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Old 12-22-2011, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,053,672 times
Reputation: 3146

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
<shrug> - there is a class of people, however, who seem to get the trappings of the risk-taker without suffering the consequences. Carly Fiorina isn't exactly living under a bridge, despite the fact that HP still exists in spite of her, not thanks to her.
The surgeon still gets paid if the patient dies.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:03 AM
 
82,356 posts, read 39,615,382 times
Reputation: 12110
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
That's an interesting perspective. i guess he doesn't pay interest on credit cards, mortgages, car loans etc. I am equally sure he rejects interest payments on savings and other investments.
That surely must be true. GregW would never pay or receive any interest because it isn't earned.

Is that true, Greg? Do you not pay or receive any interest at all?
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,323,440 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
All this non sense stems from our "participation trophy" mentality. Most folks think they deserve the same compensation as innovators, simply for showing up.
How do you know this? It really just sounds like a straw man argument.

Instead, I think that most people remember the more equal society that existed when they were children -- a society where the rich paid higher taxes yet there didn't seem to be rich people eating out of garbage cans. But those high taxes helped subsidize public schools that made a more educated and productive middle-class.

We now see that eroded.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,323,440 times
Reputation: 5661
A good read is:

Of the 1%, by the 1%, for the 1% | Society | Vanity Fair
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:13 AM
 
44,438 posts, read 23,058,189 times
Reputation: 26961
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
The surgeon still gets paid if the patient dies.
If Carly Fiorina had been a surgeon, she'd be properly bankrupted by mal[ractice suits by now. That analogy doesn't fly.

And hnsq - whose post I responded to - stressed the immense risk that accompanied the higher compensation of people making executive decisions. Fiorina, to take an example, made such ****-poor decisions that the stock rose 7 points the day her departure was announced.

The real consequences of her decisions were borne by those who were employed by HP and who foolishly thought that their executives' decision-making skills were commensurate with their pay. Yet, they were the ones who ended up living in their cars.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:18 AM
 
17,168 posts, read 11,193,622 times
Reputation: 15836
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I have no problem with salary inequality. Some work is just worth more. What I object to is unearned wealth. The real welfare class in this or any other economy are the people with incomes derived from what they own not what they do.
They bought what they own because the did their research. Which is work.

I'm planning on being a member of that "class" someday. I will "own" property for rent, and get my income from that. To say I don't deserve it is WRONG. I'm saving my money, doing my research, scrimping, saving and learning. I'll also be taking a risk, which is also worth something.

How DARE you say just because I choose to earn my money this way, instead of working for the government, say, where I would work much less, I don't deserve it.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,053,672 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
How do you know this? It really just sounds like a straw man argument.

Instead, I think that most people remember the more equal society that existed when they were children -- a society where the rich paid higher taxes yet there didn't seem to be rich people eating out of garbage cans. But those high taxes helped subsidize public schools that made a more educated and productive middle-class.

We now see that eroded.
High taxes were a myth. Reagan lowered the tax rates from 70% to 28% closed loopholes and revenue increased. The higher tax rate ere like Swiss cheese.

Are you suggesting schools are no longer subsidized, or even that we spend less on education, than in the golden days you yearn for? You would be wrong on both counts.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,053,672 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
If Carly Fiorina had been a surgeon, she'd be properly bankrupted by mal[ractice suits by now. That analogy doesn't fly.

And hnsq - whose post I responded to - stressed the immense risk that accompanied the higher compensation of people making executive decisions. Fiorina, to take an example, made such ****-poor decisions that the stock rose 7 points the day her departure was announced.

The real consequences of her decisions were borne by those who were employed by HP and who foolishly thought that their executives' decision-making skills were commensurate with their pay. Yet, they were the ones who ended up living in their cars.
Of course it does. People are compensated for their perceived value. Sometimes those calculations are wrong. Florina did indeed pay a price, she'll never run a fortune 500 company again.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:25 AM
 
4,428 posts, read 4,316,483 times
Reputation: 1356
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
They bought what they own because the did their research. Which is work.

I'm planning on being a member of that "class" someday. I will "own" property for rent, and get my income from that. To say I don't deserve it is WRONG. I'm saving my money, doing my research, scrimping, saving and learning. I'll also be taking a risk, which is also worth something.

How DARE you say just because I choose to earn my money this way, instead of working for the government, say, where I would work much less, I don't deserve it.

AMEN.

Libs don't get it.


Liberals believe in stealing from taxpayers. Stealing is the profession of the Left. That's equality.
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Old 12-22-2011, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,323,440 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
High taxes were a myth. Reagan lowered the tax rates from 70% to 28% closed loopholes and revenue increased. The higher tax rate ere like Swiss cheese.

Are you suggesting schools are no longer subsidized, or even that we spend less on education, than in the golden days you yearn for? You would be wrong on both counts.
How were higher taxes a myth? You just said that they used to be 70%. When Reagan lowered taxes the lowering fell mainly on the wealthy. Then when he "closed loopholes" those loopholes were deductions that the middle class took. One of those was sales tax. In NY, I was able to deduct BOTH my sales taxes and income taxes. That wasn't a "loophole" that was a deliberate effort to shift the burden down.
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