Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Nope, much of their "business: is hospital services, not church servies. They, not their churches, employ all demoninations and serve all demoninations. Their churches do not do that. They are business owners.
If health care is going to continue down the route of employer sponsored, and the nation aims to ensure that each citizen has affordable access to a set level of standard care, then the laws will have to be put in place in order to protect citizens (employees) from employers who, through either greed or personal convictions, would seek to shaft the employee of a fair standard of living and/or healthcare based on personal/religious convictions or for monetary gain. That is why we have ha labor laws in place for years. I'm sure no one wanted them back in the day.
Are you ready for a Jehovah's Witness owned business to say: Hey here is your health insurance package that is part of your compensation. It will cover you for anything except for catastrophic blood loss. If you need a transfusion, that will not be offered to you, even with a co-pay, because we think they are horribly wrong and don't want to put any of our sacred money towards a medical procedure with think is against God.
Or: You working for a company owned by a Scientologist who says that he won't allow Prozac to be bought for under his prescription plan because mental illness does not exist and treating it is against his religion.
You're not a member of these churches nor are your a church employee there where all the like minded people work. YOu could be working at a carpet store or an auto repair shop.
If you're okay with this, then fine. I get that. But then you would also be against government interfering in any businesses operation on health care and probably don't want a standard of care for everyone in the country. That's neither right or wrong, it's just a different veiwpoint.
No one is dictating that the Paish of Divine Saints pay for contraception for it's workers, who will be all Catholic. No one is tellling little churches what they must do. They are telling employers who employ the masses. As it is, they did get their exemption.
But you are still okay with the state dictating medical procudures.
At best you are being very hypocritical.
At worst, you don't even see your lack of logic here.
The catholic hospitals are part of the catholic diocese.
The hypocrisy is for the left to say its ok for government to interfere with with religion but not ok for individuals
Catholic leaders upped the ante Monday, threatening to challenge the Obama administration over a provision of the new health care law that would require all employers, including religious institutions, to pay for birth control.
The catholic hospitals are part of the catholic diocese.
The hypocrisy is for the left to say its ok for government to interfere with with religion but not ok for individuals
Catholic leaders upped the ante Monday, threatening to challenge the Obama administration over a provision of the new health care law that would require all employers, including religious institutions, to pay for birth control.
Big government is trying to tell catholic churches what it can and can not do in providing insurance to employees.
Juts as state government is trying to tell abortion seekers what they need to do to get an abortion.
I have not misrepresented anything so do not Say I have
If "Community General Hospital" has to offer birth control in the health insurance for the employees, "Catholic Charity Hospital" does too. That is only fair.
The secretary and the janitor and the priest at the Catholic church do not have to be offered birth control in their health insurance because the government does not regulate the internal operations of churches.
The synagogue also is exempt to the requirement to offer birth control in the health insurance plans for the rabbi or any other employees.
If the synagogue decides to open "Jewish Hospital," the hospital employees will be able to get birth control, just like any other hospital employee.
Any church that is opposed to these hospital regulations are welcome to divest of the businesses they own and concentrate on the religious missions of their churches.
The government is NOT trying to tell churches what they have to do.
If "Community General Hospital" has to offer birth control in the health insurance for the employees, "Catholic Charity Hospital" does too. That is only fair.
The secretary and the janitor and the priest at the Catholic church do not have to be offered birth control in their health insurance because the government does not regulate the internal operations of churches.
The synagogue also is exempt to the requirement to offer birth control in the health insurance plans for the rabbi or any other employees.
If the synagogue decides to open "Jewish Hospital," the hospital employees will be able to get birth control, just like any other hospital employee.
Any church that is opposed to these hospital regulations are welcome to divest of the businesses they own and concentrate on the religious missions of their churches.
The government is NOT trying to tell churches what they have to do.
Yet wtjet still refuses to see that he is spreading misinformation. I really believe that he/she does but not going to admit so whatever.
Now people in Virgina can sleep well knowing every abortion is a wanted abortion.
It already was. Now we will get to see how much money the state government of Virginia is willing to spend fighting this out in the Federal court system.
BTW, my opinion is that the government should pay for the ultrasounds since they are not medically necessary, but are simply being required to satisfy the religious opinions of some of the lobbyists' clients.
If "Community General Hospital" has to offer birth control in the health insurance for the employees, "Catholic Charity Hospital" does too. That is only fair.
The secretary and the janitor and the priest at the Catholic church do not have to be offered birth control in their health insurance because the government does not regulate the internal operations of churches.
The synagogue also is exempt to the requirement to offer birth control in the health insurance plans for the rabbi or any other employees.
If the synagogue decides to open "Jewish Hospital," the hospital employees will be able to get birth control, just like any other hospital employee.
Any church that is opposed to these hospital regulations are welcome to divest of the businesses they own and concentrate on the religious missions of their churches.
The government is NOT trying to tell churches what they have to do.
Two points, any employer has the right to have what ever package of benifits they choose to offer. if you do not like the benifir package dont acceprt the job.
The government can not tell a church , no matter what branch of that church what they have to do. A hospital run by the catholic church is still under the umbrella of the catholic diocese and therefore re a part of the church.
Of course this will end up in court for better legal minds then myself.
I certainly hope the government can not direct a church what health insurance the church has to offer. Of course the churches out is to drop health insurance for employees which hurts all of its employees.
I suspect this is a liberal left move to try to control religion. which seems to me is the opposite of what liberals say they want .
Yet wtjet still refuses to see that he is spreading misinformation. I really believe that he/she does but not going to admit so whatever.
Yes, he/she is still spreading misinformation. The Catholic Church can do whatever it wants behind the church doors (except for that little boy thing).
Two points, any employer has the right to have what ever package of benifits they choose to offer. if you do not like the benifir package dont acceprt the job.
The government can not tell a church , no matter what branch of that church what they have to do. A hospital run by the catholic church is still under the umbrella of the catholic diocese and therefore re a part of the church.
Of course this will end up in court for better legal minds then myself.
I certainly hope the government can not direct a church what health insurance the church has to offer. Of course the churches out is to drop health insurance for employees which hurts all of its employees.
I suspect this is a liberal left move to try to control religion. which seems to me is the opposite of what liberals say they want .
But maybe the best argument on behalf of the Obama administration’s position comes from a very unlikely source, as Jay Bookman points out: Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia. In two different decisions, the conservative Catholic Scalia has sided with the court majority in finding that religious teachings can’t justify religious employers – or employees — failing to comply with labor law. In the 1990 Employment Division v. Smith decision, regarding an employer’s ability to fire a Native American employee who used peyote, despite the employee’s claim that using the drug was a religious rite, Scalia wrote:
Quote:
“We have never held that an individual’s religious beliefs excuse him from compliance with an otherwise valid law prohibiting conduct that the State is free to regulate. On the contrary, the record of more than a century of our free exercise jurisprudence contradicts that proposition.” In an even more directly relevant 1982 decision holding that Amish employers must comply with Social Security and withholding taxes, though their faith bars participation in government support programs, Scalia wrote:
Quote:
Respondents urge us to hold, quite simply, that when otherwise prohibitable conduct is accompanied by religious convictions, not only the convictions but the conduct itself must be free from governmental regulation. We have never held that, and decline to do so now.
I do not see private insurance as a government program. I company even a church has the right to put any benefit plan together they want to offer to their employees. So no company is forced to offer a benefit if they wish to offer it. Health insurance is a benefit provided by employers. So your saying you think the governemnt has the right to tell them what they have to offer.
Currently the benefits where i am do not pay for contraception does the government have the right to tell my employer they have to offer it?
If so what law is behind that right?
A Catholic health service is part of the catholic diocese just as catholic schools are. The government can not tell a catholic school what they have to offer for benefits or what they can charge for tuition.
so there are two points , the governemnt can not tell any business what benefits they have to offer, and they certainly can not regulate any part of the Catholic diocese.
I do not see private insurance as a government program. I company even a church has the right to put any benefit plan together they want to offer to their employees. So no company is forced to offer a benefit if they wish to offer it. Health insurance is a benefit provided by employers. So your saying you think the governemnt has the right to tell them what they have to offer.
Currently the benefits where i am do not pay for contraception does the government have the right to tell my employer they have to offer it?
If so what law is behind that right?
A Catholic health service is part of the catholic diocese just as catholic schools are. The government can not tell a catholic school what they have to offer for benefits or what they can charge for tuition.
so there are two points , the governemnt can not tell any business what benefits they have to offer, and they certainly can not regulate any part of the Catholic diocese.
The courts will decide
The government has a right to regulate insurance.
A business owned by the Catholic Diocese is not a religious organization and therefore has not the status of a religious organization. It's a business and as such must comply with the law of the land.
But the Obama regulation further insulates these organizations. The regulation states that the insurance company must reach out to the insured and offer contraceptive plans to those employees that are not part of the organization's plan. Since the organization is not involved, they cannot claim it violates any religious belief.
The reason the Churches still object is because the Churches really do want to regulate behavior outside their believers.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
