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Old 08-12-2011, 11:27 PM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,125,541 times
Reputation: 11095

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It is demand that “creates jobs.” I scare-quote “creates jobs” because the phrase itself is misleading, giving the impression that businesses have a godlike ability to materialize employment, if only we would perform the right incantations and animal sacrifices. The fact is, our economy, like our government, consists of three (theoretically) co-equal branches: businesses, workers, and consumers. In order for the economy to do well, all three branches must be kept healthy. The problem is, the practices of one branch (businesses) have critically weakened the other two.

This is all the more amazing because those two weakened branches consist of the same people, yet all of the power still rests in the hands of business. There are no jobs because there is no demand, because consumers can’t afford to buy business’s products and services, because there are no jobs. In the short term, businesses can realize record profits by cutting costs (killing jobs), exploiting foreign labor (killing jobs), and gouging consumers for whatever they can (killing demand), but eventually, these “makers” will have no consumers left to sell to, and thus, no need to hire any of them.

Thom Hartmann | Fox Business Network | Class Warfare | Mediaite
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:30 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,321,408 times
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It's a complicated feedback loop.

Studying the endocrine system may help to understand the economy.
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:33 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
37,803 posts, read 41,013,481 times
Reputation: 62204
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
It is demand that “creates jobs.” I scare-quote “creates jobs” because the phrase itself is misleading, giving the impression that businesses have a godlike ability to materialize employment, if only we would perform the right incantations and animal sacrifices. The fact is, our economy, like our government, consists of three (theoretically) co-equal branches: businesses, workers, and consumers. In order for the economy to do well, all three branches must be kept healthy. The problem is, the practices of one branch (businesses) have critically weakened the other two.

This is all the more amazing because those two weakened branches consist of the same people, yet all of the power still rests in the hands of business. There are no jobs because there is no demand, because consumers can’t afford to buy business’s products and services, because there are no jobs. In the short term, businesses can realize record profits by cutting costs (killing jobs), exploiting foreign labor (killing jobs), and gouging consumers for whatever they can (killing demand), but eventually, these “makers” will have no consumers left to sell to, and thus, no need to hire any of them.

Thom Hartmann | Fox Business Network | Class Warfare | Mediaite
Nope. Nope. According to the snarky Mr Jay Carney, unemployment checks create jobs. Yeah, I know.

Jay Carney Claims Unemployment Checks Create Jobs « The Greenroom
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:34 PM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,125,541 times
Reputation: 11095
Quote:
Originally Posted by ergohead View Post
It's a complicated feedback loop.

Studying the endocrine system may help to understand the economy.
The people that get it got it a long time ago and America's middle class prospered. The people that do not get the simple common sense of it never will for obvious reasons and then there are the ones that get it, but it will undermine lining their pockets in the short haul.
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:40 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,321,408 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
The people that get it got it a long time ago and America's middle class prospered. The people that do not get the simple common sense of it never will for obvious reasons and then there are the ones that get it, but it will undermine lining their pockets in the short haul.
You're right about quarterly gaming of the Wall Street casino.

Dumbest damn thing I've ever seen.
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:45 PM
 
Location: Republic of Texas
988 posts, read 1,203,566 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
It is demand that “creates jobs.” --snip--
Is there room in your analysis for a criticism of unions (workers) cutting the balls off of businesses with their unrealistic demands. Any culpability there for offshoring of jobs?

Then when a company like Boeing tries to create jobs in a right-to-work state, the union brownshirts and their co-conspirators in the NLRB go lunar.
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Old 08-13-2011, 12:15 AM
 
27,624 posts, read 21,125,541 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eric3781 View Post
Is there room in your analysis for a criticism of unions (workers) cutting the balls off of businesses with their unrealistic demands. Any culpability there for offshoring of jobs?

Then when a company like Boeing tries to create jobs in a right-to-work state, the union brownshirts and their co-conspirators in the NLRB go lunar.
There is a movement in America by conservative groups to demonize unions as bad for the country because unions are bad for corporations. Anyone with a pulse knows Republicans are in opposition to anything that threatens the power of corporations, and conservatives protect corporate America at any cost.

Conservatives have fought to prevent union organization at corporate giants like Wal-Mart to keep wages low so they can make more profits and abuse their workforce. Wal-Mart employees in Europe are represented by unions, and workers enjoy paid sick leave, living wages, 4-6 weeks of vacation, and retirement plans that make the golden years tolerable. European workers do not understand why their “brothers and sisters” in America cannot have union representation.

It is not new for conservatives to protect corporations at the expense of workers, and propaganda that unions are evil is a weapon that Republicans are ramping up again because of the sluggish economy.

At some point, America will become a corporation, and 98% of Americans will live in poverty because Republicans are hell-bent on destroying the middle class.
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Old 08-13-2011, 12:24 AM
 
25,021 posts, read 27,930,716 times
Reputation: 11790
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
There is a movement in America by conservative groups to demonize unions as bad for the country because unions are bad for corporations. Anyone with a pulse knows Republicans are in opposition to anything that threatens the power of corporations, and conservatives protect corporate America at any cost.

Conservatives have fought to prevent union organization at corporate giants like Wal-Mart to keep wages low so they can make more profits and abuse their workforce. Wal-Mart employees in Europe are represented by unions, and workers enjoy paid sick leave, living wages, 4-6 weeks of vacation, and retirement plans that make the golden years tolerable. European workers do not understand why their “brothers and sisters” in America cannot have union representation.

It is not new for conservatives to protect corporations at the expense of workers, and propaganda that unions are evil is a weapon that Republicans are ramping up again because of the sluggish economy.

At some point, America will become a corporation, and 98% of Americans will live in poverty because Republicans are hell-bent on destroying the middle class.
If you want a prosperous country, you don't need unions. You need to slap tariffs on countries like China, India, and withdraw from free trade agreements and abolish the federal personal income tax and property tax
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Old 08-13-2011, 04:44 AM
 
22,768 posts, read 30,733,597 times
Reputation: 14745
Quote:
Originally Posted by sickofnyc View Post
There is a movement in America by conservative groups to demonize unions as bad for the country because unions are bad for corporations. Anyone with a pulse knows Republicans are in opposition to anything that threatens the power of corporations, and conservatives protect corporate America at any cost.

Conservatives have fought to prevent union organization at corporate giants like Wal-Mart to keep wages low so they can make more profits and abuse their workforce. Wal-Mart employees in Europe are represented by unions, and workers enjoy paid sick leave, living wages, 4-6 weeks of vacation, and retirement plans that make the golden years tolerable. European workers do not understand why their “brothers and sisters” in America cannot have union representation.

It is not new for conservatives to protect corporations at the expense of workers, and propaganda that unions are evil is a weapon that Republicans are ramping up again because of the sluggish economy.

At some point, America will become a corporation, and 98% of Americans will live in poverty because Republicans are hell-bent on destroying the middle class.
see, i thought your first post was great. i agree with it completely.

but then you somehow turn to "unions" as the answer.. which to me is waay off.
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Old 08-13-2011, 06:05 AM
 
Location: Pluto's Home Town
9,982 posts, read 13,762,061 times
Reputation: 5691
I think the opening post perfectly describes what we are seeing now. Corporations can realize short-term profits by axing workers or cutting pay and benefits to the bone. But they are screwing themselves in the long-term. If we are all cash poor, who will buy their stuff? When three hundred million people have money to spend, all sorts of businesses prosper.

And you are right, this is not new. I think Henry Ford realized his own employees would be his customers if wages were adequate. He took the long view and invested in the future. Our current pack of corporate raiders are always looking for the short-term buck, which is destroying the middle class, and the American economy.

What is also unprecedented is how with everyone so politically charged, a working guy will not go on and on ranting against unions and protecting corporate practices that weaken him personally. It is really absurd. As if the individual has the power to leverage better conditions without organizing in some way. The American worker has been stabbed in the back, but his own fingerprints are also on the knife.
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