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Old 06-19-2011, 06:19 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,676,974 times
Reputation: 5661

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marv101 View Post
Obama repeatedly stated during the campaign that 'Under my plan, energy prices would necessarily skyrocket'.

Toss in his Energy Secretary who really wants European-level gasoline prices ($8.00 a gallon in some places), and that should erase any doubt.

Sanders is wasting his time with such a ludicrous bill; Obama's nationwide lockdown of energy exploration, as well as being a fully-paid for slave of the greenies as reprehensibly as he is of trial lawyers and public employee unions is also another dead giveaway.
We already dealt with that claim on page 6, which was based upon cap and trade becoming law, which it did not.

Ok, what were those policies? We already know oil production is up 11% and demand is down -- the two factors in supply and demand and supply is up and demand is down.
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Old 06-19-2011, 06:35 AM
 
Location: Maine
561 posts, read 497,810 times
Reputation: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by cohdane View Post
If you're not going to take delivery, you shouldn't be participating in the supply/demand price dynamic. It's sick and immoral.
If you own stock or mutual fund shares you are speculating too.

Should Big Government stop you from investing this way?
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Old 06-19-2011, 06:36 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,676,974 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Actually you have it backwards.. Money is transferred FROM the speculators..
Yeah, Goldman Sach gets real rich transferring money from its pockets to farmers and oil drillers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
I'm for a strong dollar and greatly increased domestic oil production.

What side does that put me on?
The side that hasn't a clue about economics.

The price of oil today has nothing to do with the value of the dollar. Were that theory correct, oil would be less expensive in Europe where they don't use dollars. But oil has risen just as much in Europe and everywhere else.

The Price of Oil, in Euros


If the dollar was strong, American products would be expensive and it would be harder to sell those products in foreign markets, which hurts American jobs. It also would encourage corporations to close more factories in the U.S. and open them overseas where the strong dollar could buy cheaper labor -- just what we want to encourage, huh.

Moreover, the theory that more domestic production would have some impact is also false. There is no lack of supply. Oil companies hire very smart people to make sure they don't flood the market and drive prices down. It may be surprising to some but oil companies like it when prices are high and they maximize profits. The only reason oil companies advocate for more domestic production is because they want to pull it out of the ground for $5/bbl and sell it for $100/bbl. Their motivation isn't about bringing prices down for the consumer. It's about increasing their profits.
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Old 06-19-2011, 07:02 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,676,974 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Recovering Democrat View Post
If you own stock or mutual fund shares you are speculating too.

Should Big Government stop you from investing this way?
If you speculate in stock, the only price you drive up is the price of that stock and it doesn't effect the public at large. Not so with commodity speculation.
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Old 06-19-2011, 02:35 PM
 
Location: west mich
5,739 posts, read 6,787,369 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
I'm for a strong dollar and greatly increased domestic oil production.
What side does that put me on?
....Jeopardy song begins playing in background....
* "Domestic" oil production is not domestic. "American" oil companies are based here but have no allegiance to this country. People keep saying "we" need to drill for more oil (because it sounds patriotic). Big Oil is not "us".
* What is the connection of a "strong dollar" to oil prices?
Domestic drilling will have no effect on pump prices.
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Old 06-19-2011, 02:37 PM
 
44,019 posts, read 25,112,452 times
Reputation: 23737
Quote:
Originally Posted by detwahDJ View Post
* "Domestic" oil production is not domestic. "American" oil companies are based here but have no allegiance to this country. People keep saying "we" need to drill for more oil (because it sounds patriotic). Big Oil is not "us".
* What is the connection of a "strong dollar" to oil prices?
Domestic drilling will have no effect on pump prices.
Drilling here won't put people to work or reduce speculation?

A weak dollar doesn't effect commodity prices?
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Old 06-19-2011, 03:45 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,206 posts, read 25,659,800 times
Reputation: 12324
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
Yeah, Goldman Sach gets real rich transferring money from its pockets to farmers and oil drillers.
The side that hasn't a clue about economics.

The price of oil today has nothing to do with the value of the dollar. Were that theory correct, oil would be less expensive in Europe where they don't use dollars. But oil has risen just as much in Europe and everywhere else.

The Price of Oil, in Euros


If the dollar was strong, American products would be expensive and it would be harder to sell those products in foreign markets, which hurts American jobs. It also would encourage corporations to close more factories in the U.S. and open them overseas where the strong dollar could buy cheaper labor -- just what we want to encourage, huh.

Moreover, the theory that more domestic production would have some impact is also false. There is no lack of supply. Oil companies hire very smart people to make sure they don't flood the market and drive prices down. It may be surprising to some but oil companies like it when prices are high and they maximize profits. The only reason oil companies advocate for more domestic production is because they want to pull it out of the ground for $5/bbl and sell it for $100/bbl. Their motivation isn't about bringing prices down for the consumer. It's about increasing their profits.


Did someone say the Euro was doing much better?

Just because the USD is winning the race to the bottom doesn't mean the Euro doesn't also suck.

CAD, EUR and CHF vs USD


The price of everything we import has to do with the strength of the dollar. Since some imports are unavoidable, buying them with weak dollars amplifies the trade deficit. At the end of the day, we are still trading our things of value for their things of value. The weak dollar just makes us poorer over time.


True Prices Measured in Gold
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Old 06-19-2011, 04:26 PM
 
1,167 posts, read 2,133,557 times
Reputation: 804
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loveshiscountry View Post
Not a good idea to try and control prices. It doesn't work well.
The last attempt at a similar bill gave the Commodity Futures Trading Commission too much power to control the market.
Why not raise the margin?
Anyone who honestly thinks we have a free market is nuts. Oh yea, these billion dollar companies don't influence their markets. Yea right. They do. Everyday. Right now someone is doing something to influence the market of...I dunno, corn, in their favor. Lobbyist my friend. Tons of them. In a free market we wouldn't have lobbyist. That's why we have regulations. Because they'd be more than happy to cut corners, and charge you extra for the courtesy of them doing so, if they could get away with it.
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