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your personal debts are not the debts we're talking about.. but your notion of thinking its all about YOU in your comments reflects alot..
I'm speaking more of the debts in society.. and Government....
You damn straight!
I am taking responsibility and paying off my bills----------I have little or no control what Bush et all have done so I do not feel guilty at all.
I am taking responsibility and paying off my bills----------I have little or no control what Bush et all have done so I do not feel guilty at all.
nobody is talking about YOU as a person.. we're talking about the bigger picture.. and a generation as a whole.... While babyboomers have been in power and been the most influencial in voting in politicians.. many things have changed.. like social security is going bankrupt.. costly unwarranted wars... and the list goes on...THOSE are the issues being encompassed in what was allowed to foster under the baby boomers... and that is what is being discussed.. so the best way to enlighten you is to say.. don't make this personal... because its NOT
I have decided that everything that is wrong with America (and perhaps the world) is the babyboomers (BB) fault. As a group (not individuals) they are the greediest, most short sighted, most vain, and most self-center group. That is going to drive America right off the cliff.
Look where we are today. Housing prices that got so out of control that we needed all types "exotic" loans just of afford them. Of course this was caused by a lot of boomer's getting greedy and thinking they "deserved" these ridiculous high price. Also they got into flipping houses alot which only drove house prices up more. It was insane! That's why I'm extremely happy that a lot of the housing markets are going down the toilet. I pray that things finally get back to being affordable.
On that thought loans, I say BBs also to blame for our current credit crisis. "Barrow, Barrow, Barrow" I think is the Boomer's fight song. BBs have basically borrowed us in to a deep hole that we in the end might not be able to get out of. Where is that Generation's sense of responsibility and accountability. You do have to pay the piper end. And as we've seen lately, the last song is about to be played. Get your ducats ready. Granted I do know a few kid out of my Gen. (Gen x) that are not responsible and are following BBs over the cliff (thanks to the BBs teaching to them). But also know a lot of my Gen. that have been just waiting and watching for the crap to start flying, then swoop in and pick on the carcasses after all the BBs are finished cutting each others throats. So you better be looking over your shoulder because My Generation and the Y's are coming to take your stuff. One last thing on the credit issue. I wonder if the Boomer's ever think about what Greatest Gen. would think of them. Most Greatest Gen that I've had the pleasure to meet are frugal and don't barrow unless they have to. Granted going through a depression and a world war probably made them be responsible. I personally like there approach for the most part. And hope my Gen. will follow there way of being. You own what you own and barrow only when you got to. Yeah we might not see record growth in wealth with this approach, But of course if you if you watched the market lately those who thought they had wealth just found out that it all on paper and ain't for real.
Just two other issue and I promise I'll stop my rant. Now on to how babyboomers have ruined America's standing in the world. Look where we are today. We're the lowest we've ever been in the world standing. When the F did we as a people decide that we needed to quote "spread democracy." and start nation building projects through force of arms. You can throw all the Sept 11 crap out you want. I ain't Buying it. If you really wanted to get the bad guys you should have "spread democracy" to Saudi Arabia and there Madrases that teach their kids to want to kill us. Of course we wouldn't want to do that because there just to many good ties between our current administration (made up of a lot of boomer's) and the house of Saud. Don't get me wrong I didn't like the last administration's "invasion" into Kosovo either. But this is on a whole other level. And my reason for Blaming the BBs on this one is, 1. the commander and chief is a baby boomer, which in turn reflects badly on you guys. and 2. A large percentage of you guys voted for this for lack of a better word numb-skull TWICE! He won both the electoral college and the popular vote. WTF? What were you thinking. Hey you can try to rebuff by saying my Gen was a part of this voting. Yeah but GenX isn't big enough to sway the vote that much and the most of the Y's weren't old enough to vote yet. So that on your heads. You were too afraid or too easily lead to do the right thing and change up leadership when we still had a chance to save face. Thanks alot. It going to take years and a lot of responsible actions by America to win back the trust of the world. Heck on a national level it going to take alot of work to put the trust in the government back into the American people.
This last finger of blame is a preemptive blame. You know And I know you boomer's are living longer and longer. But what is the cost to our society is your long life span? My guess is it going to be pretty expensive to live to 80,90,100 years old. So who's going to have to pay the cost of you guys when you simply can't work any more. Who's going to have to pay the bill of your prescriptions drugs, your hospital stays, your constant doctors visits, etc,etc. I think your going to try to throw that one on us. Here's how I see that playing out. One day your going to get really old and bills because of your health are going to start mounting. And you say what can I do? Then the light bulb goes off and you say "Socialized Medicine that it! So you get all your old friends together that are also in the same boat and start committees on how we need Socialized health care. And eventually your movement ill pick up momentum enough and votes enough to force our politicians to vote for it. And your health wallet is saved by the taxpayers hooray for you. But again my Gen, GenY, and by then the Millenniums is left holding the bag with higher taxes and less wealth. But maybe, Just maybe the Gen X'er,Y'er, and Millenniums can pull together and stop the BBs from stepping on us. And maybe We'll say in a united voice "I'm as mad as hell! and I'm not going to take it anymore!" And then, final then we would be ready to put the Baby Boomers in past, and be able to move on to a brighter future.
We will see.
Yeah. I know my rant was long. So thank to all (including boomer's) that read this far. So did this P.O. you? Or make you think? Well I started it. Now it's your turn to answer. Let have a debate on this board for real. let lose with all you got. No quarter is asked for and none given. But I'm sure we'll have some fun with it while we're at it.
Baystater.
You rock! I'm a gen-xer, and the BB jacked everything up! The XYM's need to form one voice and vote as a unit against the BB's. The XYM's should vote to reduce the amount of money BB receive at retirement now by increasing the retirement age to 97 years old so BB can't collect for another 30 years, which would put all of us into the 2040's by which time the BB will start to die off. In 2039, XYM's will vote to readjusted the retirement age to be 62 years old. Why? Because in 2039, the XYM's will be approaching retirement.
Although I am a boomer I agree with you. It is refreshing to see someone from (Gen X) who is intellegent enough to see the truth. The BB's in earlier days were known as the "me generation" due to their self centeredness. They are a spoiled generation that has never had to suffer the hard times which develop real responsibility. They have sold their own liberties and the future of generations to come for their own selfish desires. The thing that really worries me is the level of responsibility I see in the following generations is no better and in many respects worse than the BB's. You are also right about what is going to happen when the BB's get old. Historicaly senior citizens always have dissporportionate political power due to the fact that they vote in higher numbers than younger people and politions pander to them. The best thing that could happen to the country at this point would be to have a depression on the scale of 1929. It would change the political landscape and force people to look at what wrong with America. I doubt if this will happen though, the way I see it we will continue to borrow until the situation gets so bad the people will take the easy way out and join the North American Union. Of course they will have to give up their rights and Constitution but no one even knows what their rights are or what the Constution says anyway. It is amazing what you can do to a population that is un-educated.
While babyboomers have been in power and been the most influencial in voting in politicians.. many things have changed.. like social security is going bankrupt.. costly unwarranted wars... and the list goes on...
Costly, unwarranted wars...yes. Social Security going bankrupt...no.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
don't make this personal... because its NOT
That's right...it could just as easily be about people who were born on a Tuesday. And it would make just as much sense that way, too...
Costly, unwarranted wars...yes. Social Security going bankrupt...no.
That's right...it could just as easily be about people who were born on a Tuesday. And it would make just as much sense that way, too...
social security.. YES... the fact is... there are more babyboomers that are looking to cash out of social security.. than the amount they have paid into it... not to mention the politicians they have elected and allowed over the years to borrow from the fund...
And it is NOT personal because NOT everyone is at fault by default... its a broad general statement of power and choices made durring a time in our history that encompasses THAT generation...
You're comparing apples to oranges.. but you are right in that they are both fruit...
social security.. YES... the fact is... there are more babyboomers that are looking to cash out of social security.. than the amount they have paid into it...
No, that's not a fact. There are more than ample funds within the system to pay full benefits until beyond the time the last boomer is dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
not to mention the politicians they have elected and allowed over the years to borrow from the fund...
You probably mean that the SS Trust Fund is invested in US Treasury securities, the safest, most secure investment vehicle in the history of the world.
But I didn't and don't mean to hijack the thread. There are various other P&OC threads on SS out there...
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
And it is NOT personal because NOT everyone is at fault by default... its a broad general statement of power and choices made durring a time in our history that encompasses THAT generation...
You're comparing apples to oranges.. but you are right in that they are both fruit...
Well, you're working on fruit salad. There a two separate cultural cohorts within the Boomer generation -- the Leading Edge (born 1946-55) and the Trailing Edge (born 1956-1964). And the whole group spans a mere 19 years, meaning that at least two other full generations have been alive and making socially significant decisions at the same time that the Boomers have. Even today, when supposedly at there apex, Boomers are only about 28% of the population. That's only a little more than the number of blacks plus atheists in the country...
No, that's not a fact. There are more than ample funds within the system to pay full benefits until beyond the time the last boomer is dead.
You probably mean that the SS Trust Fund is invested in US Treasury securities, the safest, most secure investment vehicle in the history of the world.
But I didn't and don't mean to hijack the thread. There are various other P&OC threads on SS out there...
Well, you're working on fruit salad. There a two separate cultural cohorts within the Boomer generation -- the Leading Edge (born 1946-55) and the Trailing Edge (born 1956-1964). And the whole group spans a mere 19 years, meaning that at least two other full generations have been alive and making socially significant decisions at the same time that the Boomers have. Even today, when supposedly at there apex, Boomers are only about 28% of the population. That's only a little more than the number of blacks plus atheists in the country...
its commonly known that the social security system is in the situation where the current working generations contributions are going towards the current retiring generation.. Baby boomers outnumber the lower generations, thus giving them their very name..
And breaking this up into cohorts is fine and dandy.. but that just further exlains what I've said all along.. that not EVERYONE is at fault by default personally.. it is the Majority voice that has enacted legislation and policies that define the generation.. You're disecting it to find a loop hole.. and the whole argument is on a wide broad timeline.. and you're right.. 20 years is a short time.. but consider their numbers.. and what has happened in a 20 year time.. and I think you get a better idea of how things can change pretty quickly by one generation.. the depression and WWII encompassed 16 years give or take a few...
you're implying that baby boomers are not black or athiest in your comparison....and that is just baseless
No, that's not a fact. There are more than ample funds within the system to pay full benefits until beyond the time the last boomer is dead.
Wow, if you really believe this you should do some research on the suject. Even the GAO admits the system is insolvent after 2041.
This is a quote directly from the U.S Goverment Accounting Office Website.
"As you know, the Social Security Board of Trustees is projecting in its 2007 report that as early as 2017 Social Security benefit payments will exceed tax revenues. After that time, the gap between costs and tax revenues grows continuously, and unless action is taken to close this gap, it is currently estimated that the Social Security trust funds will be depleted by 2041."
its commonly known that the social security system is in the situation where the current working generations contributions are going towards the current retiring generation.
That's always been the case. That's how the program works. Or at least it did until 1983, when the Boomers agreed to tax themselves substantially more than what they would have needed to keep the system current in order to build up the reserve that would be needed to pay for the blip that their own retirements would eventually cause. That's the surplus. That's what's in the SS Trust Fund. It will peak around 2030 at a balance of about $5.5 trillion or so. Maybe a little more. Starting around 2020, it will be spent down so that then-current workers won't have to foot that extra Boomer bill. Pretty slowly at first, then faster. It'll all be gone somewhere around 2060-ish unless things somehow change dramatically between now and then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
And breaking this up into cohorts is fine and dandy.. but that just further exlains what I've said all along.. that not EVERYONE is at fault by default personally..
Yes, and I agree with that part. But the largest part of the Boomers isn't at fault for anything no matter how you slice it. They went to college, they got jobs, they tried to buy houses (which wasn't easy with mortgage rates at 9-14%), they had kids, they took them to Disney World, they saved up to send them to college, and now they're getting ready to retire. They just tried to live their lives as best they could. I don't know why you want to blame them for that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
...it is the Majority voice that has enacted legislation and policies that define the generation..
That 28% has never been a majority. Lots of things have happened on the national and global stage over the years that the Boomers have been around alright, but the average Boomer had nothing to do with any of them. Doesn't seem quite proper to be hoping that they'll all hurry up and die, which seems to be the sentiment of some.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
You're disecting it to find a loop hole.. and the whole argument is on a wide broad timeline..
I'm questionning the relevance and validity of an argument that is set up to give people credit or blame for things they had no control over and nothing to do with. Only a few people invented the PC, not Boomers. We just bought them once they got cheap enough to afford. Same with microwaves. And Cable-TV. And cell phones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
...and you're right.. 20 years is a short time.. but consider their numbers.. and what has happened in a 20 year time.. and I think you get a better idea of how things can change pretty quickly by one generation.. the depression and WWII encompassed 16 years give or take a few...
Yeah, and a decent chunk of that Greatest Generation joined the Communist Party at some point during the Depression. Particularly among the best-and-brightest of them. Then they turned around 20 years later and let Joe McCarthy and the Red Scare run amok. With a record like that, maybe we should root for the rest of them to die out real soon as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy
you're implying that baby boomers are not black or athiest in your comparison....and that is just baseless
No, I'm merely saying for purposes of illustration that the number of Boomers is about the same as that of blacks and atheists added together.
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