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Old 03-21-2011, 06:55 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,737,754 times
Reputation: 9325

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogead View Post
I would urge you to carry the libertarian socialist banner with pride! Let others figure it out for themselves.


Just look at all the tea-bagger idiots who call Obama a socialist. .

Libertarian Socialists just want to avoid the Socialist label. By adding Libertarian, they think it sounds better. But you can't hide.

So you don't like "tea baggers"? But you like "Rim Job Socialists?"

You can't improve your philosophy by changing the name.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:00 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,319,728 times
Reputation: 2337
The Government would own all the land.

The Government would determine who would use it, and how it would be used.

The Government is wise.

Wise-acre under Georgist philosophy.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,526 posts, read 3,051,326 times
Reputation: 4343
Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
It depends on what your goal is, if you want to persuade people you would want to use the words and phrases they are familiar with. If your goal is to engage is left/right partisan bickering than use what ever you want.

I'm a member of The Industrial Workers of the World (IWW). The IWW, with its reliance on direct action, is the perfect example of what I would define as libertarian socialism in practice. To the extent that the mainstream media knows anything about the IWW, it tends to define us as a "Marxist", "socialist", "communist", or "anarchist" (a bit of truth in the last one) organization. Yet, on the rare occasion when they actually do some journalistic work, they realize that we espouse no political views whatsoever. It is a violation of our constitution for the IWW, or any of its branches, to give even one cent to any political party or candidate. Likewise, we are prohibited, as an organization, from making endorsements for any political office.

I think the whole point is to let others come to recognize on their own, that libertarian socialism doesn't address issues from a "left/right" perspective. That probably involves some research on their part, and a willingness to back away from politically-charged terminology. It also means listening and reading with an open mind.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
5,638 posts, read 6,515,537 times
Reputation: 7220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Libertarian Socialists just want to avoid the Socialist label. By adding Libertarian, they think it sounds better. But you can't hide.
Read and learn. Your reply is silly.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,526 posts, read 3,051,326 times
Reputation: 4343
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Libertarian Socialists just want to avoid the Socialist label. By adding Libertarian, they think it sounds better. But you can't hide.

So you don't like "tea baggers"? But you like "Rim Job Socialists?"

You can't improve your philosophy by changing the name.

I don't dislike tea-baggers. I dislike the standard practice of some tea-baggers of utilizing terms, the meaning of which they don't understand.


I'm not looking to change my philosophy, but:


Define "Socialist" and I'll gladly tell you whether or not I meet the definition.

Define "Rim job Socialist", and I'll tell you whether or not I have an opinion of them.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:16 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
5,638 posts, read 6,515,537 times
Reputation: 7220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Then you are not a Libertarian. That's like a tiger without stripes telling everyone he is a tiger or a thief telling people he doesn't believe in stealing.

You cannot be a Libertarian if you oppose private property.
Do you own property and PAY TAXES on it? If so, how does that make you feel?
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:32 PM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,212,194 times
Reputation: 3632
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaimuki View Post
Good question! Can you elaborate on "practice capitalism?" What are your thoughts on corporations?
It is probably eiaser for me to answer the corporation question, this should answer the capitalist question.

If individuals want to contractually join together to conduct business, I have no problem with that. If they ask for free government protection of their liability, I would either say no, or in some cases it may be preferable to charge for such protection. The same with criminal liability, they would not be able to get around hurting others via a corporate shield.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ergohead View Post
The Government would own all the land.

The Government would determine who would use it, and how it would be used.

The Government is wise.

Wise-acre under Georgist philosophy.
Not all georgist want the government to own land. It could still be privately owned the government would simply charge for the deed protection.

Other models such as Arden Delaware have a trust own the land and individuals lease it.

Interestingly enough even through many libertarians seem to quote Ayn Rand as scripture, very few acknowledge that Galt's Gulch was financed by land rents.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogead View Post
I'm a member of The Industrial Workers of the World (IWW). The IWW, with its reliance on direct action, is the perfect example of what I would define as libertarian socialism in practice. To the extent that the mainstream media knows anything about the IWW, it tends to define us as a "Marxist", "socialist", "communist", or "anarchist" (a bit of truth in the last one) organization. Yet, on the rare occasion when they actually do some journalistic work, they realize that we espouse no political views whatsoever. It is a violation of our constitution for the IWW, or any of its branches, to give even one cent to any political party or candidate. Likewise, we are prohibited, as an organization, from making endorsements for any political office.

I think the whole point is to let others come to recognize on their own, that libertarian socialism doesn't address issues from a "left/right" perspective. That probably involves some research on their part, and a willingness to back away from politically-charged terminology. It also means listening and reading with an open mind.
Sounds interesting, I have met several libertarians that come from your direction.

Last edited by hilgi; 03-21-2011 at 07:40 PM..
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:36 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,319,728 times
Reputation: 2337
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaimuki View Post
Do you own property and PAY TAXES on it? If so, how does that make you feel?
I always give my money to street muggers.

It reduces the cost of "health' care.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:46 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
5,638 posts, read 6,515,537 times
Reputation: 7220
Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
It is probably eiaser for me to answer the corporation question, this should answer the capitalist question.

If individuals want to contractually join together to conduct business, I have no problem with that. If they ask for free government protection of their liability, I would either say no, or in some cases it may be preferable to charge for such protection. The same with criminal liability, they would not be able to get around hurting others via a corporate shield.
I'm not sure!

I have heard this discussed before by an Anarcho-Capitalist named Stefan Molyneux. At least I'm pretty sure he's one. Are you familiar with him?
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:51 PM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
8,182 posts, read 9,212,194 times
Reputation: 3632
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaimuki View Post
I'm not sure!

I have heard this discussed before by an Anarcho-Capitalist named Stefan Molyneux. At least I'm pretty sure he's one. Are you familiar with him?
I think I have heard some of his podcasts on Youtube, not about corporations though. He is interesting.

I have heard various points touched on my others, especially people in the georgist or geolibertarian circles. I feel the idea fits in well with the citizens dividend option also. Citizens Dividend guaranteed income social dividend basic income Thomas Paine
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