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Marriage is an institution. I have no right to go to Harvard if they do not admit me. Same concept at work here. Gays have every right to marry they'll just have to do it with one member of the opposite sex.
They'll have to call it something else. Civil Unions for example.
Marriage is a secular institution. The meaning of marriage has changed countless times throughout history. Denying gays marriage is a violation of the 14th Amendment.
An immigrant's an immigrant. They are no different than the millions of mexican immigrants. Although mexicans actually work harder than your average minimum wage american citizen for lower pay and are striving to feed their families instead of selfishly trying to promote their own agendas and change laws. So, if your going to deport them, deport those gay immigrants as well. No special treatment here.
It astounds me that so many people can't distinguish between different types of immigration. A US citizen can apply to make his/her spouse a legal resident and barring special disqualifying circumstances (criminal record, not a bona-fide marriage), permanent residency will be granted. This happens in more than 250,000 cases per year. It's a hassle of paperwork and interviews and several thousand dollars of filing fees, but it's legal.
A US citizen who enters into a perfectly legal, bona-fide same-sex mrriage in his/her state of residence, is denied the right to do this. Before anyone gets on a soapbox about "the sanctity of marriage", remember that US men can (and do) legally bring their Eastern European mail-order brides into the country.
It has zilch to do with illegal immigration. Same-sex couples want the right that mixed-sex couples have - the right to actually live together.
Last edited by Dane_in_LA; 04-10-2011 at 09:12 PM..
Marriage is a secular institution. The meaning of marriage has changed countless times throughout history. Denying gays marriage is a violation of the 14th Amendment.
Find a better argument.
abolish marriage all together...then the gays wont have anything to complain about
Marriage is a secular institution. The meaning of marriage has changed countless times throughout history. Denying gays marriage is a violation of the 14th Amendment.
It's about property rights, which, by the way, who gave property the right to vote?
Probably the same lame brained mentality that gave personhood to corporations.
No. It will just be another avenue for immigration fraud. Gays are notoriously promiscuous they will bring half the world here if this goes through.
What a nonsensical and obviously bigoted statement. If someone is promiscuous - regardless of their sexual orientation - they're highly unlikely to be in a legal union with anyone. Duh.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdwardA
Stereotypes are often rooted in fact. Stereotyping also served our ancestors well in helping them avoid danger.
The only homosexuals I've ever known to have sex in restrooms and parks are closeted, religious conservatives. That's a symptom of societal and religious rejection and shame - not of homosexuality.
I just can't help but laugh at the inane double talk .... the only homosexuals you've ever known that have sex in restrooms are closeted religious conservatives? How many would that be?
And of course "society" is responsible for these sickos being forced to play Cocka-doodle-doo in public restrooms? Give me a break! Seems to be a strange place to seek anonymity from an intolerant public, if you ask me.
No ... this kind of conduct is a demonstration of the total absence of decency, decorum, dignity, and self-respect. And perhaps a little subconscious act of giving mainstream society the middle finger. And you dare to be indignant when society returns that favor?
More succinctly, if you think that society is intolerant and unfair, you need only look in the mirror for the answer why. Society is sick and tired of the constant whining from all of the many self anointed oppressed and down trodden.
Society is asked to fork over their hard earned cash to support generational welfare cases living in filth, not because they are oppressed, but because they are lazy and filthy ... we're asked to pay to coddle common criminals with cable TV .... to provide free clean needles for drug addicts ... to offer publicly funded abortion as a means of birth control for those who can't work, but sure can have some fun .... and now .... we must assist you by importing your foreign gay lovers? What's next? Publicly funded gay bridal showers, and honeymoons to Cancun?
With millions of Americans out of work, millions losing their homes, millions of children living in poverty, wars raging in multiple locations, an economy on the ropes, a dying dollar, and criminals in congress assisting their criminal conspirators on Wall Street looting the American Treasury, and this is all you can concern yourself with?
I got some breaking news! "Society" has bigger fish to fry, and no time, interest, or money to spend to help import homosexual lovers! We feel we already have enough American born. Maybe you'all can join them in THEIR COUNTRY of origin?
Bottom line ... society is just plain sick of it .... sick of the whining ... sick of the demands, and sick of the constant pushing and poking in the eye ....you're part of the problem, not part of the solution, consequently, society doesn't care about your problems, precisely because you don't care about society ... all you care about is yourself.
Do you ever get bored with this argument? The government has been involved in marriage for thousands of years. It's not going to change, get over it.
wow,,
the government has been involved for THOUSANDS of years...meanwhile the usa is only 235 years old
the point is why should we grand citizenship to a person , because they are now married to a citizen, if we would not have granted them citizenship before tehy were married
why would marriage/civilunions even be a factor in an INDIVIDUALS applicatiion for citizenship???
marriage (a piece of paper) is a FARSE...it phoney, to STEAL benefits that single people cant get....abolish ALL marriages and level the playing field....are you against equality???
I just can't help but laugh at the inane double talk .... the only homosexuals you've ever known that have sex in restrooms are closeted religious conservatives? How many would that be?
Well, I've known hundreds of homosexuals, and most have been in committed relationships, or were at least dating in the hopes of being in one. And yes, some were a bit promiscuous when dating (but never in parks or restrooms), but certainly no more promiscuous than some of my straight male friends - especially my Marine friends. I've never become aware of a single one of my openly homosexual acquaintances ever trolling for sex with strangers in a park or restroom. They have no need or desire to.
The only homosexuals I've ever known about having sex in restrooms or parks are the closeted conservative politicians or Christians priests who make the news 3 or 4 times a year for getting caught doing so. They always seem to have kids and wives too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
And of course "society" is responsible for these sickos being forced to play Cocka-doodle-doo in public restrooms? Give me a break! Seems to be a strange place to seek anonymity from an intolerant public, if you ask me.
Yes. These unfortunate people are abused and brainwashing since childhood into believing that who there are is inherently wrong, sinful, and deserving of shame, ostracism, ridicule, and repression. To fit in, they hide it at all costs - even to the extent of marrying a women the don't love and having kids with her. They even take their hiding so far as to become public figures (politicians or priests) who take strong public positions condemning exactly what they are - homosexuals. However, no matter how hard the deny or pretend they're something else, the truth always surfaces. Considering the facade and fakes lives they've built to harbor one grand lie, they can't seek the human contact and support they need openly and honestly, so they end up trying to find it in pretty unhealthy ways with strangers - be it playing footsie in airport restrooms, or hiring male prostitutes for massages and meth parties.
It's quite pitiful. If they were (and had been since youth) loved and accepted for who that are, then they could love themselves and seek healthy relationships with other people outside of restrooms and darkened parks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
No ... this kind of conduct is a demonstration of the total absence of decency, decorum, dignity, and self-respect. And perhaps a little subconscious act of giving mainstream society the middle finger. And you dare to be indignant when society returns that favor?
I agree. This kind of conduct - albeit rare in the homosexual community - does show a lack of dignity and self-respect. If not a reaction to societal intolerance and abuse, then what is the cause?
Why did Larry Craig marry a women, fight against gay rights his whole life, but then has sex with strange men in airport bathrooms? Why did Ted Haggard marry a women, fight against gay rights his whole life, but then has sex with male prostitutes?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
More succinctly, if you think that society is intolerant and unfair, you need only look in the mirror for the answer why. Society is sick and tired of the constant whining from all of the many self anointed oppressed and down trodden.
So society mistreats gay people because we ask for acceptance and equal treatment under the law? You can't really believe that can you?
There was a point in US history (early on) where all states punished the "crime" of homosexuality with death. US society has always treating homosexuals with intolerance and unfairness - and it's not because back in the 1700 and 1800s us gays were too loud.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
I got some breaking news! "Society" has bigger fish to fry, and no time, interest, or money to spend to help import homosexual lovers! We feel we already have enough American born. Maybe you'all can join them in THEIR COUNTRY of origin?
This argument certainly falls flat. Homosexuals had this right. If it was a such a non-issue not worthy of time, then why did your side spend the time and money to pass a law taking away that right from me? Talk about a double standard - our society does not have time to debate whether I should have equal civil rights, but it sure has hell has plenty of time to take them away
If the Feds passed a law banning Texans from the rights of civil marriage, you would just leave it alone, or would it be worth your time "whining" about it and "demanding" your rights back?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
Bottom line ... society is just plain sick of it .... sick of the whining ... sick of the demands, and sick of the constant pushing and poking in the eye ....you're part of the problem, not part of the solution, consequently, society doesn't care about your problems, precisely because you don't care about society ... all you care about is yourself.
You're nothing more than a hateful, homophobic bigot. Just come out and say it. Homosexuality disgusts you. You believe for some reason that my loving another man and wanting to make a life with him is wrong and that it's your place to stop it. You think we are lesser human beings that you. You have no problem taking away my rights and treating me as a second class citizen - you think that it's a good thing. You want my foreign born husband to be deported. Hell, you probably want me to be deported. You think you're special and deserve more rights than me simply because you're heterosexual and I'm homosexual.
No. It will just be another avenue for immigration fraud. Gays are notoriously promiscuous they will bring half the world here if this goes through.
Marriage is now a sign of promiscuity?
Hmm.
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