I'd do it? Probably for the same reason I called the cops on a friend when she OD'd and they found her dead and resuscitated her.
Why would you do that if she purposely OD'd?
I don't believe that I have the right to do that to someone else.
Talk about meddling.
Nope, I don't bother with suicide forums. Have no desire to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistygrl092
Not sure who I am responding to, but if someone is in a professional capacity they have an ethical and legal responsibility to report anyone who is a danger to self to the proper authorities.
And are you in a professional capacity when you hang out on suicide forums?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistygrl092
What's with the language today? Again, I submit, someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning.
I am not controlling anyone, but I have worked with the mentally ill so I know a thing or two. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem - unless terminal and you know my thoughts on that.
This is not your decision to make.
Projecting much?
Last edited by chielgirl; 01-26-2011 at 01:10 PM..
Why would you do that if she purposely OD'd?
I don't believe that I have the right to do that to someone else.
Talk about meddling.
Nope, I don't bother with suicide forums. Have no desire to.
And are you in a professional capacity when you hang out on suicide forums?
I guess your ti busy hating christains to worry about suicide. OZ has this right they can do what they want
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