Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
So, it is a fixed amount, automatically taken by force.
Not something a business would have to be burdened with, with only months of notice.
This is where our US Constitution protects us. Where other nations don't have that option. No other nation has its citizen as leadership.
Nothing stops individual states from implementing a tax to pay for that service, but the States own Constitutions.
Article 1: Section 8
I think you'd have a hard time arguing that something that connected to womens health and the economic welfare of the nation isn't covered by "general welfare".
Interesting, other developed nations don't seem to experience their government as a separate entity from their citizens. For example...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow
So, it is a fixed amount, automatically taken by force.
Other western nations would not see it that way. You get to vote in elections, putting your own peers in charge of taxation, and vote them out if you do not approve. And you can leave the nation if you cannot accept your peers decisions.
So it seems there is no force about it elsewhere. Someone whining about "force" would be chided for not undrestanding that rights come with duties.
The idea has its appeal, no doubt. However, we cannot afford such an entitlement. Nor can the countries that have it, as the daily news reports will attest.
The welfare state's glory days are coming to an end. Better to accept it and adjust. The alternative is truly grim.
I think you'd have a hard time arguing that something that connected to womens health and the economic welfare of the nation isn't covered by "general welfare".
Interesting, other developed nations don't seem to experience their government as a separate entity from their citizens. For example...
Other western nations would not see it that way. You get to vote in elections, putting your own peers in charge of taxation, and vote them out if you do not approve. And you can leave the nation if you cannot accept your peers decisions.
So it seems there is no force about it elsewhere. Someone whining about "force" would be chided for not undrestanding that rights come with duties.
I actually think that the destruction of the family and the government replacing the role of the fathers is more connected to the general welfare of this nation.
No one wants helpless women and children to starve, but all those children have fathers out there. If these women don't want to work and want to be stay-at-home mothers, they need to marry men who will support and take care of them.
The idea has its appeal, no doubt. However, we cannot afford such an entitlement. Nor can the countries that have it, as the daily news reports will attest.
The welfare state's glory days are coming to an end. Better to accept it and adjust. The alternative is truly grim.
I heard that the welfare state was coming to an end as the 70s started with an oil shock. I heard it in the depression of the early 80s. I heard it during the banking crisis of the 90s. And I heard it again as the dot-com bubble burst.
The welfare state has shown considerable longevity in the face of preditictions of its demise.
As for the countries that have it...Norway, Germany, Finland...they do not seem to have any problem affording it. And apparently count it among their economic assets anyway.
Don't forget, the countries in trouble, the UPIGS, are low-welfare nations. The high-welfare ones seem to be as economically strong as the western world comes these days.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute
I actually think that the destruction of the family and the government replacing the role of the fathers is more connected to the general welfare of this nation.
No one wants helpless women and children to starve, but all those children have fathers out there. If these women don't want to work and want to be stay-at-home mothers, they need to marry men who will support and take care of them.
It seems that the mothers going back to work and paying taxes would be better for the nation.
What a lot of people seem to miss in this discussion is that a year off at full or nearly full wages, as it is done in those nations, is an offer that only works for the employed women. There is nothing in it for the unemployed, and you often have to have been working for one or morel years before you are entitled to it.
The idea has its appeal, no doubt. However, we cannot afford such an entitlement. Nor can the countries that have it, as the daily news reports will attest.
The welfare state's glory days are coming to an end. Better to accept it and adjust. The alternative is truly grim.
Yes, the old grasshopper and ant story has evolved into a whole lot of grasshoppers and a very few ants trying to feed them all.
The welfare class is soon to outnumber the working class, and yes single mothers would like to never have to worry about money or work or paying their own bills but that's not the reality we face.
And the liberals have done these people no favor. They've encouraged them to have babies with dead beats who will not contribute to the support of those babies, they enourage them to never learn a work ethic.
If we ever see hard times, these people will be the least able to make it. And they will see their lives of luxury turn difficult fast.
Yes, the old grasshopper and ant story has evolved into a whole lot of grasshoppers and a very few ants trying to feed them all.
The welfare class is soon to outnumber the working class, and yes single mothers would like to never have to worry about money or work or paying their own bills but that's not the reality we face.
And the liberals have done these people no favor. They've encouraged them to have babies with dead beats who will not contribute to the support of those babies, they enourage them to never learn a work ethic.
If we ever see hard times, these people will be the least able to make it. And they will see their lives of luxury turn difficult fast.
So what you are saying is that programs such as this, which breed more ants, are not only neccessary but utterly essential? I mean, the alternative would be to leave breeding to the people who do not have jobs to get in the way, and they'd be much more likly to breed grasshoppers.
Right - Germany has it, which is why employers try very hard to avoid hiring a woman of childbearing age. Some of those German mothers also really milk the system for all they can, including the hospital stay. The attitude is "I'm entitled to it, so I should get it."
So what you are saying is that programs such as this, which breed more ants, are not only neccessary but utterly essential? I mean, the alternative would be to leave breeding to the people who do not have jobs to get in the way, and they'd be much more likly to breed grasshoppers.
The ants work for a living, so no, these programs are about breeding more grasshoppers who expect others to work and provide for them.
There was always a system in place for mothers who want to stay home with their children. It was called marriage to a man who would provide for his family and even help her raise the kids.
And our welfare system is certainly already encouraging non-working types to have children they can never afford. And they NEVER have to worry about going back to work.
No employer is going to want to "hire" women and pay them to stay home and have babies. Who do you expect to pay for these breeders?
Don't forget, the countries in trouble, the UPIGS, are low-welfare nations. The high-welfare ones seem to be as economically strong as the western world comes these days..
Not true at all. For example, both Greece and Italy spend more than Norway as a pct of GDP. The only PIGS on the low end of spending is Ireland.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
