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Until you do so, don't doubt those of us who have. Either mathematically prove me wrong or accept the fact that, statistically, the poll in this thread is accurate within 6%.
And what, you don't live in Germany any more but you are using German definitions of liberalism in a discussion of US politics? How can you ever (with a straight face) justify calling Obama 'right of center' in a conversation of American politics? You can't change the operating definition of words to suit your argument.
Of course the numbers in the poll are correct, they are what they are, I never said anything else. But I disagree with your interpretation, the key point which I have explained and which you keep ignoring... Numbers are just numbers and only say so much...
Nor have you mentioned any of those real communists or socialists you claim are posting on CD...
Until you do so, don't doubt those of us who have. Either mathematically prove me wrong or accept the fact that, statistically, the poll in this thread is accurate within 6%.
And what, you don't live in Germany any more but you are using German definitions of liberalism in a discussion of US politics? How can you ever (with a straight face) justify calling Obama 'right of center' in a conversation of American politics? You can't change the operating definition of words to suit your argument.
US politics on a normal spectrum aren't normal.
Every recent politican is Far Right and Authoritarian by all normal measures.
Every recent politican is Far Right and Authoritarian by all normal measures.
What do you consider a 'normal measure'?
I assumed we were operating under the current state of American politics when talking about current American politics. This is not a historical or global question.
I have honestly never heard the 'I am a liberal and am losing an argument, so I am going to change my definition of liberal' debate before...but hey, first time for anything!
Then again, this thread is about left and right. What is the point in hijacking the word left just because Americans have shifted their center to the right?
For instance, I don't think a capitalist can be considered on the left. But Obama and virtually every American on this board is a capitalist...
Then again, this thread is about left and right. What is the point in hijacking the word left just because Americans have shifted their center to the right?
Please explain what a normal political spectrum is then, since apparently the entirety of American politics has it wrong.
And also please stop trusting your own gut feeling above statistics. That is the kind of ignorance I only expect from tea partiers and people who like Michael Moore movies.
Please explain what a normal political spectrum is then, since apparently the entirety of American politics has it wrong.
And also please stop trusting your own gut feeling above statistics. That is the kind of ignorance I only expect from tea partiers and people who like Michael Moore movies.
Not wrong, but the entire US political spectrum has shifted to the right. I just think it is absurd and ridiculous to call people like Obama a socialist or communist, which I often read on this board, though, and which shows how far to the right mainstream America is.
Gut feeling? No, I think my approach makes sense. I take the numbers for what they are, no more, no less. But naked numbers need interpretation to make sense.
Not wrong, but the entire US political spectrum has shifted to the right. I just think it is absurd and ridiculous to call people like Obama a socialist or communist, which I often read on this board, though, and which shows how far to the right mainstream America is.
Gut feeling? No, I think my approach makes sense. I take the numbers for what they are, no more, no less. But naked numbers need interpretation to make sense.
So describe a 'normal political spectrum' for me.
And I will try to use less facts when talking to you in the future. The base numbers in this poll show that this forum clearly lies more liberal than conservative, and my math did nothing but statistically validate the poll, within a 6% margin of error. I am not sure what analysis needs to be done with confidence intervals. They are pretty straight forward.
And I will try to use less facts when talking to you in the future. The base numbers in this poll show that this forum clearly lies more liberal than conservative, and my math did nothing but statistically validate the poll, within a 6% margin of error. I am not sure what analysis needs to be done with confidence intervals. They are pretty straight forward.
To Americans the current US spectrum probably is normal as they are used to it. Just like to the Chinese their political spectrum is normal as they are used to it. And the Chinese do something similar to the US, they abuse a term. The Chinese are pretty Capitalist in many ways these days, still they think they are Communists. Americans on the other hand abuse the terms Communist, Socialist, and left(ist) from the other side.
Again, it's just numbers. As I said earlier, it is interesting for instance that there is a huge discrepancy between the differences between lines 1 and 2 on the one hand and 3 and 4 on the other. That perception is one detail that you ignore when you just look at how many feel to be on the left or on the right.
To Americans the current US spectrum probably is normal as they are used to it. Just like to the Chinese their political spectrum is normal as they are used to it. And the Chinese do something similar to the US, they abuse a term. The Chinese are pretty Capitalist in many ways these days, still they think they are Communists. Americans on the other hand abuse the terms Communist, Socialist, and left(ist) from the other side.
Again, it's just numbers. As I said earlier, it is interesting for instance that there is a huge discrepancy between the differences between lines 1 and 2 on the one hand and 3 and 4 on the other. That perception is one detail that you ignore when you just look at how many feel to be on the left or on the right.
About your first paragraph...sure...but this conversation is taking place WITHIN THE AMERICAN POLITICAL SYSTEM. This isn't some ivory tower philosophical/academic debate.
You seem to be ignoring statistical validity. I am starting to get the feeling you don't completely understand what a confidence interval even is.
About your first paragraph...sure...but this conversation is taking place WITHIN THE AMERICAN POLITICAL SYSTEM. This isn't some ivory tower philosophical/academic debate.
You seem to be ignoring statistical validity. I am starting to get the feeling you don't completely understand what a confidence interval even is.
Sure, but still, it is an abuse of terms such as Socialist, terms that have an international, pretty well defined meaning.
Regarding your statistics, let me give you an analogy:
Say we define some standard weight and ask people on this board whether they are above or below that weight. 56% say they are lighter, 44% say they are heavier. Does that mean that the average poster on this board is lighter than the standard weight? Not necessarily because those that are heavier may be on average, say, 20kg heavier than the standard, while those that are lighter may be on average, say, 5kg lighter than the standard.
And even the standard weight itself may already be quite heavy by international terms
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