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Location: Georgia, on the Florida line, right above Tallahassee
10,471 posts, read 15,830,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DifferentDrum
Remember we do not know the long term effects of Gardasil and it does not cure cancer or prevent all cervical cancer.
GBS is just one of the problems with vaccines. Did you watch the vid above with the recording of Dr. Hilleman? Vaccines can carry many cancer causing agents and toxic substances, such as mercury, which isone of the most toxic agents known to man. Are you 100% sure of what's in YOUR vaccines?
If you are, then fine. What I would be careful about is advising and encouraging others to take them. Best to advise people to read labels and look up information for themselves.
Mercury is ONE OF THE MOST TOXIC SUBSTANCES KNOWN TO MAN.
That's why it's in every can of tuna fish. BECAUSE IT'S SO FREAKING TOXIC. Why can't you people just believe the lunatics, it would be so much simpler that way. They're TRYING TO KILL OUR KIDS WITH TASTY SANDWICHES.
Statewide Fish Consumption Advisory for Mercury - Washington State Department of Health (http://www.doh.wa.gov/ehp/oehas/fish/fishadvmerc.htm - broken link)
Ok, well I've been paid well to do what I do for 20 years so I guess it's not just self professed.
In a world rife with incompetence, I wouldn't wave a paycheck around as proof of anything other than employment. There are plenty of people out there that are highly overpaid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy
Here are your errors:
1) Just a few posts ago it was 1 in 912 and now it's suddenly 1 in 94?
Nope .... not my error ... just you apparently not keeping up with the conversation, and making false assumptions. There are multiple trials and associated statistics, as well as figures being reported in real world adverse reactions and deaths outside of the controlled trials ... and as we can see ... all are showing wildly different risk percentages, though none of them showing acceptable safety.
For example, I also cited the 4 in 120 death rate (from the health authorities in India) ... and there are DOZENS more for which I could include, though that would likely just add to the confusion that already exists. The 1 in 912 deaths I cited EARLIER was the most conservative figure coming directly from the CDC. So, I'll graciously stick with that one, rather than the others that show far greater danger ... because I'm just a fair kinda guy ... and even the conservative figure is DREADFUL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy
2) You are adding all deaths by any cause for someone taking gardasil and dividing by the exposures. You are then comparing deaths ONLY due to cervical cancer and dividing.
I know this is going to be tough, but try to follow some logic here ... among the deaths reported (that you claim is all cause) only 1 death occurred in the saline placebo group. Now that may mean that the placebo group was just extremely lucky ... or it may mean that some of the Gardasil deaths attributed to say ... "car accidents" may have occurred due to seizures, fainting, and convulsions as a result of the vaccine ... which by the way, are all listed as potential side affects of the vaccine on the vaccine insert. A couple of others were listed associated to pulmonary infections ... sepsis, etc .... which can be attributed to infections from injecting viral-chemical toxins into the body for which all vaccinations actually do. According to you and Merck ... none of the deaths can be proven as caused by the vaccine.
And I suppose the autoimmune reactions are also attributable to car accidents too? After all, it does have "auto"in the name.
Furthermore, what a joke to claim someone else is playing loose with facts and figures and math, given the amount of shenanigans the CDC and FDA routinely engage in regarding vaccine safety.
Of course, they also claim (and I'm sure you believe them) that all cervical cancer is caused by HPV, even in absence of definitive proof, with only correlation as evidence. What is totally dismissed is anything else as a potential cause for cervical cancer, such as dioxin exposure from feminine products, and a whole host of environmental toxins that compromise immune function, which by the way, is really the cause of all cancers. A properly functioning immune system prevents cancer from manifesting, but we never here the medical community talk about that fact, or the simple, inexpensive, natural, non-pharmaceutical immune boosting supplements that are available that can prevent cancer, and also combat it. We just hear about co-factors and how we must address them ... ironically, with vaccines that also compromise immune function.
Moreover ... and this is probably beyond your level of knowledge ... HPV is a retrovirus (like HIV) ... and there are numerous problems with retroviruses behaving in the manner the medical establishment claims .... that's a whole can of worms all by itself.
Bet you don't know about the hundreds of geneticists, microbiologists, immunologists who emphatically declare that HIV doesn't and cannot cause Aids ? Well ... it's true. You just won't hear about them from the sources you consult.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy
To put it another way, if you have 30 accountants die out of 1000 one year due to all causes and you have 20 crab fishermen die out of 1000 due only to their job. Your logic would claim that the accountants have a more dangerous job than crab fisherman even though none of they died on the job but 30 of them had car accidents or heart attacks etc.
You seem to love these little analogies that have no relevance to the discussion, but lets try to stick to the issue...
So, back to the figures .... we'll take the two figures as a DIRECT COMPARISON
1) CDC Data showing 1 death out of every 912 participants in the trial.
2) National Cancer Institute numbers show the death rate for cervical cancer in the US is 1.7 per 100,000.
The direct comparison between these two statistics as applicable to the 100,000 figure, we would have 109 per every 100,000 suffering death from the vaccine as opposed to the 1 death from cancer. That's 109 to 1, or 109 times more likely to die from the vaccine than from the disease.
This is the relative point ... not what you or I want to believe, or choose to believe.
Furthermore, there is real world data suggesting that the danger this vaccine poses is far worse than the propaganda suggests. And this information comes from the VAERS system which is known to account for only 10% or less of the actual adverse reactions to vaccines. Some claim it only reflects about 1% of the cases.
The VAERS system has reported over 18,000 cases of adverse reactions to Gardasil, and 68 deaths. This could be 10 or more times worse, given the lack of reporting. Most adverse reactions are never associated with vaccinations of any type because medical practitioners will rarely associate adverse reactions to any procedure they participated in.
And these numbers are not "all cause" ... these are direct reports of reactions and deaths associated with the administration of the vaccine.
The reality is, HPV vaccine is quickly being recognized as one of the most dangerous vaccines to date, based on real world, direct reports of harm.
Not necessarily. Notice how the American Academy of Neurology says "most" recover with few remaining problems. Some die, and not everyone recovers. Many will certain degree of weakness.
The AAN's recommendation of monitoring the known connection between the HPV vaccine and GBS is enough to cause concern. It's all fine until you or someone you care about is afflicted.
Notice how the info on the HPV vaccine-GBS link was embargoed until Feb 2009. That's when lobbyists were trying to get states to require the vaccine by law.
Yes and that includes deaths due to car accidents, gun shot etc etc.
I guess that if we don't get the vaccine that we should logically be immortal?
Seriously though, I've earned my paycheck doing numerical analysis for 2 decades now and what you are doing with numbers is the statistical equivalent of sticking your arm under a running mower to see if the blade is sharp.
Not really, as these events happened in the control group too and at about the same rate! PS: I agree with you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 70Ford
Mercury is ONE OF THE MOST TOXIC SUBSTANCES KNOWN TO MAN.
That's why it's in every can of tuna fish. BECAUSE IT'S SO FREAKING TOXIC. Why can't you people just believe the lunatics, it would be so much simpler that way. They're TRYING TO KILL OUR KIDS WITH TASTY SANDWICHES.
Statewide Fish Consumption Advisory for Mercury - Washington State Department of Health (http://www.doh.wa.gov/ehp/oehas/fish/fishadvmerc.htm - broken link)
Agreed, and . . . . there is no mercury in Gardasil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas
In a world rife with incompetence, I wouldn't wave a paycheck around as proof of anything other than employment. There are plenty of people out there that are highly overpaid.
Nope .... not my error ... just you apparently not keeping up with the conversation, and making false assumptions. There are multiple trials and associated statistics, as well as figures being reported in real world adverse reactions and deaths outside of the controlled trials ... and as we can see ... all are showing wildly different risk percentages, though none of them showing acceptable safety.
For example, I also cited the 4 in 120 death rate (from the health authorities in India) ... and there are DOZENS more for which I could include, though that would likely just add to the confusion that already exists. The 1 in 912 deaths I cited EARLIER was the most conservative figure coming directly from the CDC. So, I'll graciously stick with that one, rather than the others that show far greater danger ... because I'm just a fair kinda guy ... and even the conservative figure is DREADFUL.
I know this is going to be tough, but try to follow some logic here ... among the deaths reported (that you claim is all cause) only 1 death occurred in the saline placebo group. Now that may mean that the placebo group was just extremely lucky ... or it may mean that some of the Gardasil deaths attributed to say ... "car accidents" may have occurred due to seizures, fainting, and convulsions as a result of the vaccine ... which by the way, are all listed as potential side affects of the vaccine on the vaccine insert. A couple of others were listed associated to pulmonary infections ... sepsis, etc .... which can be attributed to infections from injecting viral-chemical toxins into the body for which all vaccinations actually do. According to you and Merck ... none of the deaths can be proven as caused by the vaccine.
And I suppose the autoimmune reactions are also attributable to car accidents too? After all, it does have "auto"in the name.
Furthermore, what a joke to claim someone else is playing loose with facts and figures and math, given the amount of shenanigans the CDC and FDA routinely engage in regarding vaccine safety.
Of course, they also claim (and I'm sure you believe them) that all cervical cancer is caused by HPV, even in absence of definitive proof, with only correlation as evidence. What is totally dismissed is anything else as a potential cause for cervical cancer, such as dioxin exposure from feminine products, and a whole host of environmental toxins that compromise immune function, which by the way, is really the cause of all cancers. A properly functioning immune system prevents cancer from manifesting, but we never here the medical community talk about that fact, or the simple, inexpensive, natural, non-pharmaceutical immune boosting supplements that are available that can prevent cancer, and also combat it. We just hear about co-factors and how we must address them ... ironically, with vaccines that also compromise immune function.
Moreover ... and this is probably beyond your level of knowledge ... HPV is a retrovirus (like HIV) ... and there are numerous problems with retroviruses behaving in the manner the medical establishment claims .... that's a whole can of worms all by itself.
Bet you don't know about the hundreds of geneticists, microbiologists, immunologists who emphatically declare that HIV doesn't and cannot cause Aids ? Well ... it's true. You just won't hear about them from the sources you consult.
You seem to love these little analogies that have no relevance to the discussion, but lets try to stick to the issue...
So, back to the figures .... we'll take the two figures as a DIRECT COMPARISON
1) CDC Data showing 1 death out of every 912 participants in the trial.
2) National Cancer Institute numbers show the death rate for cervical cancer in the US is 1.7 per 100,000.
The direct comparison between these two statistics as applicable to the 100,000 figure, we would have 109 per every 100,000 suffering death from the vaccine as opposed to the 1 death from cancer. That's 109 to 1, or 109 times more likely to die from the vaccine than from the disease.
This is the relative point ... not what you or I want to believe, or choose to believe.
Furthermore, there is real world data suggesting that the danger this vaccine poses is far worse than the propaganda suggests. And this information comes from the VAERS system which is known to account for only 10% or less of the actual adverse reactions to vaccines. Some claim it only reflects about 1% of the cases.
The VAERS system has reported over 18,000 cases of adverse reactions to Gardasil, and 68 deaths. This could be 10 or more times worse, given the lack of reporting. Most adverse reactions are never associated with vaccinations of any type because medical practitioners will rarely associate adverse reactions to any procedure they participated in.
And these numbers are not "all cause" ... these are direct reports of reactions and deaths associated with the administration of the vaccine.
The reality is, HPV vaccine is quickly being recognized as one of the most dangerous vaccines to date, based on real world, direct reports of harm.
First of all, your post is full of personal attacks, you know, violations of the TOS?
Secondly, those deaths reported to VAERS that have been verified showed no causal relationship to the vaccine.
Thirdly, people can and do self-report to VAERS.
Fourthly, you are dealing in fantasy when you say "could be", etc. Can't prove it, don't say it.
Finally, you are playing a game of "How to Lie with Statisitcs" (name of a book, mind you).
Do you think they should re-label the canned seafood aisle the Aisle of Death? Maybe just cordon it off, ya know.... with some yellow tape and skull and crossbones. Perhaps put the cans of tuna in the same racks with the cigarettes? "Must be 18 to purchase." "Use at own risk."
Perhaps have a picture on the can of someone in a horrific death pose and a surgeon general's warning? WARNING:CONTAINS TUNA.
Wow ..... amazing.
So, mercury is not toxic? Is this what you are trying to claim?
Well, given the FDA's history of downplaying health risks when it might negatively impact the profits of commercial business, one ought to take any cautions from them as more serious than presented. And even the FDA recommends no more than two servings of Tuna per week (12 oz) or if it's albacore tuna .. 6 oz.
Oddly, the FDA guidelines for safe mercury levels (1 ppm) is twice that of the EPA who sets the safe level of .5 ppm, so even they can't agree on a safe level, but they do agree that mercury is very much a health risk. But you think it's all a big joke.
Hey, it's all good. Eat as much tuna as you want, preferably albacore ... then take every vaccine you can get your hands on ... and don't forget to drink plenty of fluoridated water .... I believe in freedom of choice always, and overpopulation in some instances.
So, mercury is not toxic? Is this what you are trying to claim?
Well, given the FDA's history of downplaying health risks when it might negatively impact the profits of commercial business, one ought to take any cautions from them as more serious than presented. And even the FDA recommends no more than two servings of Tuna per week (12 oz) or if it's albacore tuna .. 6 oz.
Oddly, the FDA guidelines for safe mercury levels (1 ppm) is twice that of the EPA who sets the safe level of .5 ppm, so even they can't agree on a safe level, but they do agree that mercury is very much a health risk. But you think it's all a big joke.
Hey, it's all good. Eat as much tuna as you want, preferably albacore ... then take every vaccine you can get your hands on ... and don't forget to drink plenty of fluoridated water .... I believe in freedom of choice always, and overpopulation in some instances.
I think it was fairly obvious that he was making a joke as to the case of hyperbole used by the earlier poster in saying that Mercury was one of the most toxic substances known to man. But how is this relevant, there is no Thimerosal therefore no Mercury in Gardasil.
First of all, your post is full of personal attacks, you know, violations of the TOS?
First, you aren't a moderator, and secondly, your post is a personal attack as well as an example of trolling, and hijacking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Secondly, those deaths reported to VAERS that have been verified showed no causal relationship to the vaccine.
You mean ... causality is being uniformly denied ,in spite of the evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Thirdly, people can and do self-report to VAERS.
And lots of good it does, since the system is loath to admit any harm caused by vaccines ... which also explains part of the 90-99% rate of non-reporting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Fourthly, you are dealing in fantasy when you say "could be", etc. Can't prove it, don't say it.
I've posted more links to information than almost anyone else on this thread ... much of the information coming from mainstream sources. What have you posted besides your opinion and personal moderating?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Finally, you are playing a game of "How to Lie with Statisitcs" (name of a book, mind you).
Try this game on for size ....
Quote:
Infections caused by HPV pose no risk to healthy women, and are usually short lived".
Guess who said that? The FDA (2003) ... that's who.
Quote:
"No evidence of vaccine therapeutic affect was observed in analysis"
and
"... it is unlikely that vaccination can have a significant beneficial impact"
and
"vaccination with Gardasil of the women who are already sero-positive has been found to increase the risk of developing pre-cancerous lesions by 44.6%"
Guess who? The journal of American Medical Association (JAMA 2007)
Fourthly, you are dealing in fantasy when you say "could be", etc. Can't prove it, don't say it
Sound familiar?
And yes, my red text quotes are accurate and from the sources stated. You want to refute them ... then do it ... prove it. That of course would take effort ... and why won't you? Because you can't. Because it's the truth .. and that's not something you seem willing to deal with.
How could I possibly prove that ""No evidence of vaccine therapeutic affect was observed in analysis" has anything to do with Gardasil? I have no idea which vaccine is being discussed. Ditto ""... it is unlikely that vaccination can have a significant beneficial impact".
How many eat foods with Campylobacter? Compare that to how much of the population is female upon which the HPV vaccine is being pushed.
You probably have some in you right now (many people have them in their intestinal tract normally), and I bet you had some with portions of your food today (they are one of the most common forms of life). Your immune system usually fights it off when it goes awry, or gets out of where it should be, but doesn't mean that you haven't been exposed just by living.
Any time your immune system fights it there is a possibility of your immune system over reacting and causing GBS. Like many diseases and allergy causing materials. You have a higher possibility of contracting it in a year from the bacteria you have in your system normally then any vaccine (already linked previously), as 60% of GBS cases have no verifiable outside cause.
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There are plenty of people out there that are highly overpaid. 
