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I'd like to thank the few people to proving a point to me
Basically, to go back to original concept of this thread, I believe that if it's in your job = it's your job. However, I can sympathize for these nurses. I think the nurses should be more inclined to be apart of it WHEN it is to save the mother's life. When it's her choice to kill her baby, well maybe the nurses SHOULD have a say.
The statistic about "x% of abortions performed each year are due to life threatening issues to the mother" doesn't exist because it's probably too low. We can see several individuals who post a blog and we talk about "so-and-so", but what about the other thousands using this "choice" for selfish reasons? But, we aren't allowed to talk about that, right?
perhaps you are conflicted about your views on abortion. you are pro life lite? it's ok to "kill the baby" to save the mothers life but you shouldn't "kill the baby" for any other reason. in what crazy world should a nurse should be able to have a say in the medical choices of other people? if she doesn't like health care she is in the wrong field. does she also get to pick what patients she takes care of like another poster asked? the elderly, the contagious? please these nurses need to buck up and do the job or find another
But what if you were asked to perform them after being hired?
And, as I said before, there's a big difference between a nurse at an abortion clinic or other place where abortion is a primary part of what they do and a nurse at a regular hospital. It's also a very different situation if it's an emergency where an abortion must be performed immediately vs. a situation when it can be scheduled in advance with a nurse who is OK with participating.
I know that hospital very well, and everyone knows that they perform a large number of abortions. They are an inner-city teaching hospital and funded by state money, much of which is allocated to that kind of thing. They are post-op nurses. There is absolutely no way that they can now claim that they didn't know their job would be assisting with abortion patients.
I hope the ACLU pursues this and the case is appealed in a higher court. Those nurses should be fired. If it is part of what is expected of them on the job they should do it or go elsewhere. There are lots of things we do, not liking it, on the job. We are working for someone else, so we do it.
It is not as though the hospital were asking them to do something illegal.
I believe that their lawyers postponed the hearing until they had a favorable judge on the bench. I doubt if the majority of Jersey judges would agree with this ruling.
. . . the hospital had a mission to treat all patients who come in, regardless of whether they share the nurses' views.
I have applied for nursing jobs where I was asked about my feelings about abortion, and told it would be part of my job to assist with same. If ones goes into a job knowing what is in the job description, it seems disingenuous to object after being hired.
What if it wasn't in your job description and they suddenly told you you had to assist in them? Would you object at that point?
I hope when I'm in the hospital I don't offend some nurse's sensibilities with icky things like vomit and bedpans....or blood.... or she hates brunettes or people with wrinkles or atheists....SHE might decide what kind of care I get....
Your statement is ridiculous, you go into nursing knowing you''re likely to deal with body fluids and such, massive difference between that and abortions.
I don't see people raising moral objections to hair color, the slippery slope argument here is silly.
I have applied for nursing jobs where I was asked about my feelings about abortion, and told it would be part of my job to assist with same. If ones goes into a job knowing what is in the job description, it seems disingenuous to object after being hired.
I've been in hospital administration for over 37 years and I can tell you that if you dont want to participate in abortions, then dont apply for a position in the departments that perform this procedure...plain and simple. Almost every single hospital based abortion is done in the operating room or a special procedure area. Apply for a nursing job in ICU, PCU, ER, Radiology, Cath Lab, or any floor and you wont be participating in abortion procedures. Nurses can almost always pick the department they wish to work in. Float pools are usually voluntary where the hospital could ask you to sign up for "float" to another unit in case of staffing shortage....to avoid the O.R; dont sign up for float.
I've been in hospital administration for over 37 years and I can tell you that if you dont want to participate in abortions, then dont apply for a position in the departments that perform this procedure...plain and simple. Almost every single hospital based abortion is done in the operating room or a special procedure area. Apply for a nursing job in ICU, PCU, ER, Radiology, Cath Lab, or any floor and you wont be participating in abortion procedures. Nurses can almost always pick the department they wish to work in. Float pools are usually voluntary where the hospital could ask you to sign up for "float" to another unit in case of staffing shortage....to avoid the O.R; dont sign up for float.
Exactly. Unless you apply for a job in a very religious hospital that will never perform an abortion, then you can't complain when you apply for a job in PACU or post-op and need to work with post-abortion patients. And what if you were in the ER and a patient came in with a post-abortion complication? The hospital was foolish to settle with them. Their settlement should have been "just leave now and we won't give you a horrible letter of recommendation for your next job."
Isn't it interesting how a lot of people will staunchly defend workers' rights and then these exact same people change their tune when it comes to something like this?
For the record, as I've said earlier in this thread, I have somewhat of a moderate view on this - I think it should depend on how common abortion is at the place the nurse is working and whether she knew that she could have to participate in abortions when she took the job, with exceptions made for situations where abortions are required in an emergency. But the hypocrisy can't be denied.
Last edited by afoigrokerkok; 12-23-2011 at 09:58 AM..
Reason: typo
What if it wasn't in your job description and they suddenly told you you had to assist in them? Would you object at that point?
My stock response to that question was that I wouldn't have an abortion myself but I would not judge someone else and I would be willing to help with the procedure. Therefore, I would have no problem with the above scenario. That is me personally. If I were very much opposed to even helping to take care of a pt. who is having an abortion, I'd probably ask for a transfer to a different unit, if I suddenly were asked to participate.
perhaps you are conflicted about your views on abortion. you are pro life lite? it's ok to "kill the baby" to save the mothers life but you shouldn't "kill the baby" for any other reason. in what crazy world should a nurse should be able to have a say in the medical choices of other people? if she doesn't like health care she is in the wrong field. does she also get to pick what patients she takes care of like another poster asked? the elderly, the contagious? please these nurses need to buck up and do the job or find another
Well I'm kinda in between, so maybe pro-life lite is a good word. I personally do not agree that it can be done SOO late (like 6 months!!). I think the "grace period" to have one should be shorter, when it's merely a blob of cell. But when it has eyes, and feet, and toes, a mouth, legs, finders, hands.....this is a person
I am not religious at all, btw. So this issue has nothing to do with my religious beliefs.
With all of that being said, I always do support ANYone having choices. But there's a difference between "Big Mac or Salad" or "Abort baby or not".
BUT with the topic at hand, yeah.. if you work IN the department that does them, well, it is what you sign up for. If it was in a hospital and every nurse had to be on call... then I think that's a separate issue. At least to me.
And Katiana, yes I don't work in the medical field. I don't deny that these things happen to save the life of a mother. All I'm asking is why isn't there a statistic for how often this happens? The reason I ask that is simply because like I said earlier about "the tag line". The "tag line" always comes up in an abortion debate, yet, instead of just accepting that in it's entirety I'd like to know how often this happens. I mean, it's one of THE reasons people use in it's defense, so I just really want to know the frequency of it. Instead, most replies have been just comments about what I said, and not provide me with any true information.
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