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Old 08-02-2011, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
13,714 posts, read 31,176,487 times
Reputation: 9270

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
He has actually done a lot, Calvin. He established health care, repealed DADT and captured Bin Laden. He needs to come out for his health care plan strongly and boldly. I know you and many other folks like you hate it, but if it was good enough for him to put into policy, he needs to tout it.

DADT -- same thing. I know many Americans hate it, but if it was good enough for him to enact, it should be good enough for him to defend.
Obama established health care? I have been getting health care since I was an infant in the late 1950s. Obama only championed a very expensive, possibly illegal, and poorly crafted healthcare bill.

He pushed the repeal of DADT - and I give him kudos for that. I'm glad it is moving in that direction.

Captured Bin Laden? Well he gave the "go" order for the raid and I'm glad he did. I think we all know the prior president would have given the exact same order. So Obama's reaction was proper.

As for consensus building? You must be kidding. If he was a consensus builder the 2010 elections would have been vastly different. His administration and the Democratically controlled Congress pissed off the American people and the 2010 elections were the results.
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Old 08-02-2011, 12:34 PM
 
20,948 posts, read 19,051,128 times
Reputation: 10270
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
By all accounts, Obama is a consensus builder, not a rabble rouser. However, if he wants to win in 2012, he's going to have to change his stripes. He's going to have to aggressively attack the Bags and other conservatives as enemies of the America many of us, I believe the majority of us, want to live in.

Does he have it in him to do this? Doubtful... but if he goes on the offensive and explains to the American public in detail that the Bags are just the latest vanguard of a rightwing conspiracy that wants to dismantle the public sector, he will probably drum up enough votes to win in 2012 -- leaving the Bags and Bag supporters confused and outraged.
In other words, obama wants to fundamentally transform America into a nanny state.

So do his followers. Most of them without even knowing it.

There was never meant to be as large a "public sector" as we have today.
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Old 08-02-2011, 12:43 PM
 
7,381 posts, read 7,693,440 times
Reputation: 1266
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
They, or their backers, want to dismantle Social Security, Medicare and public schools for starters. Most Americans still see these things as part of "America."
.
Ah, the essence of the differences between the "teabaggers" and the "teabaggees". The teabaggees actually do believe that dependence upon government bureaucrats is "part of America", when the rest of us believe that indivdual achievement is what makes American great. I hope Obama runs on such a negative view of America, then the teabaggees will certainly lose more power.
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Old 08-02-2011, 12:46 PM
 
12,997 posts, read 13,644,862 times
Reputation: 11192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amaznjohn View Post
Ah, the essence of the differences between the "teabaggers" and the "teabaggees". The teabaggees actually do believe that dependence upon government bureaucrats is "part of America", when the rest of us believe that indivdual achievement is what makes American great. I hope Obama runs on such a negative view of America, then the teabaggees will certainly lose more power.
Well, since I have had money taken out of my check every month for two decades for Social Security and Medicare, I'd like to receive the services I've been paying for when I'm eligible. Foolish I know. I should be a "free man" who gladly gives his money to the government without expecting any return.
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Old 08-02-2011, 12:54 PM
 
7,381 posts, read 7,693,440 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
Well, since I have had money taken out of my check every month for two decades for Social Security and Medicare, I'd like to receive the services I've been paying for when I'm eligible. Foolish I know. I should be a "free man" who gladly gives his money to the government without expecting any return.
Foolish is expecting these debacles to provide for your needs when you retire. The REAL American way is to make plans for your future, assuming government assistance will not be available. When you depend upon the government, you're likely to be disappointed.
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Old 08-02-2011, 12:59 PM
 
12,997 posts, read 13,644,862 times
Reputation: 11192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amaznjohn View Post
Foolish is expecting these debacles to provide for your needs when you retire. The REAL American way is to make plans for your future, assuming government assistance will not be available. When you depend upon the government, you're likely to be disappointed.
I guess you're right. The REAL American way these days is just to give hundreds of dollars a month to the government for a retirement fund and when-I'm-old-health-care plan and then to vote for people who are going to steal your entitlements from you. No thanks. I think I'll stick with the party that is at least pretending to protect my interests.
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Old 08-02-2011, 01:03 PM
 
Location: planet octupulous is nearing earths atmosphere
13,621 posts, read 12,731,507 times
Reputation: 20050
it's a good thing they got the dept ceiling solved,, cause now they can get back to what realy counts.!!!! campaigning

i was worried there for a while
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Old 08-02-2011, 01:06 PM
 
7,381 posts, read 7,693,440 times
Reputation: 1266
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
I guess you're right. The REAL American way these days is just to give hundreds of dollars a month to the government for a retirement fund and when-I'm-old-health-care plan and then to vote for people who are going to steal your entitlements from you. No thanks. I think I'll stick with the party that is at least pretending to protect my interests.
Financially speaking, what would be the difference between "stealing" and "pretending not to steal"? The solution, as you seem to have defined it, and what the Tea Party wants to see happen, is to privatize SS so that individuals will have control over their retirement, instead of some "sleight of hand" politician in Washington. You may have invested too much money in SS by now for this to be beneficial, so at least be an advocate for the best solution for our children.
BTW, I haven't heard any plans from either side that would "steal" SS or Medicare. THis strawman won't stand.
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Old 08-02-2011, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,642 posts, read 26,378,527 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
By all accounts, Obama is a consensus builder, not a rabble rouser. However, if he wants to win in 2012, he's going to have to change his stripes. He's going to have to aggressively attack the Bags and other conservatives as enemies of the America many of us, I believe the majority of us, want to live in.

Does he have it in him to do this? Doubtful... but if he goes on the offensive and explains to the American public in detail that the Bags are just the latest vanguard of a rightwing conspiracy that wants to dismantle the public sector, he will probably drum up enough votes to win in 2012 -- leaving the Bags and Bag supporters confused and outraged.


Can you name a sitting president who was reelected with a Gallup presidential approval rating below 52%?
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Old 08-02-2011, 01:09 PM
 
7,381 posts, read 7,693,440 times
Reputation: 1266
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Can you name a sitting president who was reelected with a Gallup presidential approval rating below 52%?
It's early momonkey. Don't count your chickens..... Though Willy was slicker, Obama could pull the same stunt, with the Chicago political machine guiding his way.
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