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Funny how no one ever tells the jews to shut up about the Holocaust, since it was their fellow whites who tried to exterminate them. Or the Indians, because it was Indian scouts who helped whites track down their fellow Indians. No...just the blacks. Slavery was ok because other "blacks" sold us into slavery.
This is why it's almost pointless to argue about the slavery angle. Slavery went from being a bad thing in this country, to now being acceptable because after all, it was blacks who perpetrated it upon their on people.
Really, why bother?
No one? I have. Not just about the holocaust either. To go on and on harping about their time in slavery in Egypt isn't a healthy thing from where I stand as outsider to their faith.
There's something about this habit of making an anniversary of pain I find distasteful in our collective culture. People lose their father to death-- they can choose to remember his birthday or the day he died. Which is more important, his life (his gift to me) or his death (what I feel I lost)?
Native Americans- is there more to your culture than a trail of tears? Same thing.
Slavery isn't OK. Why do you ignore it's happening in Dubai right this minute? Why is it irrelevant that asians do it to women right this minute? It's not ok, but for you it's only "not ok" if it's happening to you. Everyone else you could care less. Why is it ok for a black man to own slaves? Why is it OK for a 6yr old Haitian boy to be sold to a Domincan sugar cane farmer who is black? This didn't just start because an earthquake happened. It's been going on longer than I've been alive and nothing has stopped them from doing this to one another. Sure the sugar on your table isn't from Dominican Republic? Why are you feeding slavery? Why were you wearing clothes from the Marianna Islands 15yrs ago when forced labor was involved?
Slavery is abolished in America. Google human trafficking and behold-- what is going on in Africa? Human trafficking - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
How can they of all people still be engaged in slavery? Do they still not know any better or do they simply put a very low value on everyones lives?
The 'caucasian legacy of slavery' narrative is FOS.
Absolutely not, racism is taught and it would obviously depend on what kind of parents the child had growing up (that goes for both black and white South Africans). The sensationalist way that the media reports news these days would have you thinking that the country is on the brink of civil war which couldn't be farther away from the truth. It's always so easy to say that a child shouldn't be punished for the sins of his forefathers, but with SA, the inherited privilege is contrastively evident from a young age which is why it is easy to build resentment against the beneficiaries. Whether it is justified or not is irrelevant, it's life...
You've told on yourself. That kids inheritance is resentment even if there is no tangible benefit to being white. If someone decides to worship white it's all this kids fault and expect a punishment. Irrelevant? That's the racism you've complained about legitimately, but when racism changes color it's irrelevant to you. That's the FOS I'm talking about right there. Own your life and leave me alone with these petitions.
You've told on yourself. That kids inheritance is resentment even if there is no tangible benefit to being white. If someone decides to worship white it's all this kids fault and expect a punishment. Irrelevant? That's the racism you've complained about legitimately, but when racism changes color it's irrelevant to you. That's the FOS I'm talking about right there. Own your life and leave me alone with these petitions.
Who is worshiping white? I was responding to a question and in doing so, stated a view held by a significant portion of that country, yet somehow you seem hell-bent on scrutinizing every one of my posts. Please quote a comment of mine where I complained about racism, as you putting words in my mouth has gotten somewhat irritating. Also, I never made any references towards you in any of my posts so where you get off telling me to own my life and leave you alone with petitions is a little puzzling. PMS much?
I love threads like these because you get to see the hillbilly mentality of a lot of these posters (yokals) who are not qualified to speak about AA's or African immigrants. Blacks have contributed so much to the advancement of US culture and society. So when I see comments about Africans being much more hard working than Blacks, it tickles me. How can you make a comparison about who is smarter or work harder. There was a very ignorant comment about Asians being so motivated to excel! Have you ever set foot in China or Korea? Take a visit to Asia and come back and tell me that all Asians are smart or motivated. Your views are one sided because you are not worldly. If you have never seen a black person or been around black people, your perception of them will ultimately be shaped from your first contact. Most likely TV. Most of you hillbillies let TV and the nightly news shape your agenda about Blacks in the USA.
Of course it is. Keep in mind that these stories of Africans vs African Americans come from outsiders. They WANT it to be true so that it fits into their preconceived notions about African Americans. Trust me, it's not because they actually like black Africans....they just want to see us all pitted against each other.
More FOS. There's no excuse for abusing immigrants coming here honestly. It shouldn't happen and it does. Not by all of you but some of you. You're rude.
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter
Again, if you're not black, then you don't know because you aren't privy to intra-black relations. I know for a fact that even if it was true, i wouldn't be sharing that information with those outside of the community anyway.
Hard as it may be to believe some black folks aren't interested in having an intra-black relation with you because they don't care for the collusive attitude as if a whole other good old boy network has greeted them. And it HAS, and what's more they know it.
Does it go over your head that it makes them feel uncomfortable or is the whole world still revolving around your issues (according to you)?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava
If one is seen as a n*****r, treated like a n*****r, taught to think of themselves as a n*****r and knows nothing else, they become one. Most of my life has been spent straddling the line... on the one hand, I have an African father who in spite of being witness to half a life-time's worth of racist BS himself, he didn't come to America until he went to college... he already had an identity (of being normal). Being the minority in a country - and being the most despised minority at that - gives you a self-image that's anything but normal... even only fifty years ago, the media taught black americans that they were ugly, stupid, subservient failures... they continued to do this less-explicitly through Hollywood well into the early 90's.
On the other hand, I have an African-American mother whose own father and his 7 brothers used to shine shoes to eat scraps in Arkansas during Jim Crow. He's told me multiple times that he considered suicide when he was a kid because he "knew" that he was the absolute garbage of society. This society conditions blacks to think they're garbage and should only amount to garbage.
I've had to come to terms with my own questions of identity... to some on this board the obvious answer would be to ignore the n*****r mentality but they haven't been in these shoes... it's not that simple. To have one side of the family with a history of grief and pain solely because of their skin color and the other with no such history whatsoever is... interesting to say the least.
For those who want to point out Obama's election as the "end of racism", it's no coincidence that he's African. Obama grew up in a single-parent home and attended a very racist school in Hawaii for most of his teenage years. However, he knew he wasn't a n*****r since he was old enough to walk. It has as much to do with one's parents and their parents' background as it does with anything... back in the days of Jim Crow, being a black n*****r - a slave of the mind - was safer than being an intellectually free black man or woman. It's still true to an extent today.
Tragic doesn't begin to describe the last 100 years of African American history.
Tragic indeed when you consider the one fine day young (black & white) parents dream of today was already happening decades ago in rural suffolk county long island. I'm not here trying to diminish your sketch of Arkansas but to point out that it wasn't that way everywhere with everyone all the time as your broad brush paints. I know what normal looked like and so did the black kids in my neighborhood. Racism didn't need a special name all of it's own. We upheld common decency together. Integration was a foreign concept because we were never segregated to begin with. Even the old money never looked down at us and not one of us were made to believe what they had couldn't be earned. Being unfair or abusive to anyone was shunned or renounced by the sensibilities of our little town. Most of what people talk about today was as bizarre to us then as making comment about whites and blacks swimming in the same ocean. It was a non issue. City folks called us hicks and somehow we managed to get along without lawyers or much of a police department to speak about.
We were just being people, which isn't as complicated as people nowadays have made it. No ancestral resumes required. I think that's an element of why relations were at face value. There was far less baggage upon us (or perhaps most had made a conscious decision to rid themselves of baggage) than say southerners leaning on an identity based on 5 generations or more of a family farm. If they dropped one of daddy's habits it was an act of betrayal in their minds. My town USA everyone in some ways was a blank piece of paper. Our lives weren't etched in stone. Our minds were open about what the definition of black or white, Irish or Italian, Protestant or Catholic ad infinitum actually meant. You speak in terms of versus and there was no versus. It was apples and oranges, it's all fruit and everyone has to eat. If I have a house why can't he? Why should any of us envy? Any good thing you have only showed me what was possible for my own self if I put my mind to it kind of thing. The concept of having a vested interest in seeing anyone fail for the perverse pleasure of oppressing them is evil. Supremacy is evil. When I point at a supremacist and reject evil, southerners are told to believe it is the south I hate. Why do they choose to believe that?
This wasn't an upscale neighborhood, it was humble. Dirt roads and all. I don't think color tv existed when MLK and JFK were killed. My neighbors and I, our town, our nation, were mortified by whatever it was going on so far from us it felt like another country. Our neighborhood was heartbroken. You can stand here today and tell me the heartbreak for my black neighbors was far more significant than it was for myself or the other amorphous white blob neighbors but that's a lie of the mind. A bullet ripping through JFK or MLK- those bullets were ripping through OUR lives and OUR liberty. My eye was unchanged about my neighbors worth as a human being. His eye changed about me. Why did he choose to believe that? He could have kept faith in the relationship we forged, the town we built and upheld together, but he chose to listen to someone else. Someone like detroiter. Someone like calipoppy. The qualifier to be "one of them" is paranoia and hatred. It's not possible for me to prove I didn't do something and those bearing false witness ride for decades on those fables. Just like southerners claiming the north hates them. It's a baldfaced lie. If you want to deny I was a genuine friend that's on you. It's a conscious choice you (individually and collectively) made that you never wanted to own. I'm still me and I'm not waiting around for y'all to snap out of it. Common decency is this-a-way, not that-a-way. Not because I said so, but because our Constitution said so.
Love is not something you purchase or capture by preying. Clever gets you in trouble with love. My town USA was just like marriage. You can live in the garden of eden or you can live in hell. The common decency you uphold together makes it eden, and preying upon one another (psychologically, economically etc) makes it hell. Choose. That great white flight included those blacks who could not uphold common decency as lone wolves anymore than whites could. Aunt Marie (chosen family member, not by marriage) moved to Florida to retire. She didn't bother to tolerate malevolence either because no human being should have to. No matter who speaks it. No matter their color. What's especially repugnant about blacks rebranding supremacy is the very evil that abused their ancestors is the evil they embrace to abuse their children and urinate on their ancestors graves. How many more generations will they be indulged to abuse before they and KKK are given unanimous boot out the door? Neither one of them have any intention of being American and neither one of them belong here.
Aunt Marie was color blind despite a slave heritage and predated the wisdom of Maya Angelou by 85yrs with no media ado. Much love to her, may she rest in peace. That's the news you'll never hear. The media bias you're speaking of applies to all equally, not just blacks. 24/7 bad news for a century. Nothing going right is newsworthy. Good news and happy well adjusted people living a modest lifestyle are boring as hell. Everyone miserable enough yet? Whenever you're ready...
More FOS. There's no excuse for abusing immigrants coming here honestly. It shouldn't happen and it does. Not by all of you but some of you. You're rude.
Hard as it may be to believe some black folks aren't interested in having an intra-black relation with you because they don't care for the collusive attitude as if a whole other good old boy network has greeted them. And it HAS, and what's more they know it.
Does it go over your head that it makes them feel uncomfortable or is the whole world still revolving around your issues (according to you)?
Tragic indeed when you consider the one fine day young (black & white) parents dream of today was already happening decades ago in rural suffolk county long island. I'm not here trying to diminish your sketch of Arkansas but to point out that it wasn't that way everywhere with everyone all the time as your broad brush paints. I know what normal looked like and so did the black kids in my neighborhood. Racism didn't need a special name all of it's own. We upheld common decency together. Integration was a foreign concept because we were never segregated to begin with. Even the old money never looked down at us and not one of us were made to believe what they had couldn't be earned. Being unfair or abusive to anyone was shunned or renounced by the sensibilities of our little town. Most of what people talk about today was as bizarre to us then as making comment about whites and blacks swimming in the same ocean. It was a non issue. City folks called us hicks and somehow we managed to get along without lawyers or much of a police department to speak about.
We were just being people, which isn't as complicated as people nowadays have made it. No ancestral resumes required. I think that's an element of why relations were at face value. There was far less baggage upon us (or perhaps most had made a conscious decision to rid themselves of baggage) than say southerners leaning on an identity based on 5 generations or more of a family farm. If they dropped one of daddy's habits it was an act of betrayal in their minds. My town USA everyone in some ways was a blank piece of paper. Our lives weren't etched in stone. Our minds were open about what the definition of black or white, Irish or Italian, Protestant or Catholic ad infinitum actually meant. You speak in terms of versus and there was no versus. It was apples and oranges, it's all fruit and everyone has to eat. If I have a house why can't he? Why should any of us envy? Any good thing you have only showed me what was possible for my own self if I put my mind to it kind of thing. The concept of having a vested interest in seeing anyone fail for the perverse pleasure of oppressing them is evil. Supremacy is evil. When I point at a supremacist and reject evil, southerners are told to believe it is the south I hate. Why do they choose to believe that?
This wasn't an upscale neighborhood, it was humble. Dirt roads and all. I don't think color tv existed when MLK and JFK were killed. My neighbors and I, our town, our nation, were mortified by whatever it was going on so far from us it felt like another country. Our neighborhood was heartbroken. You can stand here today and tell me the heartbreak for my black neighbors was far more significant than it was for myself or the other amorphous white blob neighbors but that's a lie of the mind. A bullet ripping through JFK or MLK- those bullets were ripping through OUR lives and OUR liberty. My eye was unchanged about my neighbors worth as a human being. His eye changed about me. Why did he choose to believe that? He could have kept faith in the relationship we forged, the town we built and upheld together, but he chose to listen to someone else. Someone like detroiter. Someone like calipoppy. The qualifier to be "one of them" is paranoia and hatred. It's not possible for me to prove I didn't do something and those bearing false witness ride for decades on those fables. Just like southerners claiming the north hates them. It's a baldfaced lie. If you want to deny I was a genuine friend that's on you. It's a conscious choice you (individually and collectively) made that you never wanted to own. I'm still me and I'm not waiting around for y'all to snap out of it. Common decency is this-a-way, not that-a-way. Not because I said so, but because our Constitution said so.
Love is not something you purchase or capture by preying. Clever gets you in trouble with love. My town USA was just like marriage. You can live in the garden of eden or you can live in hell. The common decency you uphold together makes it eden, and preying upon one another (psychologically, economically etc) makes it hell. Choose. That great white flight included those blacks who could not uphold common decency as lone wolves anymore than whites could. Aunt Marie (chosen family member, not by marriage) moved to Florida to retire. She didn't bother to tolerate malevolence either because no human being should have to. No matter who speaks it. No matter their color. What's especially repugnant about blacks rebranding supremacy is the very evil that abused their ancestors is the evil they embrace to abuse their children and urinate on their ancestors graves. How many more generations will they be indulged to abuse before they and KKK are given unanimous boot out the door? Neither one of them have any intention of being American and neither one of them belong here.
Aunt Marie was color blind despite a slave heritage and predated the wisdom of Maya Angelou by 85yrs with no media ado. Much love to her, may she rest in peace. That's the news you'll never hear. The media bias you're speaking of applies to all equally, not just blacks. 24/7 bad news for a century. Nothing going right is newsworthy. Good news and happy well adjusted people living a modest lifestyle are boring as hell. Everyone miserable enough yet? Whenever you're ready...
I'm not painting anything with a broad brush. I said my grandfather had to shine shoes in Arkansas to eat and was treated like garbage. These are the facts. Whether you choose to assume I have an agenda against Arkansas - or care about Arkansas for that matter - is on you.
And please stop with the pointless "I've always been a friend to black people" pandering... the facts are that legally your neighbors were worth less than you no matter how well off they were or could become in the foreseeable future. Whether you made any conscious judgments is neither here nor there... I guarantee you your black neighbors knew that fact since they were old enough to talk.
Poor Black America is in the state it's in because a large contingent of the population decided they were fed up of playing a game nobody else wanted them to play in. It didn't matter that America was ****ing over its own economy by enslaving the minds of 15% of the potential workforce... the general attitude was that they'd rather be dead than produce competent, educated black workers. Perhaps you should read up on the conditions of black schools back in the day and even today in a lot of the poor urban midwest/south/east coast... the white schools of yesteryear are in many cases literally the black schools of today and haven't been renovated since whites fled them. One appalling account in particular is that of Jonathan Kozol and his career in East Saint Louis... sewage regularly flooded the classrooms and the pollution was so bad it was sending a lot of the students to the hospital.
This is not "ancient history" or some hidden agenda to separate ourselves from mainstream America... mainstream America separated itself from us and always has. However, you're right about one thing... the media never focuses on anything positive. Success makes ****ty TV
SILVER SPRING, Md., Aug. 27 — For a moment, the Ethiopian-born activist seemed to melt into the crowd, blending into the sea of black professors, health experts and community leaders considering how to educate blacks about the dangers of prostate cancer. But when he piped up to suggest focusing some attention on African immigrants, the dividing lines were promptly and pointedly drawn.
The focus of the campaign, the activist, Abdulaziz Kamus, was told, would be strictly on African-Americans.
''I said, 'But I am African and I am an American citizen; am I not African-American?''' said Mr. Kamus, who is an advocate for African immigrants here, recalling his sense of bewilderment. ''They said 'No, no, no, not you.'''
What do you think about it ? Sorry for the old article, but African immigrants and Haitian immigrants population boomed, so I guess it's good to know more about it
they are black racially but not african american ethnically..haitians are west indians not AA
Some of them appear to be motivated by the notion that, if they can somehow elevate African immigrants above American-born blacks, their stance against black Americans won't be seen as necessarily racist. It is a convenient way to dodge the racist label while giving themselves the liberty to project all manner of racist opinion onto black Americans. Let them spend a little time in Lagos and they'll come back saying the exact same things about Africans in general.
If main stream white America is saying that what few encounters or direct experiences they have with blacks is being confronted with rude or disrespectful attitudes I wouldn't call that racist on their part. I'd say that's inconsiderate or outright denial on your part. I'd also agree there are troll nonsense things fluffed up for agendas.
When it all comes down to dust I'm listening to two liars heaping tales taller and taller the crimes are only dug deeper for you both. You're both going to jail for perjury.
African immigrants succeed more because they get the same luxury of being the majority in their countries that white people get here. Whites here get programmed into thinking that it's "normal" for whites to be successful, which is why poor whites can be ignored and written off as "white trash" by their own people..
There's a difference between being poor and being trashy. Why should trash be spared the label trash just because they're white? Why should anyone be obliged or lie to themselves believing they're doing anyone a favor covering the bar tab for a drunk?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava
The only African immigrants you see making it stateside are the ones who came from wealthy-enough families to have a good education and afford the plane-ticket. There is no significant poor African segment in America because America isn't very close to Africa.
No one in the carribean counts? Immigrants from Haiti, Dominica, and Jamaica have set up small businesses in 5 borroughs NYC. Some on the books and some off. None I've met from those Islands could ever be considered wealthy by any stretch of the imagination, however, their upbringing made a significant difference between those who succeeded once they got here, and those who muddled along with the crowd aimlessly in life. Goal orientated were very centered/ grounded people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava
And the Asian stereotype is plain stupid... all one has to do is look at Chinatown in SF - the mecca for chinese in America - to see just how fraudulent this stereotype is. In assimilating, though, many middle and upper middle class Asians have taken the same attitude towards the poorer segment of their group as middle and upper middle class white people... its almost as if they don't exist.
Asian stereotype-- Asians are bothered by the fact that when their kids come here they might achieve in this generation but they watch after assimilation their grandchildren/ great grandchildren decline. So, is it American culture dumbing them down or is there something about Asian culture conducive to education excellence? I think it's a little of both but I can't say for sure anymore than you can.
As for the poorer segment of their group-- do you mean the asian gangs they want nothing to do with? Asians have trash and they don't want to carry trash on their backs? Human beings electing to act like animals are trash. They can't be helped. Explain why that's wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava
African Americans do not get the luxury of identity... they got defined by white Americans as n*****rs.
I've never used the word in my life. Neither has anyone in my family or anyone I've called a friend. I don't know those people, I don't want to know them, they're trashy. Why do trash get to define anyone? Ever? Why elevate an unqualified opinion to something epic?
This thread is just another attempt to divide and conquer. Get them fighting amongst themselves.
Now you can't have it both ways. If the mythological 'black community' is going to petition the citizens and the government forever over elusive maladies far beyond their ability to solve for themselves and America needs to address, talking about the nature of their problem in open forums isn't divide and conquer. Lets call it diagnosis and treatment plans. It's so much more dignified than shaking around a tin cup claiming the black community needs another telethon as if it's a 2,000 yr battle with muscular dystrophy. A few dozen burned down cities and Cabrini greens tends to make people threadbare about generosity. Perhaps you can relate? Like how disgusted liberals feel when 20 billion dollars is spent on a pig in a poke star wars nonsense. It's like that feeling, only worse, because the star wars pig in a poke doesn't whine, pout, stomp it's feet incessantly, claim you didn't help it or blame you for it's failure when you're paying the bills.
I don't associate that behavior with Africans or any legitimate culture. By universal standards most characterize it as childish. For some odd reason the black community seems to have embraced it as part of their "African-American" heritage. I find that unfortunate because there was an identity far less frivolous nearly half a century ago.
If this mythological black community prefers that we not exercise psychotherapy on mass scale for an amorphous blob of black people the majority have never met personally then perhaps it's time we re-frame the questions hence forth in terms of social ills and their causes. OR we could list comprehensively the root causes of poverty and their remedy because no population on the planet beyond all artificial boundaries or race/ creed is immune from poverty.
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The definition of FOS
