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Old 01-25-2012, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,749,461 times
Reputation: 12341

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
So you believe individuals can't cooperate without the force of government?
Gotcha.
How anti-marxist of me.
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Old 01-25-2012, 11:40 AM
 
29,409 posts, read 21,946,920 times
Reputation: 5455
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterboy7375 View Post
So does this electricity just magicly appear, or is it produced by burning fossil fuels?
These folks will all get in a room and drag their feet across carpets to get the trains running if that's what it takes to get their dream of HSR to emulate their big bro communist china to the US.
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Old 01-25-2012, 11:43 AM
 
3,393 posts, read 4,001,172 times
Reputation: 9310
High Speed Rail: Bringing you the technology of the 19th Century...today!!
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Old 01-25-2012, 11:46 AM
 
4,255 posts, read 3,471,155 times
Reputation: 992
Publice transit, yes you too can pay for someone elses ride to work.
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Old 01-25-2012, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
700 posts, read 636,176 times
Reputation: 786
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterboy7375 View Post
Publice transit, yes you too can pay for someone elses ride to work.
...as opposed to the roads being utilized by drivers which are built by space aliens free of charge.

Quote:
These folks will all get in a room and drag their feet across carpets to get the trains running if that's what it takes to get their dream of HSR to emulate their big bro communist china to the US.
Why do you keep mentioning China? HSR exist in France, Germany, Spain, Taiwan, Japan, South Korea, Belgium, Italy, and the U.K. as well.

HSR is under construction or in development in Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Qatar, Morocco, Russia, Poland, Portugal, South Africa, India, Argentina and Brazil.

Quote:
Imagine the first wreck rolling along at 200MPH. The same government who touted building these things because of the "speed" will step in and regulate all trains will now travel at 65 mph to reduce the risk of crashes and of course all passengers forced to wear a seatbelt and the insanity will march right on.
They haven't done so for plane crashes or crashes involving existing trains. Why would the government do so for HSR?
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Old 01-25-2012, 12:52 PM
 
Location: US Empire, Pac NW
5,003 posts, read 12,330,032 times
Reputation: 4125
Despite the comments of those who would argue that HSR and more mass-transit initiatives are bad ideas, there's one thing business leaders all over agree on ...

THE LACK OF INFRASTRUCTURE MOBILITY IN LARGE US CITIES IS KILLING THEIR COMPETITIVENESS.

Think about it ... higher highway congestion leads to lost time ... lost time means less productivity ... less productivity means less output, and thus less profit.

Add in woefully slow (due to security,mostly) air transit and you get the current situation. If I wanted to go from LA to San Fran, I'd have to drive for 8 hours (15 if there's traffic or the tourist season). Or I'd fly and take about as long once you factored in parking, security delays, delays at the terminal, and the repeat task flying back. Ugh.

If the TGV or other HSR was to actually be invested, the cost would be pennies once it got up and running (people forget rail is high upfront cost, low cost maintenance). Further I could get to San Fran at a fraction of the time. Further, GE or some other big company will surely get it, and it would invest in thousands of highly paid, quality engineering jobs in the US.

CA desperately needs HSR for the big cities to continue competing. The NE corridor desperately needs an updated version of the laughingstock of a "high speed rail" line that currently exists there. Other regions of the US are dubious as to whether it's really needed.
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Old 01-25-2012, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Purgatory
2,615 posts, read 5,385,062 times
Reputation: 3099
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterboy7375 View Post
Publice transit, yes you too can pay for someone elses ride to work.
How do you think roads are paid for?

You made another comment about how trains also use energy too...they use a LOT less energy than planes or the seating equivalent of the combined number of motor vehicles. Electric trains are the cleanest and most efficient form of transit. Once the tracks have been laid and the rolling stock is up & running, it'll be just as sustainable as air travel and much could be taken over by the private sector, with the exception of maintenance & safety checks.
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Old 01-25-2012, 01:08 PM
 
3,393 posts, read 4,001,172 times
Reputation: 9310
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskercurve View Post
Despite the comments of those who would argue that HSR and more mass-transit initiatives are bad ideas, there's one thing business leaders all over agree on ...

THE LACK OF INFRASTRUCTURE MOBILITY IN LARGE US CITIES IS KILLING THEIR COMPETITIVENESS.

Think about it ... higher highway congestion leads to lost time ... lost time means less productivity ... less productivity means less output, and thus less profit.

Add in woefully slow (due to security,mostly) air transit and you get the current situation. If I wanted to go from LA to San Fran, I'd have to drive for 8 hours (15 if there's traffic or the tourist season). Or I'd fly and take about as long once you factored in parking, security delays, delays at the terminal, and the repeat task flying back. Ugh.

If the TGV or other HSR was to actually be invested, the cost would be pennies once it got up and running (people forget rail is high upfront cost, low cost maintenance). Further I could get to San Fran at a fraction of the time. Further, GE or some other big company will surely get it, and it would invest in thousands of highly paid, quality engineering jobs in the US.

CA desperately needs HSR for the big cities to continue competing. The NE corridor desperately needs an updated version of the laughingstock of a "high speed rail" line that currently exists there. Other regions of the US are dubious as to whether it's really needed.
I hear a lot of people cite the traffic as a reason. Well, there is a lot of traffic in the metro areas of cities like San Jose and Los Angeles, but not so much on the freeways connecting these cities.

Face it, the reason people use HSR in Europe is because their gas prices are jacked up so high, much higher than here in the US. So, it is more feasible to use. I'm sure before too long the CA lawmakers that get kickbacks from the corps benefitting from HSR will get the idea to jack the price of CA gas in order to justify this debacle.

So glad I don't live there anymore.
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Old 01-25-2012, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Purgatory
2,615 posts, read 5,385,062 times
Reputation: 3099
Anyway...it's clearly a lost cause trying to debate high speed rail with people who think it's a form of communism. Feel free to stay in the 1960's...the rest of us realise that oil is going to run out at some point and that the current methods of getting from A to B in America are unsustainable and are bad for the environment.
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Old 01-25-2012, 01:16 PM
 
Location: Purgatory
2,615 posts, read 5,385,062 times
Reputation: 3099
Quote:
Originally Posted by Book Lover 21 View Post
I hear a lot of people cite the traffic as a reason. Well, there is a lot of traffic in the metro areas of cities like San Jose and Los Angeles, but not so much on the freeways connecting these cities.

Face it, the reason people use HSR in Europe is because their gas prices are jacked up so high, much higher than here in the US. So, it is more feasible to use. I'm sure before too long the CA lawmakers that get kickbacks from the corps benefitting from HSR will get the idea to jack the price of CA gas in order to justify this debacle.

So glad I don't live there anymore.
You seem to think that America's love affair with the car is sustainable. Unless you break oil dependency, it's not. Higher gas prices are inevitable and while many Americans will be screwed, Europeans will be far more prepared for that eventuality.

Our cars are generally smaller anyway and we use more diesel. Unless you're in construction or have a large family, huge cars are a pointless waste of space and stil cost a small fortune when they break, tyres for instance.

You can either bury your heads in the and be these "*********, I'm gonna drive my 5mpg Hummer and not be like those commie Europeons" or you can accept reality.

Your call.
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