Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
"The "wipe Israel off the map" thing has been discredited repeatedly...
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That's absolutely correct.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
Leftist will always side with some 3rd world nut jobs every time "Khomeni", "Castro", "Ortega", "Mao", "Ortega". I'll take Israel as an Ally any day over those guys.
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If the US treated Israel the way it treated Iran, Cuba, Nicaragua and China, I can assure you that Israel would not be an ally.
I'm an ultra-conservative, and I side with Khomeini, because it is the moral and ethical thing to do. The Shah told you he intended to abdicate because he had pancreatic cancer. The Shah told you that Khomeini would be the best leader of Iran, and you agreed with that. You were conducting secret negotiations with Khomeini's people concerning the transition of power from the Shah to Khomeini.
Okay, so the French DGSE find out what you and the Brits are up to, and they leak the fact that the Shah is abdicating at meeting of high ranking ayatollahs at a mosque in Tabriz. The cat's out of the bag; the damage is done; deal with it.
An intelligent person would have foreseen the possibility of the DGSE finding out, especially since Khomeini was in Paris. It ain't like the French are so blind they couldn't see a constant flurry of activity between Khomeini, Khomeini's people, the Brits, the US and the British and US missions in France, and elsewhere in the Middle East (especially communications routed to France via Lebanon).
The smart thing to do was to move forward as planned. Instead, two idiots, namely Gary Sick and Zbigniew Brzezinski, talked Carter into having the Iranian military stage a coup and take over. Carter sent General Hugyens to do exactly that.
So you stab Khomeini in the back and then you expect him to kiss your ass?
What kind of fantasy FUBAR world do you live in?
You get a "F" for Moral and Ethical failure here, not Khomeini. Khomeini lived up to his side of the deal....You did not....you reneged (as usual).
And Castro? I take the moral and ethical high ground and side with Castro as well.
You pressured Batista to grant clemency to those who fire-bombed an army barracks, and among that group was Castro. You invited Castro to US Embassy Mission Mexico City. You recruited Castro to overthrow Batista. You put CIA Agent Frank Sturgis in charge of that operation. You delivered the weapons, munitions, supplies and food to exactly the places Frank Sturgis told you to deliver them for Castro's army. You hailed Castro's defeat of Batista. You brought Castro to the US and gave him the grand hero's welcome and tour.
And then you stabbed Castro in the back.
Apparently your ignorance of the facts bars you from understanding that under international law, US public laws, and Cuban law, Castro had both the right and the authority to expropriate US corporate assets for non-payment of taxes owed.
Which part of "
Your property and assets get seized if you don't pay taxes" do you not understand? It's a simple straight-forward concept. If you would like to test it, then don't pay taxes to the IRS or to your State and see how long it takes them to freeze your credit cards, seize your bank accounts and attach liens to all of your property then move to foreclose on it for non-payment of taxes.
In the case of National Sugar and Chiquita (United Fruit), not only did they refuse to pay taxes owed, they also defied a court order to increase the pay of workers from $0.30 for a 10 hour day to $0.90 for a 10 hour day on par with the wages National Sugar and Chiquita paid field workers in Honduras, Nicaragua and Guatemala.
Your cause against Cuba is not morally, ethically or legally justified.
You fail.
Same story with Ortega, and in fact, all of the heads-of-State of Nicaragua, Honduras and Guatemala who were murdered by the US in cold-blood. Your cause against Ortega was unjust, because he had a legal right to seize Chiquita's holdings for non-payment of taxes.
I spent 90 days tromping through the Honduran jungles with a bunch of suits threatening and terrorizing villagers to vote for the US puppet, due to the fear that US corporate assets would be seized for non-payment of taxes (and criminal acts).
And 2 1/2 years ago, Obama illegally overthrew the Honduran government. that was the 14th time in 100 years and why? So US corporations can operate with impunity.
You're very naive about your world and your government.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
They would still be messed up, it's the 3rd world and is still controlled by small tribes.
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Iran is not controlled by small tribes, and if you hadn't imprisoned, tortured and murdered Iranian "dissenters" and interfered in their economic, political and social development, they would be much better off today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
1) Israel has never threatened to wipe Iran off the map unless it was retalitory.
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Immaterial and irrelevant.
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Originally Posted by LS Jaun
2) Iran continuously has threatened to wipe Israel off the map...
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No, they have not.
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Originally Posted by LS Jaun
... denies the holocaust...
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Define "holocaust."
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Originally Posted by LS Jaun
... were Nazi sympathizers...
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Immaterial and irrelevant, especially since the US put those Nazi sympathizers in power. You ignorance is truly appalling. The US told the Shah to select Fazlollah Zahedi to replace Prime Minister Mossedeq.
Zahedi was a general in the Iranian army and a Nazi collaborator during WW II.
I seriously doubt you are aware that the legendary Fitzroy MacLean (a British intelligence officer) kidnapped Zahedi during WW II and the British imprisoned Zahedi to keep him from further collaboration wth the Nazis.
Would you like some more facts?
Anyway, under International Law, Iranian Law, British Law and US Law in effect at the time, Iran had a legal right to nationalize the oil industry.
Manfred Halpern's
Middle East and North Africa
or
Wilber's
Iran: Past and Present. Note that Wilber was a Princeton professor of history, and also a CIA agent. In fact, Wilber claimed to have helped plan the assassination of Mossadegh.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
... and will go to war against their neighbors...
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Not likely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun
.3) Fundamentalist Muslim controlled Iran is doing everything they can to antagonize Israel ...
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Assuming for a moment that is true, why would they?
I understand that you aren't the sharpest tool in the shed, but even a 10-year old has the common sense to see and understand that each and every single time Iran has announced an oil bourse, the US has screamed, "Nukes!" and Israel has threatened to attack.
The latest series of challenges here is due to the Kish Island Exchange where oil and natural gas will not be sold exclusively in US Dollars.
Now, if that causes harm to your economy, then the moral and ethical thing to do is to alter your life-style and standard of living so that you can deal with a US Dollar that has a lesser value on the world currency exchange, or take action to improve and strengthen your own economy.
Attacking Iran is not a moral or ethical thing (or even legal) option.
Adopting the morally superior position...
Mircea
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kkaos2
But I do know they are anti-America...
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But you neither know why nor do you understand why?
When you're drug out of your home in the middle of the night and tortured for criticizing government policies, then maybe you will finally start to understand.
Questioning...
Mircea
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