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Old 06-12-2011, 02:02 AM
 
14,917 posts, read 13,101,264 times
Reputation: 4828

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
The right course of action would have been for the Amish to pay the fine, put the triangle on their buggy, and then work with their representative to amend the language of the law to allow the substitution of reflective tape in place of the triangle. Both sides in this issue are just too stubborn and hardheaded to give a little and so the loser is the taxpayers.
Exactly
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Old 06-12-2011, 02:06 AM
 
Location: Flippin AR
5,513 posts, read 5,241,036 times
Reputation: 6243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
What do you want to bet that this is a sherrif's office that doesn't have the manpower to investigate burglaries and auto thefts, but has time to write traffic tickets and sign violations? Like most things involving "law" enforcement these days, it's about revenue generation.
I've said this a million times, and it's good to see someone else noticed too.

I've been a victim of car theft and home burglary multiple times, and NOT ONCE did the police bother to investigate or do anything about the crimes--no fingerprints, no asking around to see which delinquents were breaking into houses, no NOTHING. They write a little report of what you said, and you pay a big fee to have it copied to send to the insurance company.

Of course, the police actually KNEW which Providence gang stole and stripped my car, but couldn't care less about doing anything about it. The cops wouldn't drive me home after my car was stolen from the mall--I got to pay a cab an outragous fare to get me home. They then took 5 weeks to notify me my car was in inpound, although the day after it was stolen the cops told me it would be found stripped in the neighboring town. But since the two police forces were from different municipalities, they didn't communicate, and I got hit with a $500 fee for "storing" my stripped car.

Then after my house got robbed again and the police couldn't bother to investigate (an hierloom irreplaceable gold necklace was stolen), I simply asked the neighborhood kids who broke into my house. They told me his name straight out, since the delinquent was bragging about it, and even told me where he lived (2 streets down). I gave the information to the police, who not only did absolutely nothing yet again, but gave me a stern warning that I'd better not try to harass the delinquent, and they'd be "watching me" closely. Nice. My neighbor later suffered his motorcycle being stolen by the same delinquent, and he DID actually tell the kid he knew he did it--and the kid immediately complained TO THE POLICE, who visited my neighbor and threatened him. Of course, they did nothing about that theft either. The delinquent continued to rob neighborhood houses when everyone was at work, unchallenged and protected by the police (who said they couldn't do anything about it since he was underage), until we moved.

Do I need to mention how many times my family has received speeding tickets because when we were young because we had a sporty-looking car (twice being pulled out of lines of traffic)? Or the time they lowered the speed limit on a clear straightaway through Florida agricultural fields to 30 mph (it was previously 45), then ticketed everyone for going 46 mph (I later realized the cop had lied, I wasn't going nearly that fast, but the fine was huge if you went 15 mph over the limit), for 2 months to create a huge windfall, then changed the speed limit back since the road was actually designed for 60 mph.

When I was young, my hometown had a police force of one part-time cop. Now the same town has the SAME population, but a force of over 22 cops with ultra-expensive cars that do nothing but hand out fines to motorists. They STILL don't investigate burglaries or vandalisms, as I found out when my Dad's home was vandalized this last winter.

Over and above the risk of being highway-robbed by the traffic police every time you drive, we also have skyrocketing property taxes. In order to pay for the army of traffic cops (as well as other overpaid and fat-early-pensioned government workers), property taxes are about 400% higher than when I was young, and retirees and those losing their jobs are now losing their homes to the obscene property tax rates in NH--even if their homes are already paid for.

As a related matter, the government's ridiculous Drug War not only cost a fortune and accomplished absolutely nothing productive, but it also maximized justice system costs by flooding the jails with drug users instead of real criminals. Again, all government cares about is maximizing its own size and power and wealth, while avoiding doing anything that would benefit the citizenry.

Everything about our government is insane. Time to dismantle it and start again; this baby died in the bath long ago and any argument of throwing the baby out with the bath water simply doesn't apply anymore.
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Old 06-12-2011, 04:32 AM
 
Location: The Woods
18,358 posts, read 26,495,840 times
Reputation: 11351
Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
The right course of action would have been for the Amish to pay the fine, put the triangle on their buggy, and then work with their representative to amend the language of the law to allow the substitution of reflective tape in place of the triangle. Both sides in this issue are just too stubborn and hardheaded to give a little and so the loser is the taxpayers.
It goes against their religion to be active in politics like that.

Frankly, if people just drove carefully this would be a non-issue.
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Old 06-12-2011, 06:22 AM
 
21,026 posts, read 22,150,071 times
Reputation: 5941
Quote:
Originally Posted by pommysmommy View Post
If you make special accomodations in one instance you have to make special accomodations in all instances. You cannot enforce law based on special accomodations for religion.
Ya, you're right, so prayer in Public schools should be strictly forbidden...
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Old 06-12-2011, 07:33 AM
 
Location: NJ
23,557 posts, read 17,227,205 times
Reputation: 17591
Default Amish guilty,Law inadequate,Prosecutor w/o discretion

"Penn State University's Pennsylvania Transportation Institute, recently conducted a survey to learn why the symbol, which has been in use for more than 40 years and is required in 41 states, is not preventing more accidents."


http://www.allbusiness.com/transportation/road-transportation-trucking/11436814-1.html


The law which is claimed to be blind has a good eye peeking out from under the blindfold.

Who will protect the blind lady holding the scales?

Judges, lawyers and the good citizens will protect her. Oops, not so fast.

To stay on topic, if I was the ACLU I'd argue the orange symbol is inadequate and the law is absurd. I'd cite all the cases of trucks idling in the side of the highways with flashers blinking that become a final last stop for the sleepy and the drunk.

While the letter of the law is being violated by the Amish, their suggestion of running lamps at night is theoretically 'superior' to the current, but antiquated law. The law will spite itself and the taxpayers money to subjectively defend the letter of the law even if the content of that law is of dubious value. That's their job, safety is someone else's department. Except for the subjective enforcement and lack of judgement by judges, the prosecutor is doing his job.

Enjoy the Graves county website which encourages you to "ease down the road".

"Graves County has the small town charm, but is close enough to larger cities. If you’re tired of the fast lane make our hometown yours. Ease on down the road to Graves County. "
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:22 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,404 posts, read 6,578,949 times
Reputation: 1497
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammertime33 View Post
Exactly
OK then when are the "LAW Enforcement Police" going to make them put license plates and insurance on the buggies too ????. There goes their freedom just like all of ours. Just a added note. I have been exercising my freedom to travel rights, by driving my R V without license plates for the last 12 years, and when stopped I again exercise my rights and (as they should have ) and demand that a Verified Complaint be filed on the ticket the cops issued . When this is done and the cops can't give the court a verified complaint ( because no one was injured ) the case is dismissed as this one should have been . In the name of the "LAW" and in the interest of "JUSTICE" as some of the judges have said. By their religious beliefs they maybe "Amish", but they are still "AMERICAN" and they still have "CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS".
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Somewhere in Kentucky
3,791 posts, read 8,900,152 times
Reputation: 2448
Let them drive on roads that THEY pay for and then they can have nothing on their buggy if they wish.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:34 AM
 
24,832 posts, read 37,344,316 times
Reputation: 11538
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
It goes against their religion to be active in politics like that.

Frankly, if people just drove carefully this would be a non-issue.
We live in an area with the Amish.

There is hills and hard curves in the road, the buggies are very hard to see at night. And yes, they are on the road at night.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,404 posts, read 6,578,949 times
Reputation: 1497
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
It goes against their religion to be active in politics like that.

Frankly, if people just drove carefully this would be a non-issue.
Agreed 100%, anyone notice that in most of those so called accidents involving a buggy, it is a car (vehicle) hitting a buggy, not a buggy hitting a car.
Now remember those vehicles have a contract (license plates and drivers license to operate vehicle with the D M V )and that contract states that the person driving that vehicle shall have that vehicle under control at all times and shall drive in a safe manner according to road conditions. Now tell me who is in the wrong? what next Paint an ORANGE triangle on all the cow's , deer, rabbits, cats and dogs because they could cause an accident !.
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Old 06-12-2011, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,759,995 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fighter 1 View Post
OK then when are the "LAW Enforcement Police" going to make them put license plates and insurance on the buggies too ????. There goes their freedom just like all of ours. Just a added note. I have been exercising my freedom to travel rights, by driving my R V without license plates for the last 12 years, and when stopped I again exercise my rights and (as they should have ) and demand that a Verified Complaint be filed on the ticket the cops issued . When this is done and the cops can't give the court a verified complaint ( because no one was injured ) the case is dismissed as this one should have been . In the name of the "LAW" and in the interest of "JUSTICE" as some of the judges have said. By their religious beliefs they maybe "Amish", but they are still "AMERICAN" and they still have "CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS".
Well, yeah, let's just wait until a buggyful of Amish is killed or injured. That's a good pro-active approach.
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