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Old 01-12-2012, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,475,124 times
Reputation: 35920

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Me, neither.
What would that matter?

I'd like to know and see where Areo got his stats that 50% of women who have abortions have more than one.
I'm sure he'll be happy to share.

(Since I don't read him, I hope someone will give me a heads up).
It looks like he's right:

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/2006/11/21/or29.pdf
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Old 01-12-2012, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,481 posts, read 10,205,553 times
Reputation: 2536
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
OK. I am pro abortion. WTF is it to you and why should I care. You are pro slavery and not welcome in my world.
Im anti slavery as I am anti choice. You are pro abortion and have not been clear on your slavery issue but i will presume you are anti slavery.
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Old 01-12-2012, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Geneva, IL
12,980 posts, read 14,535,563 times
Reputation: 14862
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
simple language sorry its difficult for you. If you favor the use of abortion you are pro abortion.
Sure, if a woman chose for herself to have an abortion, I guess I'd be pro-abortion in that case. If a woman chose for herself to have the baby, I guess I'd be pro-having-a-baby in that case. If a woman chose for herself to give the baby up for adoption, I guess I'd be pro-adoption in that case.
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Old 01-12-2012, 09:59 AM
 
11,186 posts, read 6,487,434 times
Reputation: 4621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emeraldmaiden View Post
Not at all. There comes a point in pregnancy when the fetus is developed enough to have human rights - right to life being one of those. At that point, there is another person in the equation.
So, in Your opinion, "There comes a point in pregnancy when the fetus is developed enough to have human rights - right to life being one of those. At that point, there is another person in the equation."

What's that point ? 'Viability' ? is that 20 weeks, 22, 24, case-by-case ? Who are you to tell a woman she's not more important in the equation than a fetus ? She's still the one carrying the fetus to term and deciding what to do. What's magic about a particular 'point' in the pregnancy ?

Face it, choicers can be just as inconsistent as lifers. But bear in mind what RW Emerson said--- 'A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...'
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth Texas
12,481 posts, read 10,205,553 times
Reputation: 2536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimbochick View Post
Sure, if a woman chose for herself to have an abortion, I guess I'd be pro-abortion in that case. If a woman chose for herself to have the baby, I guess I'd be pro-having-a-baby in that case. If a woman chose for herself to give the baby up for adoption, I guess I'd be pro-adoption in that case.
being pro abortion does not mean your anti adoption or anti birth it just means you Arin pro abortion
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Geneva, IL
12,980 posts, read 14,535,563 times
Reputation: 14862
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama View Post
So, in Your opinion, "There comes a point in pregnancy when the fetus is developed enough to have human rights - right to life being one of those. At that point, there is another person in the equation."

What's that point ? 'Viability' ? is that 20 weeks, 22, 24, case-by-case ? Who are you to tell a woman she's not more important in the equation than a fetus ? She's still the one carrying the fetus to term and deciding what to do. What's magic about a particular 'point' in the pregnancy ?

Face it, choicers can be just as inconsistent as lifers. But bear in mind what RW Emerson said--- 'A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...'
Most choicers I know are well versed in the peer-reviewed research on viability and fetal development. Their opinions are supported by medical fact, law, and well-reasoned logic. There is no reason to support an all or nothing stance on the rights or viability of the fetus.

In my experience, most of the radical pro-lifers I have encountered lack scientific knowledge of fetal development, and their stance is supported by either their religious views, or a naive belief that all little unwanted babies have adoring families just waiting to give them idyllic homes.

I know many conservative pro-choicers who don't like the idea of an abortion on demand after the first trimester, but don't feel it is their role to dictate the decision a woman should make for herself. I know many progressive pro-lifers who struggle with the reality that if you support abortion in the case of rape, incest, or maternal health, then you are in reality pro-choice.

It is not all or nothing.
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:14 AM
 
6,757 posts, read 8,262,812 times
Reputation: 10152
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama View Post
So, in Your opinion, "There comes a point in pregnancy when the fetus is developed enough to have human rights - right to life being one of those. At that point, there is another person in the equation."

What's that point ? 'Viability' ? is that 20 weeks, 22, 24, case-by-case ? Who are you to tell a woman she's not more important in the equation than a fetus ? She's still the one carrying the fetus to term and deciding what to do. What's magic about a particular 'point' in the pregnancy ?

Face it, choicers can be just as inconsistent as lifers. But bear in mind what RW Emerson said--- 'A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...'
Face it, we don't know for absolute certain when that point is. But the courts have held that there is a line drawn when the fetus attains rights. Human rights, not citizenship rights (until it is born). That point has been consistent since the Roe v. Wade decision; I don't see where there's been any vacillation on the part of pro-choice women's advocates. I also don't see a "foolish consistency" in pro-choice majority position, but a sensible consistency.
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Texas
14,975 posts, read 16,428,898 times
Reputation: 4586
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimbochick View Post
Most choicers I know are well versed in the peer-reviewed research on viability and fetal development. Their opinions are supported by medical fact, law, and well-reasoned logic. There is no reason to support and all or nothing stance on the rights or viability of the fetus.

In my experience, most of the radical pro-lifers I have encountered lack scientific knowledge of fetal development, and their stance is supported by either their religious views, or a naive belief that all little unwanted babies have adoring families just waiting to give them idyllic homes.

I know many conservative pro-choicers who don't like the idea of an abortion on demand after the first trimester, but don't feel it is their role to dictate the decision a woman should make for herself. I know many progressive pro-lifers who struggle with the reality that if you support abortion in the case of rape, incest, or maternal health, then you are in reality pro-choice.

It is not all or nothing.
Abortion

These polls show that most "pro-choicers" and "pro-lifers" are not really at either extreme.

On the second page, it's broken down by trimester.

Regardless of all the rhetoric and bickering, I don't think most "pro-choicers" and "pro-lifers" have literally opposite views.

Last edited by afoigrokerkok; 01-12-2012 at 10:28 AM..
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:27 AM
 
2,226 posts, read 2,099,861 times
Reputation: 903
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrea3821 View Post
It's not a guilt trip. I'm so over the "back alley" and "coat hanger" discussions, do you really honestly think that would happen? I am of the opinion that life is life and it should not be killed no matter what, but that is not a part of this discussion.

YES, YES YES, we think this could happen. This DID HAPPEN, over and over and over again. Most often to poor women.....of course. The middle class or richer white girls got their abortions under the table by their own personal physician that were paid cash to get those teenagers free from their unwanted pregnancy before the neighbors saw it. The rest were sent to "homes" and returned after a supposed visit to their aunts house for a few months.
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Old 01-12-2012, 10:30 AM
 
2,226 posts, read 2,099,861 times
Reputation: 903
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
If you are in favor of abortion you are pro abortion.
If it walk like a duck, quacks like a duck has feathers like a duck... its duck

WHATever.........duck, goose or bluebird. I am in favor of my uterus being none of your business. Legally.
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