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There are lots of unanswered questions, I agree. And I don't say that the shooting was self defense. But given the short distance involved (about 300 feet) between the start of Zimmerman's call and the shootingt, and that there was a 15 minute time frame involved(based on the CNN article you provided), and that given that Martin had a head start...how is it possible that he could not have made it the 300 feet to his house in that timeframe? That's the kicker for me, and why I believe that Zimmerman must have stopped at some point for several minutes. And that Martin did not retreate to his house if he felt threatened.
According to the 911 calls, Martin and Zimmerman argued for several minutes before a physical altercation occurred. Then, the two wrestled for
a brief time before the fatal shot. That would explain the time discrepancy. The back entrances have white partitions outside the back doors; I've wondered if perhaps Trayvon hid behind one briefly, hoping that Zimmerman would go away.
Fair question. Zimmerman reported himself in that position (E on the map) while on the phone to police, about 3 minutes into his 911 call. Why would he lie at that point, knowing the police could be there litterally any second? He was right next to a main street. We heard him stop running and talking with dispatcher in a non-winded voice, after he followed the direction "we don't need you to do that". He was either standing or walking slowly at this point, based the call. The shooting took place between this point and his vehicle (actually just slightly off the straight line track) and was ~10 minutes later, and only 30 feet or so from point E. 30 feet...10 minutes. He clearly wasn't going anywhere fast. Consistent with his story that he was waiting for police then started walking to his rig. Further, he stopped at point E about 1:20 before the end of the phone call. Over one minute while on the phone, and only about 200 feet from Martin's door. We know from the call that Zimmerman was not confronting M during that time. How is it possible that M couldn't make it the 200 feet home in that time, let alone the next 10 or so minutes?
Clearly Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon, because rather than give an address and wait for LE, he told the dispatcher to have the police contact him when they arrived so he could tell them where he was. That would have been unnecessary if he'd remained at the vehicle or was walking back to it. As for the time discrepancy, see above. Now I truly have to go to bed; it's 4 a.m. and I need to be up in just a few hours.
I appreciate your civil and relevant posts; I'll be back, as Arnold said!
Thing is that John was on the phone to 911 and said that night in a report who was where and so forth.
The site went down while I was posting before. I wanted to clarify what I meant about lying to the police. I never said anyone lied. I only said that we don't know how many people came forward and spoke to the police with their different accounts.
I listened to all the 911 calls and don't remember hearing anyone talking about a man in a red jacket or sweater being on the bottom. We can't go back and forth like this for a year so, as I've said many times, we can only wait to hear the evidence. If you saw the Anthony trial on TV, you also saw a woman who claimed she had an affair with George Anthony. He said it was a lie. So people make a lot of claims and others deny that they're true.
My main reason for responding to tiluha was that she seemed to imply that Angela Cory is ignoring critical eyewitness statements and I find that very hard to believe.
I just read your last hateful post about a victim with no police record. Your remarks about his name are too silly to even waste time on and I shouldn't have answered you. By the way, nothing you said about Trayvon Martin, even if true, would be admissible. However, if the defense even hints about Trayvon's school suspension or any past acts and is allowed to present them to the jury, then he's be opening the door for the prosecution to have a field day with Zimmerman's felony arrests and domestic abuse charges, so it would be very stupid. None of this is going to happen.
Last edited by justNancy; 04-14-2012 at 03:09 AM..
Reason: I just read this poster's earlier comment.
No need to be cryptic...give me your theory...because that's all we got here, just our theories and speculation....
Why doesn't it make sense?
That GZ was the one who was screaming?
That GZ had that gun displayed?
That they were fighting for control over that gun?
GZ was the one screaming according to the closest witness before the shot.
GZ had a gun on a belt, not a concealed weapon, so he had to be displayed at his side.
There could have been a fight lastly for the gun, but that happened while George was on his back screaming according to witnesses.
Clearly Zimmerman continued to follow Trayvon, because rather than give an address and wait for LE, he told the dispatcher to have the police contact him when they arrived so he could tell them where he was. That would have been unnecessary if he'd remained at the vehicle or was walking back to it. As for the time discrepancy, see above. Now I truly have to go to bed; it's 4 a.m. and I need to be up in just a few hours.
I appreciate your civil and relevant posts; I'll be back, as Arnold said!
Have a good night! I'm also enjoying this part of the discussion.
The site went down while I was posting before. I wanted to clarify what I meant about lying to the police. I never said anyone lied. I only said that we don't know how many people came forward and spoke to the police with their different accounts.
I listened to all the 911 calls and don't remember hearing anyone talking about a man in a red jacket or sweater being on the bottom. We can't go back and forth like this for a year so, as I've said many times, we can only wait to hear the evidence. If you saw the Anthony trial on TV, you also saw a woman who claimed she had an affair with George Anthony. He said it was a lie. So people make a lot of claims and others deny that they're true. It is very hard to prove what someone thinks he saw.
My main reason for responding to tiluha was that she seemed to imply that Angela Cory is ignoring critical eyewitness statements and I find that very hard to believe.
JOHN was the witness who reported this to 911 as the fight was happening off his porch.
He reported George was screaming.
He reported he told Trayvon to stop hitting George.
He was there before the shot went off.
Most all witnesses showed up after it was over and after the gun went off and they have nothing to offer about what happened.
Trayvon was into vandalizing, there was a burglary tool in his bag that caused his most recent suspension along with drugs.
There is also a post from his cousin to Trayvon where paraphrased it said, "You really hit the bus driver".
I think the defense is going to find the bus driver that got hit IMO.
You are leaving out that it was Zimmerman on the bottom with Trayvon on top beating him when the scream and so forth was going on.
It is reported the witness John screamed at Trayvon to stop assaulting George, there was no stand up gun play that you speak of and the evidence of the grass stains and cuts on Zimmerman don't match your story. There were witnesses, the ones prior to the shot are the important ones.
Trayvon's mother made like her son was an angel, she didn't mention three suspensions, gold teeth, drugs, jewelry or a burglary tool to anyone. That had to be discovered.
I think there could be a record out there and being Martin is dead and his character is an issue, any such record would be opened for this trial.
Lastly, why does anyone name their son after vons and an ashe tray?
If you read my posts, you would know that I am well aware that GZ was on the bottom and I did not say that there was a "stand up" gun play, I believe the struggle for control over the gun was on the ground...
Reading the rest of your post only clarifies to me that you make a habit of skipping over most of what you read...
Have a good night! I'm also enjoying this part of the discussion.
George on the 911 call said he was in back of the complex, that there were no numbers there to give an address for. He at that time said Trayvon ran off.
He then went back to the truck and somehow ended under Trayvon assaulting him.
There is no known history of George going after people with guns. He did have a history of tutoring black kids and helping the black community over others wrongly hurt. He was a Democrat community organizer it seems.
The site went down while I was posting before. I wanted to clarify what I meant about lying to the police. I never said anyone lied. I only said that we don't know how many people came forward and spoke to the police with their different accounts.
I listened to all the 911 calls and don't remember hearing anyone talking about a man in a red jacket or sweater being on the bottom. We can't go back and forth like this for a year so, as I've said many times, we can only wait to hear the evidence. If you saw the Anthony trial on TV, you also saw a woman who claimed she had an affair with George Anthony. He said it was a lie. So people make a lot of claims and others deny that they're true.
My main reason for responding to tiluha was that she seemed to imply that Angela Cory is ignoring critical eyewitness statements and I find that very hard to believe.
I just read your last post and I'm sorry I wasted my time answering you.
Just had to clarify to you...no where in my post did I imply that Angela Corey is ignoring critical eyewitness statements...
What I did say is that her speech smacked of Political Pandering and Proselytizing...
If you read my posts, you would know that I am well aware that GZ was on the bottom and I did not say that there was a "stand up" gun play, I believe the struggle for control over the gun was on the ground...
Reading the rest of your post only clarifies to me that you make a habit of skipping over most of what you read...
Not really, when someone is on top of you, you can't put your arm out to display a gun well or to even shoot easily. You put an arm out like that while standing. That is why I said what I did.
I do know George's dad reported that George's statement was that Martin said he would kill him and then went for the gun.
That all happened as you said on the ground. I don't dispute this was on the ground.
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