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Originally Posted by Memphis1979 Buying of French land west of the Mississippi without congressional approval
Invasion of states that legally left the union
Suspending of Habeaus corpus
Nationaliztion of the rail roads
Making marijuana, cocaine, and any other substance illegal without amendment to the constitution
The Korean war, the Vietnam war, Providing munitions and helping the British before our involvement in WWII, Iraq1 and II, the invasion of Grenada, etc.
All things that were outside of what the constitution laid forth.
You obviously have no idea of the history of your country. See red all you want, we have interpreted the meaning of the words in the constitution since it was written, period.
A strict adherence to the constitution would not have let us become the nation we are today, period. And people that don't know any different don't help their country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4
No, We invaded the confedercy after they siezed Federal Proporty such as forts, Post offices ect.
2) War is not illegal.
Thank you. When I read Memphis 1979's post (appears above yours here), I just shook my head and decided one cannot deal with a brick wall that has no idea of reality. I am glad to see you answered...hopefully those that are not so foolish will understand and perhaps learn that such garble-de-g*ok twisting of history is not to be taken seriously.
Going back in history to point out areas where the Federal Government overstepped its Constitutional Authority only proves that we, the citizens, should always keep a sharp eye in this area and call the Feds to the table when they screw up and then get rid of all who do defy our Constitution. It doesn't matter whether the infraction took place in the past, currently or comes down the pike in the future...it is our responsibility to "study" history, "learn" from history, "never repeat" history's mistakes and keep ourselves educated and informed about all political levels. PERIOD! If you do not want to, care to or take the time to do this then it is my opinion that you should take it upon yourself to understand you should not vote since you would have no background upon which to make an intelligent decision in the voting booth.
You are correct. I DO love the idea of minimizing "states rights", where the issues are national! One person, one vote should be the rule of law, and yes, the Electoral College should be abolished. That made some sense when communication and information took weeks and months, and many were illiterate. . . .makes no good sense at all now, except to defy the basic principal of a democratic system.
until such time as we change the constitution to make us a democracy rather than a republic, all elections are local elections, including the presidential election. each state determines who they as a state want for president.
Thank you. When I read Memphis 1979's post (appears above yours here), I just shook my head and decided one cannot deal with a brick wall that has no idea of reality. I am glad to see you answered...hopefully those that are not so foolish will understand and perhaps learn that such garble-de-g*ok twisting of history is not to be taken seriously.
Going back in history to point out areas where the Federal Government overstepped its Constitutional Authority only proves that we, the citizens, should always keep a sharp eye in this area and call the Feds to the table when they screw up and then get rid of all who do defy our Constitution. It doesn't matter whether the infraction took place in the past, currently or comes down the pike in the future...it is our responsibility to "study" history, "learn" from history, "never repeat" history's mistakes and keep ourselves educated and informed about all political levels. PERIOD! If you do not want to, care to or take the time to do this then it is my opinion that you should take it upon yourself to understand you should not vote since you would have no background upon which to make an intelligent decision in the voting booth.
What the government overstepping its bounds means that it played a very important role in our history.
And unless you want to erase the last 200 years of US history, we have to keep an interpreted view of the constitution.
You can call me names all you like, but history proves my point, and people that don't know anything that happened before their lifetime aren't exactly in the position to question those who have taken the time to understand the history of their country.
What the government overstepping its bounds means that it played a very important role in our history.
And unless you want to erase the last 200 years of US history, we have to keep an interpreted view of the constitution.
You can call me names all you like, but history proves my point, and people that don't know anything that happened before their lifetime aren't exactly in the position to question those who have taken the time to understand the history of their country.
I only explained positions...didn't call names. As for history...I will match you any day! "Interpretation" is not to be tolerated when addressing our Constitution. That's a lawyer/attorney game that always gets us in trouble when applied in the political arena.
I only explained positions...didn't call names. As for history...I will match you any day! "Interpretation" is not to be tolerated when addressing our Constitution. That's a lawyer/attorney game that always gets us in trouble when applied in the political arena.
You called me a "brick wall".
The issue is, you don't have 200 years of history and precedent on your side, and you don't have an argument.
Again, unless you want to erase 200 years of American history, we need to keep the interpretive view of the constitution. It means that people need to pay attention to what their government is doing, becasue you can't solely rely on the courts to keep them in check, since the courts do the interpeting (has since Madison vs. Marbury, read it, learn it, know it, courts have had that power since 1803.)
when I lived in Calif, my blue vote doesn't really count because it's a given that the state is Blue. In Tex, my blue vote doesn't count because the state is overwhelmingly Red. Every four years, it's always the same swing states whose butts are kissed. It's disgusting to me.
What I don't get about the "we are a Republic not a democracy" thing is that we aren't directly voting on every issue still. That means we are a Democratically elected Republic. As we have been since the constitution was signed.
The voting methods of the representation doesn't change the Democratically elected Republic part of our government.
Guess we should go back to the indirect election of Senators as well?
The United States is not the way it was in the 19th century. We are much more of one country today, then we were then.
The popular vote should be instituted, and the majority of the people in the country should have their voice heard. Most of the time that happens, but every now and then......
I disagree, vehemently.
The election of President is more than just about who gets in the office at the end of the election cycle. Elections are conversations, between those seeking office and those voting. The conversation is what makes a democracy a democracy. It's the input of the citizens to the process, it's the transformation of the candidates during the election. As candidates learn more from their constituents and modify their positions, as citizens learn more about the candidates AND about the issues, and modify who they are willing to vote for. Democracy is in the conversation.
So why is the electoral college important? Because it provides a small incentive to candidates to have part of that all-important conversation in rural areas. Democracies have an inherent flaw. They are designed to ALWAYS give an advantage to URBAN populations. The more URBAN the population, the bigger the advantage. Our Founding Fathers recognized that, which is why we are a Republic, rather than a pure democracy. And they recognized the flaw as well, when they designed the electoral college.
The electoral college ENHANCES a democracy, giving voice to a segment of the population that would be shouted down, not because their input is of less value, but because the voice comes from a segment of the population that is not so dense.
If we get rid of the electoral college, we will have a President that is ALWAYS elected by urban populations, ALWAYS courting urban populations for their votes, ALWAYS considering urban interests before rural interests. For the most part, this is already true, but the fact that we are a Republic, and the fact that we have the electoral college are small incentives that work to keep the system balanced. I don't want LA, Chicago, Atlanta, New York, Philadelphia and Boston to choose for me. I want a voice, and the fact that I live in rural America shouldn't negate that voice.
when I lived in Calif, my blue vote doesn't really count because it's a given that the state is Blue. In Tex, my blue vote doesn't count because the state is overwhelmingly Red. Every four years, it's always the same swing states whose butts are kissed. It's disgusting to me.
Should the Electoral College be Abolished?
no
the electorial college is NEEDED
New York city(the city not the state) has a bigger population than over 10 other states COMBINED
nyc population 8.3 million
wyoming 544k
vermont 621k
n. dakota 640k
alaska 690k
s. dakota 821k
delaware 885k
montana 974k
rhode island 1.01 million
hawaii 1.2 million
maine 1.3 million
total 7.8 million
10 states combined less than the population of NY CITY
repealing the electorial college would take away the say of the smaller rural states
The election of President is more than just about who gets in the office at the end of the election cycle. Elections are conversations, between those seeking office and those voting. The conversation is what makes a democracy a democracy. It's the input of the citizens to the process, it's the transformation of the candidates during the election. As candidates learn more from their constituents and modify their positions, as citizens learn more about the candidates AND about the issues, and modify who they are willing to vote for. Democracy is in the conversation.
So why is the electoral college important? Because it provides a small incentive to candidates to have part of that all-important conversation in rural areas. Democracies have an inherent flaw. They are designed to ALWAYS give an advantage to URBAN populations. The more URBAN the population, the bigger the advantage. Our Founding Fathers recognized that, which is why we are a Republic, rather than a pure democracy. And they recognized the flaw as well, when they designed the electoral college.
The electoral college ENHANCES a democracy, giving voice to a segment of the population that would be shouted down, not because their input is of less value, but because the voice comes from a segment of the population that is not so dense.
If we get rid of the electoral college, we will have a President that is ALWAYS elected by urban populations, ALWAYS courting urban populations for their votes, ALWAYS considering urban interests before rural interests. For the most part, this is already true, but the fact that we are a Republic, and the fact that we have the electoral college are small incentives that work to keep the system balanced. I don't want LA, Chicago, Atlanta, New York, Philadelphia and Boston to choose for me. I want a voice, and the fact that I live in rural America shouldn't negate that voice.
So, what you are saying is that small communities would get "shouted down".
Why shouldn't most of the population get their voices heard. Small states already get equal representation by the two votes they get in the Senate. What you are saying is that small states should have more say in the Presidential, when the President is far more of the whole countries voice, not just the smaller communities and states.
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