RANT-To The Blacks That Use This Word.......Thanks A Lot (URRRGH)

[desertdetroiter]

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

Nothing, but you should see all races as your family. I see blacks as my family as well, but I also see whites, Latinos, and every other race as my family as well.

You can't say you want equality, and then turn around and treat different races differently. If you treat a person of your race better than the others, just because they are of the same race, that is racism.

Fellow man is your family, regardless of color.

Fair enough.

It's not that i disagree with your general premise, but you can't tell me that i should disregard a few hundred years of a shared history. I can't help it that when i drive through South Dakota and finally see a black person, i feel a sense of relief and commonality despite the fact that we've never seen each other before. We will generally lock eyes immediately and speak to each other. There is something there that both of us will immediately recognize that doesn't need to be described to another black person because they know what i'm talking about. Why do you think that is?

Now to the equality thing that you mention....it's not about equality. I treat all individuals the same so long as i'm receiving the proper respect that i give others. But i can't sit here and tell you that being amongst a group of non-blacks is the same as being in a group of blacks. It's not. Not even close. I'm not articulate enough to explain it to you, but if you're not a member of a minority group, i don't think you get it.

In any case, i mostly agree with you. We're all humans and should treat each other equally. But where the rubber meets the road....black folks are MY people.

[Xander_Crews]

Originally Posted by desertdetroiter

Fair enough.

It's not that i disagree with your general premise, but you can't tell me that i should disregard a few hundred years of a shared history. I can't help it that when i drive through South Dakota and finally see a black person, i feel a sense of relief and commonality despite the fact that we've never seen each other before. We will generally lock eyes immediately and speak to each other. There is something there that both of us will immediately recognize that doesn't need to be described to another black person because they know what i'm talking about. Why do you think that is?

Now to the equality thing that you mention....it's not about equality. I treat all individuals the same so long as i'm receiving the proper respect that i give others. But i can't sit here and tell you that being amongst a group of non-blacks is the same as being in a group of blacks. It's not. Not even close. I'm not articulate enough to explain it to you, but if you're not a member of a minority group, i don't think you get it.

In any case, i mostly agree with you. We're all humans and should treat each other equally. But where the rubber meets the road....black folks are MY people.

Exactly, you get it. It is not wrong to share culture with those that you are culturally tied to. It is only wrong to try to give or take away the rights of any race, regardless of your skin color.

I get what you are saying about being amongst a group of blacks vs. a group of non-blacks, it is the same for me but in reverse... But I treat them with the same respect and hold them to the very same standard as myself. I am not telling people not to notice someones race, but I am urging them to treat other races with the same respect, and hold them to the same standard as the race they belong to.

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

See responses above.^

Funny thing is, you will never change your stance on the issue until you evolve how you view interpersonal relations. Your stance on the issue comes directly from an attitude that people should be judged before they commit a crime, an attitude that promotes judging one by the color of their skin, an attitude that promotes inequality and racism.

You don't want to be equal with whites, it is quite clear that you feel some sort of revenge or consequences is appropriate to take out on someone completely detached from the crime.

And worse, your attitude clearly shows that you think of black people as your family, not your fellow man. Maybe it is me, I see everyone regardless of race as my brother because they are fellow humans. The whole human race is evolving to this thought... if you want to be left behind that is your deal.

You obviously have no idea what a straw man is, I am approaching the issue directly. The issue is the social paradigm between blacks and whites, which I am speaking of, so how is it a straw man?

It seems to me that you just learned about the concept of “straw man” and really don’t know when and how to apply it correctly. However, it’s simply a distraction and diversion for you to keep saying it. The bottom line is that you are failing to communicate if I am employing a straw man….because you are not making sense but speaking in riddles.

You are speaking to the wrong guy, I don't feel I owe my country anything, or that it owes me anything.

Your feelings have nothing to do with it, although you did imply, through your reaction, that you feel you should bear no burdens from this nation’s past. Your feelings is your prerogative, however, I think you are smart enough to realize that the country is not beholden to your feelings. If you choose to be a citizen or a citizen by birth, you inherit the assets from the past as well as the liabilities from the past, regardless of your “feelings”. Whether you feel you are owed or deserve freedoms that you did not earn does not mean that those freedoms are not given to you anyway. By the same token, the fact that you feel you should not be liable for a past you did not create means nothing as well. You are not given a choice. It’s just the way it is…..assuming you want to remain a citizen of this nation.

You are missing my point in every possible way, you are my equal, my black friends are my equals, Asians, Latinos, and middle-easterners are my equals. I have no special rights above anybody, and neither do you.

It’s not about rights…..it’s about consequences and realities.

One of my black friends is at a very respected college right now, when he graduates he will be making 120k a year. (already has the job lined up). He is not suffering from oppression of his ancestors... Jay-z is filthy rich, he is not suffering from the oppression of his ancestors. Your life is what you make it, you can make it what you want it, or you can make excuses.

The fact that there existed free black men, some of which were well off (rare), during slavery does not mean that blacks who were slaves could be anything they wanted to be if they were just willing to make something of themselves.
White folks like you kill me by trying to use the success of some to caste aspersion upon the plight of others. Does the fact that some Jews escaped or avoided the concentration camps in Germany means that every Jew had the same opportunity to do such and that that those who perished and suffer were somehow at fault because some Jews escaped such realities? White are always trying to use the success of some blacks to discredit the condition of other blacks as being the consequence of things external. All it takes is one black to make and white folks are like “See…..see….he made it…….that proves you all could have and should have made it (if you were not so lazy and irresponsible). Use that same argument against the Jews who died while others made it. Better yet, why don’t you go use that argument on the many service men and women who died in Wars….while others made it? Thus, the reason they died was their own fault….because others made it out the war unharmed…..which means that the others could have too (if they were not lazy and irresponsible). I bet you would get your azz kicked with the quickness talking that to soldiers.

ALL of my black friends agree with me on this issue, they are my equals.
You do not want to be equals, that much is clear, you re willing to preach about how evil white people are for not treating black people equally in the past, but you do not want to treat white people as equals.

Uh……Boss man……that was never in dispute. Black folks knew we were the equal of whites when we were slaves……they just had the weapons.

Your sense of entitlement is sickening, racism is bad unless it is against white people, inequality is bad unless white people get the short end of the stick.
Believe it or not two wrongs do not make a right.

LOL…..you must be like 12 years old. Look….the day when white poverty is 3 times the rate of blacks, when white unemployment is twice the rate of blacks, when white wealth is 15 times less than blacks…….then come talk to me about a sense of entitlement. You dam skippy that I believe that blacks are entitle to have the same numbers as whites and that we would have the same numbers if whites did not set up a system to promote white supremacy of conditions for over 3 centuries. If you want equality, then how about equality of rates of poverty, rates of unemployment, levels of wealth? You don’t have a CLUE what inequality is as a white person. For you to even mention the slights you feel, such as not being a to use the N word, as an example of racism and inequality that whites are suffering makes you sound like a dam fool. If you knew how many times I have been arrested and detain my white cops in my youth, when I never commit a crime, if would blow your mind away. You don’t have a dam clue what REAL racism and inequality is.

THIS is a straw man, you are talking about deer, not humans, and especially not the black and white social paradigm.

Uh….it’s called an A.N.A.L.O.G.Y genius…. I used a parallel phenomenon to illustrate a point and understanding of how all animals are programmed to survive and how association is a tool for survival.

Black people statistically have a higher chance of being a thief, Black people statistically do poorer in school. Black people historically have a worse past with violent crimes.
Would it be right for me to automatically assume that black people I come across are dangerous, stupid, violent criminals?

It has nothing to do with right or wrong. Your subconscious is programmed by the information it has received and if it has received information that tells it that blacks are more of a threat than whites then your subconscious will automatically warn you through the manifestation of fear or caution. Human nature has nothing to do with right or wrong.

Again, not a straw man, I was speaking about... wait for it... the black and white social paradigm... THE EXACT ISSUE WE ARE DISCUSSING. Should I post the definition of a straw man for you AGAIN?

??????????????

So you are saying that people who looked down on racism and slavery are still oppressive, much like those who gave their lives to free your ancestors?
These people were willing to DIE for your ancestors, and they were oppressive?

Uh…Pssssssttttttttt….the civil war was not fought to free the slaves….but rather, it was fought TO PRESERVE THE UNION. Kentucky fought on side of the Union and they did not free their slaves until the emancipation proclamation. Again, you demonstrate a terrible knowledge of history, which is not surprising given your disrespect for black history and current sensitivities over that history.

Well you are a lot different from my many black friends. Some of them, when I met them got the N bomb dropped around them by a white stranger (me) and were totally cool with it.

I can tell you that if you went to the neighborhood that I grew up in you would get yo azz kicked with the quickness and if someone from my community heard you say that you would have problems. Here is the thing however. If I ran in circles with Jewish people, with the understanding and respect that I have for their experiences as a people, I would never use a word that a large segment of Jews found offensive if someone who is not Jewish said it, regardless if other Jews could say it to each other. The honest God truth I would not even want to say and would have no desire to say it. I think your problem and the problem with a lot of whites is that you are just SELFISH. It’s ALL ABOUT YOU and your quest to be “Cool” and sound cool which you feel you will be denied if you cannot use the N word. That is just sad and pathetic if you ask me. Young people in general have little respect for anything…..it’s all about you.

It is all in context, if you use it like a black person would, it does not carry disrespect with it. If you use it like an insult, then it is an insult.
Again, if you feel it is an evil expression, don't use it. If you use it, and want to be equals with the other races, don't complain when someone who you deem to be the wrong color uses it.

I don’t use the word personally and I have no control over other black people using the word. However, you will NEVER be able to use that word around ME…as a white person…Especially since I don’t use it either. See….not every black person uses the word and if they don’t use the word they will have a serious problem with a white boy using the word. So my suggestion to you is to stay in your obvious soft suburban world of wanna be gangstas and perpetrators trying to look and sound like folks who live in inner-cities were you would not last a second coming in the hood talkin that BS.

Again, you say historically a white person dropping the N bomb means they disrespect blacks. Should I judge you by the poorer examples of your race from the past? Should I assume you are a stupid criminal?
Haven't blacks been fighting against stereotypes for a while now? Or does it only count as being in poor taste if that stereotype is negative against blacks? 'Cause you seem fine with white people being stereotyped.

Poorer examples of my race? Well, if punish and whip people if they were caught reading I guess they would not have book smarts and then you could say that was an example of “my stupid people” from the past. I also guess if you denied people the ability to make a decent living to survive off then a percentage will turn to criminality for survival. It’s hard to look back and black folks in this country and control for behavior that is “black” and not the behavior and conditions that were a reaction to mistreatment from whites.

That having been said, the poor examples of your race built a nation predicated on white supremacy and black inferiority. That last for several centuries and its legacy impact is alive and well today, preserved through the ignorance and disrespect that contemporary whites have for what blacks have experienced. I mean, there is no greater example of this disrespect that white people arguing and debating that they should be able to use the N word, despite the history related to white usage of the word and despite the fact that its use by whites still upsets the majority of black Americans. It’s obvious that you have done a benefit/cost analysis and determined that the benefit for you is “sounding cool” which outweighs the cost of making many black people uncomfortable and feeling disrespected. A popular radio talk show host, Dr. Laura, recently resigned because of her use of the word and she upset her black caller who told her she did not appreciate here using the word. Again, white people like her and you simply have NO RESPECT FOR BLACK PEOPLE. I mean, if a people say that you using this word upsets them…….why cannot that be respected? It’s because white folks HAVE NEVER respected us and they resent that they cannot do something that SOME black folks do……because they are used to being the MASTERS who tell us what we can and cannot do...and not the other way around.

[Xander_Crews]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

It seems to me that you just learned about the concept of “straw man” and really don’t know when and how to apply it correctly. However, it’s simply a distraction and diversion for you to keep saying it. The bottom line is that you are failing to communicate if I am employing a straw man….because you are not making sense but speaking in riddles.

Funny that you act like a master of debate, yet this post is riddled with personal attacks, possibly the weakest debate tactic. I was on debate teams throughout junior and senior high school.

Your feelings have nothing to do with it, although you did imply, through your reaction, that you feel you should bear no burdens from this nation’s past. Your feelings is your prerogative, however, I think you are smart enough to realize that the country is not beholden to your feelings. If you choose to be a citizen or a citizen by birth, you inherit the assets from the past as well as the liabilities from the past, regardless of your “feelings”. Whether you feel you are owed or deserve freedoms that you did not earn does not mean that those freedoms are not given to you anyway. By the same token, the fact that you feel you should not be liable for a past you did not create means nothing as well. You are not given a choice. It’s just the way it is…..assuming you want to remain a citizen of this nation.




It’s not about rights…..it’s about consequences and realities.



The fact that there existed free black men, some of which were well off (rare), during slavery does not mean that blacks who were slaves could be anything they wanted to be if they were just willing to make something of themselves.
White folks like you kill me by trying to use the success of some to caste aspersion upon the plight of others. Does the fact that some Jews escaped or avoided the concentration camps in Germany means that every Jew had the same opportunity to do such and that that those who perished and suffer were somehow at fault because some Jews escaped such realities? White are always trying to use the success of some blacks to discredit the condition of other blacks as being the consequence of things external. All it takes is one black to make and white folks are like “See…..see….he made it…….that proves you all could have and should have made it (if you were not so lazy and irresponsible). Use that same argument against the Jews who died while others made it. Better yet, why don’t you go use that argument on the many service men and women who died in Wars….while others made it? Thus, the reason they died was their own fault….because others made it out the war unharmed…..which means that the others could have too (if they were not lazy and irresponsible). I bet you would get your azz kicked with the quickness talking that to soldiers.

There are TONS of successful black people, they are by no means rare. You are using extreme examples to supplement your argument, like really extreme. The parallels are almost nonexistent.

Uh……Boss man……that was never in dispute. Black folks knew we were the equal of whites when we were slaves……they just had the weapons.

LOL…..you must be like 12 years old. Look….the day when white poverty is 3 times the rate of blacks, when white unemployment is twice the rate of blacks, when white wealth is 15 times less than blacks…….then come talk to me about a sense of entitlement. You dam skippy that I believe that blacks are entitle to have the same numbers as whites and that we would have the same numbers if whites did not set up a system to promote white supremacy of conditions for over 3 centuries. If you want equality, then how about equality of rates of poverty, rates of unemployment, levels of wealth? You don’t have a CLUE what inequality is as a white person. For you to even mention the slights you feel, such as not being a to use the N word, as an example of racism and inequality that whites are suffering makes you sound like a dam fool. If you knew how many times I have been arrested and detain my white cops in my youth, when I never commit a crime, if would blow your mind away. You don’t have a dam clue what REAL racism and inequality is.

This 12 year old blows you away at spelling and grammar that is for sure.

I am not saying that the offenses are the same, I never said that. I am talking about the principle of equality... Which is the same regardless of the degree of the offense. You are still a hypocrite.

Uh….it’s called an A.N.A.L.O.G.Y genius…. I used a parallel phenomenon to illustrate a point and understanding of how all animals are programmed to survive and how association is a tool for survival.

Analogy does not have periods in it . And if you want to call it an analogy, call it a poor one. You are comparing an animal which acts on instinct, to man which acts on cohesive thought.

It has nothing to do with right or wrong. Your subconscious is programmed by the information it has received and if it has received information that tells it that blacks are more of a threat than whites then your subconscious will automatically warn you through the manifestation of fear or caution. Human nature has nothing to do with right or wrong.

??????????????

Uh…Pssssssttttttttt….the civil war was not fought to free the slaves….but rather, it was fought TO PRESERVE THE UNION. Kentucky fought on side of the Union and they did not free their slaves until the emancipation proclamation. Again, you demonstrate a terrible knowledge of history, which is not surprising given your disrespect for black history and current sensitivities over that history.

I never mentioned the civil war, plenty of white people died helping black slaves escape... you gonna take credit for the underground railroad?

Don't insult my intelligence when you can barely write. Have you seen your walls of text?

I can tell you that if you went to the neighborhood that I grew up in you would get yo azz kicked with the quickness and if someone from my community heard you say that you would have problems. Here is the thing however. If I ran in circles with Jewish people, with the understanding and respect that I have for their experiences as a people, I would never use a word that a large segment of Jews found offensive if someone who is not Jewish said it, regardless if other Jews could say it to each other. The honest God truth I would not even want to say and would have no desire to say it. I think your problem and the problem with a lot of whites is that you are just SELFISH. It’s ALL ABOUT YOU and your quest to be “Cool” and sound cool which you feel you will be denied if you cannot use the N word. That is just sad and pathetic if you ask me. Young people in general have little respect for anything…..it’s all about you.

Wrong, it is not about me. I said in my very first post, I very rarely use the N word... and I definitely don't think it sounds cool. If black people find it offensive, why not stop other black people from saying it... "It is only an insult if white people use it" < Racism. I never hear any complaints about Asians or Latinos using the word.

I don’t use the word personally and I have no control over other black people using the word. However, you will NEVER be able to use that word around ME…as a white person…Especially since I don’t use it either. See….not every black person uses the word and if they don’t use the word they will have a serious problem with a white boy using the word. So my suggestion to you is to stay in your obvious soft suburban world of wanna be gangstas and perpetrators trying to look and sound like folks who live in inner-cities were you would not last a second coming in the hood talkin that BS.

You are incredible. You keep making statements about my character but you have no idea who I am. I do not live in a suburb, and I in no way impersonate gangsters... Again, I don't use the N word. (save rare occasions)

Ps. I live in the inner city.

Poorer examples of my race? Well, if punish and whip people if they were caught reading I guess they would not have book smarts and then you could say that was an example of “my stupid people” from the past. I also guess if you denied people the ability to make a decent living to survive off then a percentage will turn to criminality for survival. It’s hard to look back and black folks in this country and control for behavior that is “black” and not the behavior and conditions that were a reaction to mistreatment from whites.

That having been said, the poor examples of your race built a nation predicated on white supremacy and black inferiority. That last for several centuries and its legacy impact is alive and well today, preserved through the ignorance and disrespect that contemporary whites have for what blacks have experienced. I mean, there is no greater example of this disrespect that white people arguing and debating that they should be able to use the N word, despite the history related to white usage of the word and despite the fact that its use by whites still upsets the majority of black Americans. It’s obvious that you have done a benefit/cost analysis and determined that the benefit for you is “sounding cool” which outweighs the cost of making many black people uncomfortable and feeling disrespected. A popular radio talk show host, Dr. Laura, recently resigned because of her use of the word and she upset her black caller who told her she did not appreciate here using the word. Again, white people like her and you simply have NO RESPECT FOR BLACK PEOPLE. I mean, if a people say that you using this word upsets them…….why cannot that be respected? It’s because white folks HAVE NEVER respected us and they resent that they cannot do something that SOME black folks do……because they are used to being the MASTERS who tell us what we can and cannot do...and not the other way around.

I respect black people the same as white, the same as all other races, how do you not get that? My whole argument is based on equality....

Stop putting words in my mouth, and knock of the personal attacks. These tactics weaken your argument, and make you look childish.

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

Stop putting words in my mouth, and knock of the personal attacks. These tactics weaken your argument, and make you look childish.

Funny that you act like a master of debate, yet this post is riddled with personal attacks, possibly the weakest debate tactic. I was on debate teams throughout junior and senior high school.

Uh….in debates personal attacks are called an ad hominem, since you like to make reference to fallacies of debate, like straw man……be consistent.

There are TONS of successful black people; they are by no means rare. You are using extreme examples to supplement your argument, like really extreme. The parallels are almost nonexistent.

No I am not using extreme examples I am using logical examples to demonstrate that the success of others cannot be used to argue that others have no valid reason for not succeeding. Why, it’s because no two people suffer the exact same circumstance due to individual and situational variation. In life there are some extraordinary people, gifted, if you will. Just because they achieve something does not mean that the ORDINARY can do the same thing. I am sick of hearing people try to use the success of some blacks to suggest that no black person has an excuse……just because another black person, even many, made it. Not all black people shared the same situation in degree. Even in families it’s not the same. The experience of my senior brother is radically different from my own….and so has the outcomes of our lives.

This 12 year old blows you away at spelling and grammar that is for sure.
I am not saying that the offenses are the same, I never said that. I am talking about the principle of equality... Which is the same regardless of the degree of the offense. You are still a hypocrite.

Yes, I was never a good speller and I hated English. Math and science was my thing, which is how I earned a Bachelors of Science in computer science. Thus, you might blow me away for sure in spelling and grammar…..but you flunk in logical reasoning big time. You see, I can use spell check to correct my spelling and grammar if I so choose. However, you are at a loss because there is no software that you can use to correct your poorly reasoned arguments.

Analogy does not have periods in it . And if you want to call it an analogy, call it a poor one. You are comparing an animal which acts on instinct, to man which acts on cohesive thought.

touché
However, humans also act on instinct, which they use when there is not enough sensory input for our brains to make a conscious decision or when things happen faster than the mind can process. If I threw something at your head really fast…..your survival instincts would make you duck, regardless of your ability of cohesive thought.

I never mentioned the civil war, plenty of white people died helping black slaves escape... you gonna take credit for the underground railroad?
Don't insult my intelligence when you can barely write. Have you seen your walls of text?

Well then stop speaking in amorphous riddles. The only white people I know who died fighting for blacks was John Brown. I do not recall much history of whites being killed for rescuing blacks from slavery. However, my point was that many people who were against the institution of slavery still believed blacks to be inferior relative to white people. When one believes in the racial inferiority of blacks, then the combined social impact of those beliefs is the oppression and repression of blacks.

Wrong, it is not about me. I said in my very first post, I very rarely use the N word... and I definitely don't think it sounds cool. If black people find it offensive, why not stop other black people from saying it... "It is only an insult if white people use it" < Racism. I never hear any complaints about Asians or Latinos using the word.

Ok…..now get this. You say you barley even use the word, but in your previous post you said you used it around your black friends when they first met you and they did not have a problem with it. Now…..sorry, that just does not add up. If you rarely use the word, why would you use it around people you are just meeting for the first time?
In regards to the second part of your rebuttal, again, it’s a demonstration of the lack of knowledge and respect of history and how everything EVOLVED into what it is today. Since you don’t know, Asians and Latinos did not oppress black people in America, whites did. However, for the record there is a problem if they use it too.

You are incredible. You keep making statements about my character but you have no idea who I am. I do not live in a suburb, and I in no way impersonate gangsters... Again, I don't use the N word. (save rare occasions)
Ps. I live in the inner city.

I guess you only use it for special occasions, like brining out the GOOD CHINA.

I respect black people the same as white, the same as all other races, how do you not get that? My whole argument is based on equality....

You cannot respect black people if you don’t respect black history and black sensitivities……PERIOD! If you feel you should be able to use a word, that when coming from a white person is upsetting to many blacks……just because some blacks use the word towards each other…….you are not showing respect for black people. It’s all about YOU.

[Xander_Crews]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

Uh….in debates personal attacks are called an ad hominem, since you like to make reference to fallacies of debate, like straw man……be consistent.



No I am not using extreme examples I am using logical examples to demonstrate that the success of others cannot be used to argue that others have no valid reason for not succeeding. Why, it’s because no two people suffer the exact same circumstance due to individual and situational variation. In life there are some extraordinary people, gifted, if you will. Just because they achieve something does not mean that the ORDINARY can do the same thing. I am sick of hearing people try to use the success of some blacks to suggest that no black person has an excuse……just because another black person, even many, made it. Not all black people shared the same situation in degree. Even in families it’s not the same. The experience of my senior brother is radically different from my own….and so has the outcomes of our lives.

You were comparing the life of a black man in the U.S. today to Jews during the Holocaust, That does not strike you as being a bit of a stretch?

Yes, I was never a good speller and I hated English. Math and science was my thing, which is how I earned a Bachelors of Science in computer science. Thus, you might blow me away for sure in spelling and grammar…..but you flunk in logical reasoning big time. You see, I can use spell check to correct my spelling and grammar if I so choose. However, you are at a loss because there is no software that you can use to correct your poorly reasoned arguments.

touché
However, humans also act on instinct, which they use when there is not enough sensory input for our brains to make a conscious decision or when things happen faster than the mind can process. If I threw something at your head really fast…..your survival instincts would make you duck, regardless of your ability of cohesive thought.

What you just described is a reflex, not an instinct.

Well then stop speaking in amorphous riddles. The only white people I know who died fighting for blacks was John Brown. I do not recall much history of whites being killed for rescuing blacks from slavery. However, my point was that many people who were against the institution of slavery still believed blacks to be inferior relative to white people. When one believes in the racial inferiority of blacks, then the combined social impact of those beliefs is the oppression and repression of blacks.

You will never get me to believe that all white people felt that black people are inferior.

Ok…..now get this. You say you barley even use the word, but in your previous post you said you used it around your black friends when they first met you and they did not have a problem with it. Now…..sorry, that just does not add up. If you rarely use the word, why would you use it around people you are just meeting for the first time?
In regards to the second part of your rebuttal, again, it’s a demonstration of the lack of knowledge and respect of history and how everything EVOLVED into what it is today. Since you don’t know, Asians and Latinos did not oppress black people in America, whites did. However, for the record there is a problem if they use it too.

I said some of my black friends, that group first approached me because they overheard me use the expression, "(N word) please!" They thought it was funny and commended me for having the guts to say it with them around.


I guess you only use it for special occasions, like brining out the GOOD CHINA.

Rare occasions does not equal special occasions, again you are putting words in my mouth.

You cannot respect black people if you don’t respect black history and black sensitivities……PERIOD! If you feel you should be able to use a word, that when coming from a white person is upsetting to many blacks……just because some blacks use the word towards each other…….you are not showing respect for black people. It’s all about YOU.

It is not about me, it is about all of us. At some point in the future all races will unite as one and drop all the petty little issues, maybe I am ahead of the curve. I look forward to the day, and I try to be a part of bringing it to fruition.

Look, we may never agree. If I knew you personally and you explained that you do not like the word, I would refrain from saying it around you... you already said you do not like black people saying it... which means that saying white people should refrain from the use is not promoting inequality, it only is if you say, "Look here, you are white, so based on the color of your skin which you were born with and have no control over, I am going to treat you differently".

Also you obviously have the wrong mental image of me. I am educated, and well spoken, I am not some wannabe gangster dropping the word frivolously in a sad attempt to appear "cool". Again I rarely use the word, and I never use it as an insult.

I hate the wannabe gangster demographic more than most people I know... The only people I dislike more are those "juggalo kids" who blast ICP all day and ingest cheap drugs.

I also do not want to have a screaming match with you, a calm discussion is more up my alley.

[Indentured Servant]

You were comparing the life of a black man in the U.S. today to Jews during the Holocaust, That does not strike you as being a bit of a stretch?

No....thats not true. You missed the abstract principle in your superficial attempt at comprehension. The abstract principle here is that one cannot use the success of another to argue that another should have found the same success (just like one cannot argue that all should fail become many failed), because no two people or situations are exactly the same. As another example of that principle, just because the majority of people made it out the twin towers on 911 is not used as an indictment and should not be used as an indictment against those who perished. Why? The answer is that although everyone may have been in the building, the situation in the building was not the same for everyone and the individual ability of everyone in the building was not the same either. Hence, just because black people share the commonality of a "black experience" that experiences varies in degree and kind and each black individual varies as well. Thus, its simply not intelligent to infer that since some blacks found success than all the blacks who have not have no excuse but themselves.

What you just described is a reflex, not an instinct.

LOL....a reflex is a form of instinct.

You will never get me to believe that all white people felt that black people are inferior.

And no one will ever get me to believe that either. So that makes two of us.

I said some of my black friends, that group first approached me because they overheard me use the expression, "(N word) please!" They thought it was funny and commended me for having the guts to say it with them around.

Thats pathetic!

Rare occasions does not equal special occasions, again you are putting words in my mouth.

I can only imagine what those rare occasions are.

It is not about me, it is about all of us. At some point in the future all races will unite as one and drop all the petty little issues, maybe I am ahead of the curve. I look forward to the day, and I try to be a part of bringing it to fruition.

Well, why don't you commit a crime and do some time? If you are trying to promote equality and for us to have shared experiences the why not serve some time given that a large percentage of black males are either in jail, on probation or other? In many cities the unemployment rate for the black male is approaching 50%, so how about you going without a job too.....so that we can all be as one. You see, you want to try to emulate ONLY that which you think is beneficial for you, not that which you think will be harmful to you. However, if you were truly interested in us being the SAME you would be willing to endure the same pain and conditions that blacks do.

I have hardly heard anything more ridiculous than the argument people like you are making. Do you know how ridiculous you actually sound? Is that your civil rights struggle as a white guy.....the fight to use the N word? Is that your feeble example of the struggles of white males in America, which you view as an example of racism against whites.....not being able to say Ni66a......LOL.....I am sorry that is so ridiculous and pompous that I am making myself laugh at its selfish stupidity.

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

Look, we may never agree. If I knew you personally and you explained that you do not like the word, I would refrain from saying it around you... you already said you do not like black people saying it... which means that saying white people should refrain from the use is not promoting inequality, it only is if you say, "Look here, you are white, so based on the color of your skin which you were born with and have no control over, I am going to treat you differently".

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

Also you obviously have the wrong mental image of me. I am educated, and well spoken, I am not some wannabe gangster dropping the word frivolously in a sad attempt to appear "cool". Again I rarely use the word, and I never use it as an insult.

I hate the wannabe gangster demographic more than most people I know... The only people I dislike more are those "juggalo kids" who blast ICP all day and ingest cheap drugs.

I also do not want to have a screaming match with you, a calm discussion is more up my alley.

Well the difference is this. You might be cool now......but people do change. You might use the word in the future in a denigrating intent. You or someone like you, could join the skin heads and then run into one of your old black friends and then say to your new skin head friends "Hey...watch this.....watch me call him a Ni66a and watch him respond....stupid so in so...".

You see....a black person never has to worry about that with another black person. The pot cannot call the kettle "black".

[Xander_Crews]

Originally Posted by Indentured Servant

No....thats not true. You missed the abstract principle in your superficial attempt at comprehension. The abstract principle here is that one cannot use the success of another to argue that another should have found the same success (just like one cannot argue that all should fail become many failed), because no two people or situations are exactly the same. As another example of that principle, just because the majority of people made it out the twin towers on 911 is not used as an indictment and should not be used as an indictment against those who perished. Why? The answer is that although everyone may have been in the building, the situation in the building was not the same for everyone and the individual ability of everyone in the building was not the same either. Hence, just because black people share the commonality of a "black experience" that experiences varies in degree and kind and each black individual varies as well. Thus, its simply not intelligent to infer that since some blacks found success than all the blacks who have not have no excuse but themselves.



LOL....a reflex is a form of instinct.


And no one will ever get me to believe that either. So that makes two of us.


Thats pathetic!



I can only imagine what those rare occasions are.


Well, why don't you commit a crime and do some time? If you are trying to promote equality and for us to have shared experiences the why not serve some time given that a large percentage of black males are either in jail, on probation or other? In many cities the unemployment rate for the black male is approaching 50%, so how about you going without a job too.....so that we can all be as one. You see, you want to try to emulate ONLY that which you think is beneficial for you, not that which you think will be harmful to you. However, if you were truly interested in us being the SAME you would be willing to endure the same pain and conditions that blacks do.

I have hardly heard anything more ridiculous than the argument people like you are making. Do you know how ridiculous you actually sound? Is that your civil rights struggle as a white guy.....the fight to use the N word? Is that your feeble example of the struggles of white males in America, which you view as an example of racism against whites.....not being able to say Ni66a......LOL.....I am sorry that is so ridiculous and pompous that I am making myself laugh at its selfish stupidity.




Well the difference is this. You might be cool now......but people do change. You might use the word in the future in a denigrating intent. You or someone like you, could join the skin heads and then run into one of your old black friends and then say to your new skin head friends "Hey...watch this.....watch me call him a Ni66a and watch him respond....stupid so in so...".

You see....a black person never has to worry about that with another black person. The pot cannot call the kettle "black".

Look man, I just said that I am not going to have a screaming match with you, I am done.

All you are doing at this point is throwing around personal attacks under the guise of argument, and framing me in fictional persona to make your point. You ask me if I know what I sound like? Apparently pretty good because I keep getting rep from this thread, myself and a black man in this thread are pretty close to being on common ground. Look at what you sound like, you are doing NO debating, you are only trying to attack my credibility at this point.

You continue to put words in my mouth with no end in sight, when did I ever say that this was a civil rights struggle for white people? I never even implied that. My argument has been, and will continue to be that everyone needs to drop the bull and treat each other the SAME. I want a world where every race is treated EXACTLY the same. I only pointed out your racist principles to highlight your hypocrisy.

Notice that I never used any form of personal insult until you started flinging them at me left and right... and I am a 12 year old?

I am outta here, feel free to get the last word in if you choose, I will not be back to this thread to read it. You can even rationalize posting a response so you don't look like a fool responding to thin air... go ahead.

You can even claim that you "won" since I refuse to participate in this pi$$ing contest any longer. I extended an invitation to discuss this like adults but judging by your last post you have zero interest in that.

Good day.

(P.S. You are born with a handful of reflexes, those are instinctual, a majority of reflexes throughout life are learned. Instincts can not be learned, to say a reflex is an instinct is ludicrous.)

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by Xander_Crews

Look man, I just said that I am not going to have a screaming match with you, I am done.

All you are doing at this point is throwing around personal attacks under the guise of argument, and framing me in fictional persona to make your point. You ask me if I know what I sound like? Apparently pretty good because I keep getting rep from this thread, myself and a black man in this thread are pretty close to being on common ground. Look at what you sound like, you are doing NO debating, you are only trying to attack my credibility at this point.

You continue to put words in my mouth with no end in sight, when did I ever say that this was a civil rights struggle for white people? I never even implied that. My argument has been, and will continue to be that everyone needs to drop the bull and treat each other the SAME. I want a world where every race is treated EXACTLY the same. I only pointed out your racist principles to highlight your hypocrisy.

Notice that I never used any form of personal insult until you started flinging them at me left and right... and I am a 12 year old?

I am outta here, feel free to get the last word in if you choose, I will not be back to this thread to read it. You can even rationalize posting a response so you don't look like a fool responding to thin air... go ahead.

You can even claim that you "won" since I refuse to participate in this pi$$ing contest any longer. I extended an invitation to discuss this like adults but judging by your last post you have zero interest in that.

Good day.

(P.S. You are born with a handful of reflexes, those are instinctual, a majority of reflexes throughout life are learned. Instincts can not be learned, to say a reflex is an instinct is ludicrous.)

Wow......I guess someone saying that another must be 12 years old is a personal attack and offensive.....but you saying saying the N word around black folks should be ok......to promotes equality, despite the history behind whites using that word and the discomfort it causes many blacks to hear whites say it in their company. Again.....its all about YOU. People like me need to not offend you.....but people like you don't mind offending me who find white folks saying N offensive.....Gotcha.

By the way.....I did not find anything you said to me offensive in these forums. Obviously we have a different tolerance or standard. I was not trying to personally offend you......just your argument.