Waterboarding isn't torture? Try it (soldiers, crime, cost, dollar)
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There are lines that should not be crossed. Have you ever served in combat? If you have, would you torture prisoners? I know if my Capt had told me or my men to do it I would have arrested him on the spot since he is giving me and my men an illegal order and I would let him deal with the UCMJ. I would also add that nearly all atrocities are carried out by REMFs, front line troops are far too busy killing the enemy and trying to stay alive to commit crimes on others. HONORABLE MEN DO NOT TORTURE PRISONORS.
What about if torturing and gaining information meant the survival of you and your squad?
No one is saying "torture" just for ****s and giggles.
Why would I not harbor negative feelings? However, the issue is not that we defend ourselves or that we retaliate for acts of aggression. The question is whether any of that justifies torturing people?
Perhaps you, personally, have enough moral and ethical leeway to justify torturing convicted terrorists - I can't dictate what side or right and wrong you belong. Even if you do find such practices acceptable, is it justifiable to torture people who may, in fact, be innocent in light of the chance that they might not be and could reveal relevant and reliable information? Remember, waterboarding is used on ALLEGED terrorists, not convicted terrorists.
And is it advisable for any nation as a whole to stoop to such a low level of behavior? Remember, you and I condemn nations that use torture and rape - well, at least I do. If you condemn them for their actions, why do you think it it is okay to behave similarly?
If everyone followed the rules, I agree then that we should not torture the enemy. If we were at war with some other country that did not torture, I would also condemn it. But when we are at war with a group that openly and barbarically broadcast on TV the beheading of men, then I say, youre going to get some hell back. No mercy.
As far as I'm concerned, when youre dealing with a group that has loose or no morals, giving them no consequences for their action is just letting them continue on their own path. Fear is quite a weapon.
They are trying to kill you because you have invaded their country, butt into their domestic affairs and try to force your way of governance on them. Maybe if the U.S. minded its own business, others wouldn't be out there trying to kill you by any means possible.
If it is believed that others are trying to kill you, what is wrong with intelligence determining who and where, and using that to stop it. Torturing someone means you have failed.
I hope you never get in a street fight and some guy grabs a board or pipe and tries to take a swing at you. I can see it now, "Don't do that it isn't fair. It is against the Marquis of Queensberry rules". I'm sure he will put it down.
There are lines that should not be crossed. Have you ever served in combat? If you have, would you torture prisoners? I know if my Capt had told me or my men to do it I would have arrested him on the spot since he is giving me and my men an illegal order and I would let him deal with the UCMJ. I would also add that nearly all atrocities are carried out by REMFs, front line troops are far too busy killing the enemy and trying to stay alive to commit crimes on others. HONORABLE MEN DO NOT TORTURE PRISONORS.
As I stated in another answer, 20 months in Viet Nam.
If I believe an enemy has information that I need to save lives and only have minuets to gain the info he has before it is too late, I will do ANYTHING to gain that info. Honor is only for the living.
If time is not an issue, I will turn him over.
I think it a little strange you use the word "arrest". In the field I never heard that word used. We would "detain" them or "secure" them but, never "arrest" them. Arrest is used by civilian authorities.
Which brings me to the question you asked me, have you ever been in combat?
Incorrect, The Geneva Convention is applicable to ENEMY COMBATANTS,
So? what government did these "Enemy Combatants" perform their military duties for? If they are not associated with a military arm of a foreign government, these people are nothing but murderous thugs, and the geneva convention does not apply.
You really have missed the point entirely. But since you bring it up that you believe them to be criminals, then you must treat them like any other ciminal and arrest and put them on rial, we are not allowed to torture criminals either, since we have international laws we have agreed to also or did you forget that.
As I stated in another answer, 20 months in Viet Nam.
If I believe an enemy has information that I need to save lives and only have minuets to gain the info he has before it is too late, I will do ANYTHING to gain that info. Honor is only for the living.
If time is not an issue, I will turn him over.
I think it a little strange you use the word "arrest". In the field I never heard that word used. We would "detain" them or "secure" them but, never "arrest" them. Arrest is used by civilian authorities.
Which brings me to the question you asked me, have you ever been in combat?
That is your choice, it is the wrong one IMO. Yes sometimes they were turned over and the ARVN's did the deed, they liked large pots, enough to stick a mans upper torso into completely, headfirst and leave them that way for a while, do that for a while and yes they talk and sometimes drowned. The ROKs were even meaner and few ever survided their attentions, great fighters though, their AO's were always Secure.
We are talking about a commanding officer, you relieve them of command and place them under arrest. You detain other people, not military personnel.
Never saw your answer. The answer is yes, I have my CIB with oakleaf, with the 101st both times. Thanks for your service, no one else was thanking our men for their service and sacrifice at the time.
I hope you never get in a street fight and some guy grabs a board or pipe and tries to take a swing at you. I can see it now, "Don't do that it isn't fair. It is against the Marquis of Queensberry rules". I'm sure he will put it down.
I would simply shoot the SOB, I carry, yes, not all gun nuts are righties
Just to show you are a complete a.. with you silly remark, I will answer your childish remark. How does about 20 months in Viet Nam do for you?
Jeeez and thought you were seriously discussing the issue here, with that I now see that you are not. Why do these threads ALWAYS end up going down this path. Said what I had to say on it, done here, movin on
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But since you bring it up that you believe them to be criminals, then you must treat them like any other ciminal and arrest and put them on rial, we are not allowed to torture criminals either, since we have international laws we have agreed to also or did you forget that.
