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Old 10-07-2011, 11:16 AM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
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When you find the answer to that, you will find the root of all our nations troubles.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:18 AM
 
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Good question!
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:19 AM
 
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When Freedom and Liberty meant less money for the government... that's when...
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:24 AM
 
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when the people figured out they could vote themselves more free stuff. that's when.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:26 AM
 
Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
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neoCons
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvinist View Post
when the people figured out they could vote themselves more free stuff. that's when.
Whose fault is it? Greedy, selfish people or pandering politicians?
IMO, congress is to represent the people. They also have a duty to tell us the truth regarding long term cost of programs.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:29 AM
 
6,486 posts, read 6,179,095 times
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Originally Posted by crone View Post
Whose fault is it? Greedy, selfish people or pandering politicians?
IMO, congress is to represent the people. They also have a duty to tell us the truth regarding long term cost of programs.
Both. It's a vicious downward spiral. How it started, I'm not sure.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:55 AM
 
3,728 posts, read 4,576,865 times
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Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
When you find the answer to that, you will find the root of all our nations troubles.
It happens every generation or two. Throughout history there have always been periods that get more authoritarian than others. You can see it with alcohol, sex, freedom of speech, business, and so on. Nothing lasts forever and eventually this will pass as well.

Unfortunately by the time that happens we will probably be dead of old age. I'm 27 by the way.
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:33 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,922,102 times
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I believe it was Walter E Williams who (among others) has pointed out that historically freedom is a rare anomaly. Master-slave is much more common. Yet as W Bush said "freedom is the deepest need of every human soul."

Liberals such as John Locke and Adam Smith paved the intellectual way for democracy in large part because of the lack of freedom under monarchy. However, now we have far less freedom as Americans than the colonists had under King George.

Perhaps one day, probably far in the future, we'll find a system that affords freedom. If Bush was right, and I think he was, we will never stop reaching for it, and eventually will find it.
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:41 PM
 
13,055 posts, read 12,231,384 times
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Originally Posted by Frank_Carbonni View Post
It happens every generation or two. Throughout history there have always been periods that get more authoritarian than others. You can see it with alcohol, sex, freedom of speech, business, and so on. Nothing lasts forever and eventually this will pass as well.

Unfortunately by the time that happens we will probably be dead of old age. I'm 27 by the way.
Yes, the movements pass, the pressure to continue the demands of the movement subsides, but... All of the garbage they passed, all of the liberties they infringe on with the laws and regulations they get threw is like a gift that keeps on giving. Point is, eventually we are going to run out of liberties for groups to raid.
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