Exclusive: Secret U.S., Taliban talks reach turning point (government, job, war)

[Neuling]

Originally Posted by WestCobb

I agree with you. 9/11 did not come out of nowhere. However, here we are. We owe it to everyone to try to leave Afghanistan in as stable a state as we can though. The reason why it became a safe haven for terrorists in the 90s is because the world pretty much turned its back on this region. Like it or not, we broke this country and we're responsible for trying to stabalize it before we leave.

Nah, the country had been a mess for a long time, remember the Russians...
Nor can the West stabilize a Muslim tribal country. They don't want our system, it's time for us to understand that and leave them alone. Whatever their progress is, it has to come from themselves.

[Crossfire600]

Originally Posted by OhAcid

You're right. It would be better to just go in and blow them all up instead!

You forgot about cutting their heads off with a dull machete.. Silly

[SourD]

Originally Posted by Neuling

I disagree. If the government acts against the will of the people, they are free to do whatever they wish to get rid of the government and to undo their deeds. After all, it's a dictatorship, obviously, and even in the US citizens say they need to be armed so they can take down any potential dictatorship.
The Afghans didn't declare war on anyone. The West went in there against the people's wish. What did they expect? Nobody there likes Americans and Brits etc.

The Afghans let their damn country get taken over by radicals is what happened. Also, the people of a country are NOT free to kill people of another country just because they want to.

[Crossfire600]

Now, to the question. Considering the separate factions of the Taliban I find it hard to believe that a single group can speak for the entire organization. Add this to the fact the the ones we let out of Gitmo went back to killing... Well, I think this is just another puppy dogs and rainbows idea from the current administration. There is no way they are going to go against their religious beliefs and that we are infidels..

SHUT-UP OR I KILL YOU!!! -Achmed the Dead Terrorist

[Dumbdowndemocrats]

They have used this tactic before many times that is how Osama escaped the noose at Tora Bora.This shows how bad things are for the Taliban they are weak as is Al Qaida now is the time to crush them once and for all.

Peace with the Taliban on the condition they will never take up arms against the current Afghan government and they turn over the ONE-EYE Mullah to US. We are in the drivers seat and they know it.

[Neuling]

Originally Posted by SourD

The Afghans let their damn country get taken over by radicals is what happened. Also, the people of a country are NOT free to kill people of another country just because they want to.

They sure are. Would you accept foreigners whom you perceive as enemies to invade your country just because your corrupt government doesn't defend your country?

[Neuling]

People in the West are really naive. Do they really think they can just go somewhere and shoot terrorism to death as if it were some stupid Western movie? Afghanistan has about 30 million people, many of whom are much closer to what the West might consider terrorism than to their own corrupt government.

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by Neuling

Why are foreign troops in Afghanistan again? I forgot

To protect the pipelines that you can never build.

Originally Posted by WestCobb

That's the reason we are there. Do you have some alternative, more cynical reason?

No, but the true reason is to protect the CentGas Pipeline, but that's a moot issue now.

Originally Posted by WestCobb

Had 9/11 never happened we would have never gone into Afghanistan. Now Iraq? We were itching for that fight. Afghanistan is a different story though. Our only real interest there is for the country to be stable enough to not allow guys like Bin Laden to move in and use it as his training ground and launching platform.

Again, read. Study. They're called professional journals, and they deal in foreign policy.

You would have gone into Afghanistan no matter what.

You seem to be totally oblivious to the fact that your beloved hero, Blow Job Bill had been instigating a number of illegal wars in Central Asia in order to gain control of the oil, natural gas and strategic minerals there.

He was successful in overthrowing the governments of Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, et al, but that success was short-lived. He did manage to broker a deal so that the UNOCAL Conglomerate (formerly Chevron, Amoco, BP and UNOCAL) purchase the rights to 75% of the resources in those countries.

To get those resources out poses a problem. There are only 3 possibilities and they are Russia, Iran and Afghanistan (but China for natural gas).

Russia will not sell those resources in US Dollars, and that will be harmful to you, so you can't let the Russians get them, but they have them. Too bad for you. As far as the Chevron Consortium (Chevron bought UNOCAL and Amoco merged with BP) is concerned, they don't care. They get 90+% of the royalties whether it is sold in Dollars, Euros or Rubles. But you do care. It does matter to you if they are sold in Euros or Rubles.

Blow Job Bill engaged the Taliban in talks for the CentGas Pipeline. The Taliban was keen on having a Brasilian-Chinese company build it, while the US obviously wanted Haliburton to build it.

Mullah Omar of the Taliban was brought to the US and wined and dined, and he even visited the White House (but did not talk with Blow Job Bill).

That is all a matter of public record reported in any number of major dailies.

In the mean-time, Enron was sinking $Millions into natural gas processing and refining facilities in Pakistan and India.

Then the CentGas Pipeline deal collapsed. The Taliban went for the Brasilian-Chinese group.

Blow Job Bill then authorized Black Ops in Afghanistan to destabilize the Taliban. You did in fact have "boots on the ground" in Afghanistan on the day prior to 9-11, so going in was relatively easy, since Special Ops had been roaming the Afghan country-side since 1998.

Again, all matter of public record.

One of the first official acts of the US puppet dictator Karzai was to cancel the deal with the Brasilian-Chinese group and give it to Haliburton.

And also in the mean-time, Enron had to start cooking its books to hide its losses on the failed natural gas processing and refining facilities because the CentGas project was stalled.

Enron eventually collapsed.

If you look at the troop deployments, US troops are where? Exactly where the CentGas Pipeline was to run. NATO troops are everywhere but where the pipeline was supposed to be.

That is intentional, not by accident.

At this point, you have failed miserably.

You can't get anyone to underwrite insurance on the project, you cannot secure the area, you cannot pacify the many local tribal groups -- yeah, that's right -- for the morons Afghanistan is a tribal society, not a nation -- and you can't provide security for the project now or in the future to ensure that it is not sabotaged or destroyed.

However, before he was recently elected, Putin just secured a pipeline deal to transport the Chevron Consortium's oil to Norossiysk and Stachi (on the Black Sea).

Too bad for you, because that oil will be sold on the world market in Euros and Rubles, and that will eventually drive down the value of the US Dollar against other currencies, not today, not tomorrow or next week or next month, but several years from now when 5 Million barrels per day are running through those systems.

Congratulations on your failure. Your economic future looks incredibly bleak. Looks like the Sun might be setting on the US Empire very soon.

In the alternative, you could, of course, invade Iran and set up a puppet dictator and then move the oil and natural gas via pipelines, and the strategic minerals via highways and rail-lines to the Persian Gulf and Indian Ocean, where you can guarantee their sale on the world market in US Dollars.

I'd say you have about 5-7 years, and then it will be too late.

[stillkit]

Originally Posted by Had2SaySumthin

I'll say one thing for the man. He didn't negotiate with terrorists.

Huh? Have you never heard of Iran-Contra?

[stillkit]

Originally Posted by WestCobb

That's the reason we are there. Do you have some alternative, more cynical reason? Cynicism passes as intelligence in certain circles, but in this case, it actually leads you off track. We attacked Afghanistan because terrorists from this part of the world attacked us. We continue to be in Afghanistan because we have not yet gotten to the place where if we left tomorrow, we know the terrorists wouldn't regain a stronghold there.

How long are you willing to wait? How long will it take?

Would you be willing to lose YOUR son or daughter there while waiting for something which passes as stability to be achieved?