Here, here for a split government! (party affiliation, Congress, Pelosi, health care)
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I enjoyed the SOTU speech last night, and I found the transcripts and read them. Clearly Obama has some impressive abilities to tackle complex topics in fairly clear language. However, what also impressed me was this it was very clear that he was necessarily addressing the very real budgetary and fiscal concerns. He knows that he has no chance in hell of getting any of his ideas through unless he really thinks about and acts on the fiscal issues. I think BO struck a good balance of communicating that he "got the memo" of the Tea Party revolution, but also fired back with some of his own reforms, like the need to make lobbying time public. I really have a hard time thinking he would have tried so hard if it were all dems.
Clinton had to do the same thing with Gingrich and co. One of the weaknesses of the first few years of Bush II and of Obama/Pelosi is a sense that, "we have the capital and we're going to spend it." Leads to woolly thinking and larded, corrupt legislation with "no lobbyist left behind." I think that extra need to justify what you are doing to a potentially hostile audience, and ask the tough questions upfront is a very good thing for our country. I am not first to say any of this, but it struck me very forcefully last night, and made me proud of my country.
I really have a hard time thinking he would have tried so hard if it were all dems.
I think he has tried, and probably will try again, and fail. As an individual, he can only go so far. The only way to get things done properly just might be to engage politicians in an open debate, in front of the populace. Frank questions, and discussing every bit of disagreement with concerns. But then, not even the moderated presidential debates would qualify as such. The closest thing that came to it might be the republicans inviting Obama to their meeting and engaging in debate (last year) with cameras rolling. However, such "incidences" have been avoided since.
The other thing that came about while watching the speech was that while many clamor for a third or fourth party, I was thinking, why not... no party? People elect their representative regardless of party affiliation and send them to be the govern rather than prescribe to party-line thinking and solutions. In other words, the idea of every congressman (and woman) being an independent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest
Sounds like you enjoyed the pep rally.
What said that would lead you to believe there will be a serious attempt address the deficit?
There is a better chance of seeing attempts at addressing the deficit than for anybody to have a logical conversation on the subject with you. I will leave it at that.
Well, it helps to stop that destructive runaway train that we had in place before the last election. I find it funny how the tone has changed. The democrats did whatever they wanted and were general donkeys, but now they are wanting co-operation. Yes, it is good that they are now having to consider the other half of the country when they go about their business.
If they really want to do what they should, the senate should repeal the bad health plan in a spirit of co-operation. This would show that they are really serious in trying to do what the people want.
Regardless of the way that the Senate and House leadership function, I agree that Obama sees the need to work together, but I think he was coming from where he's been all along--he's a moderate. He's said from day one that compromise and reaching across the isle is the way to get things done in a way that works for everyone. He ran on that. He's going to tick off the Dem's big time by supporting torte reform, but the R's lobby is freaking about cuts in subsidies to big oil. I think he's about the only grownup in the bunch.
Well, it helps to stop that destructive runaway train that we had in place before the last election. I find it funny how the tone has changed. The democrats did whatever they wanted and were general donkeys, but now they are wanting co-operation. Yes, it is good that they are now having to consider the other half of the country when they go about their business.
If they really want to do what they should, the senate should repeal the bad health plan in a spirit of co-operation. This would show that they are really serious in trying to do what the people want.
I'm going to preface this by saying right out that I'm not a liberal, so I'm not trying to put a partisan spin on this. The R's in the Senate filibustered about everything they could during the last 2 years--down to what should have been simple appointments for federal jobs. That's not working with the other side, and when the folks you're refusing to work with get fed up with the stall tactics, you get what you got with health care reform--they did it without you. People who play games sometimes have them turned on them.
Being in agreement that restructuring of the government is necessary, freezing federal incomes, willing to consider cuts to Medicare, and Defense Dept cuts, are some of the things President Obama mentioned in his SOTU that would lower the deficit. When talking of the need for investment in education and research, he said how it would be funded. That's a start. I agree that we need to invest in education and research, along with reducing the deficit. Clinton was able to balance the budget because at the same time, computer technology was exploding in the US and brought in new revenues, jobs and tax sources. I don't see that same innovation today, unless we are willing to invest in research and education.
CNN had a panelist last night from Britain. He said Britain has recently been through the same cost cutting measures we are facing. The Brits knuckled under, took the cuts, and now as a result, they have found that their economy has also been cut back. Maybe out of control deficit reduction isn't going to be the answer the right thinks it will be.
I agree, having a two party system is a good thing when it works together so that the US benefits as a whole. The right won't get all it wants, and the left won't get all it wants. Compromise and a willingness to listen instead of shouting is needed.
Being in agreement that restructuring of the government is necessary, freezing federal incomes, willing to consider cuts to Medicare, and Defense Dept cuts, are some of the things President Obama mentioned in his SOTU that would lower the deficit. When talking of the need for investment in education and research, he said how it would be funded. That's a start. I agree that we need to invest in education and research, along with reducing the deficit. Clinton was able to balance the budget because at the same time, computer technology was exploding in the US and brought in new revenues, jobs and tax sources. I don't see that same innovation today, unless we are willing to invest in research and education.
CNN had a panelist last night from Britain. He said Britain has recently been through the same cost cutting measures we are facing. The Brits knuckled under, took the cuts, and now as a result, they have found that their economy has also been cut back. Maybe out of control deficit reduction isn't going to be the answer the right thinks it will be.
I agree, having a two party system is a good thing when it works together so that the US benefits as a whole. The right won't get all it wants, and the left won't get all it wants. Compromise and a willingness to listen instead of shouting is needed.
It's an adapt or become obsolete business climate out there. Cutting just delays the pain unless it's accompanied by a strategy to move us forward and out of the mess.
Clearly Obama has some impressive abilities to tackle complex topics in fairly clear language.
And what does that mean? I don't care how he speaks. Talk is cheap.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead
However, what also impressed me was this it was very clear that he was necessarily addressing the very real budgetary and fiscal concerns.
That's nice. He created the mess. And he wants to spend even more. He doesn't give a damn about "budgetary and fiscal concerns". If he is so concerned, why did he get us into this mess? Oh, yes ... he had some help from his Progressive pals in the House.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead
He knows that he has no chance in hell of getting any of his ideas through unless he really thinks about and acts on the fiscal issues.
Oh, what a joke!!! Are you serious? So, he is suddenly now fiscally conservative. Yet he proposed even more spending!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead
I think BO struck a good balance of communicating that he "got the memo" of the Tea Party revolution, but also fired back with some of his own reforms, like the need to make lobbying time public. I really have a hard time thinking he would have tried so hard if it were all dems.
Please! Are you really that easily manipulated?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead
Clinton had to do the same thing with Gingrich and co. One of the weaknesses of the first few years of Bush II and of Obama/Pelosi is a sense that, "we have the capital and we're going to spend it." Leads to woolly thinking and larded, corrupt legislation with "no lobbyist left behind." I think that extra need to justify what you are doing to a potentially hostile audience, and ask the tough questions upfront is a very good thing for our country. I am not first to say any of this, but it struck me very forcefully last night, and made me proud of my country.
Lord help us!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddlehead
What do you all think?
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Lord help us! 
