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Old 05-15-2012, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
Do you disagree that many premises in the theory of quantum physics are contradictory?
First I need to know, to avoid flip-flopping, which of the following Harriers am I dealing with? This...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
Can you "prove" the theory of quantum physics?
Or, this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
I have no argument with the theory of quantum physics?
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:35 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,396 posts, read 9,442,882 times
Reputation: 4070
Quote:
Originally Posted by DentalFloss View Post
No, it doesn't.

However, the mountain of evidence that subatomic particles do not physically exist unless and until we measure them does.

Unless you have an alternative explanation for how one particle can exist in two different places simultaneously?

This is a good read for those interested in quantum mechanics w/o pursuing a PhD in physics.

Amazon.com: Quantum: A Guide for the Perplexed (9781841882383): Dr. Jim Al-Khalili: Books
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:38 AM
 
2,677 posts, read 2,616,938 times
Reputation: 1491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
it is still a massively speculative and controversial area of thought with little or no actual support for it.
That may very well be, but so was the idea that the earth was round instead of flat. The simulation theory fits the data better than the objective reality theory. It's just that reality being objective is the default position, thus is not even questioned by most observers.
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,008,825 times
Reputation: 6128
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
First I need to know, to avoid flip-flopping, which of the following Harriers am I dealing with? This...

Or, this?
We are discussing a fundamentally contradictory scientific theory aren't we? What is the problem?
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:41 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 6,374,746 times
Reputation: 2988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
There is also no evidence that the theory of evolution is valid.
That is not true, there is a wealth of evidence, argument, data and reasons to support this. If you start a thread on Evolution Theory I am more than happy to present said evidences and discuss them at length with you.

However that said your statement is so broad and general as to be meaningless. It would be like saying "There is no evidence for Chemistry". Evolution is a vast area of science and you would need to be more specific about what you actually want evidence for. However we can discuss that when you start your thread on Evolution Evidence so we can discuss it.

The problem is that when I make the same request of the religious I do not get the same offer back. They do not present the evidence or discuss it with me because there seemingly IS no evidence to discuss. They just deflect, as you are, into topic changes to things like evolution. Anything rather than discuss their own evidence for their own claims.

This is an obvious deflection trick. It goes like follows:

1) Make a claim X
2) Present no evidence for that claim X.
3) If asked for evidence for X change the subject to Y and moan about how no evidence is being provided for Y.

Again... there either is evidence for a god.... or there is not. Simple as that. If there is... then present it. If there is not, then stop pretending there is and deflecting.
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
We are discussing a fundamentally contradictory scientific theory aren't we? What is the problem?
The flip flopping:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
Can you "prove" the theory of quantum physics?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
I have no argument with the theory of quantum physics?
Settle which one is you, and off we go!
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:43 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 6,374,746 times
Reputation: 2988
Quote:
Originally Posted by DentalFloss View Post
That may very well be, but so was the idea that the earth was round instead of flat.
So what? Just because X was once speculative and was later vindicated does not mean Y also will be. This is what is called "Begging the Question".

I can hardly even believe I have to explain that to someone who pretends to have an interest in Science. This comment from you is an insult to both of our intelligence. Thankfully yours more than mine.
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:46 AM
 
2,677 posts, read 2,616,938 times
Reputation: 1491
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
And if that is your basis for an argument, what kind of proof do you present for your beliefs? Or, we should take them seriously because they are... beliefs?
The double slit experiment holds the keys to the universe.

If we don't look, matter exists in 2 places at once.

If we look, but destroy the knowledge, it still exists in 2 places at once.

If we look and retain the knowledge, it collapses to only one place.

"Render on demand" is the only theory that I am aware of that explains that behavior. And something being rendered, by definition, means it's being simulated.

Other data points:
Quantum Tunneling (probabilistic rendering)
Planck Time (frame rate)
Planck Length (pixel size)
Speed of light (frame rate * pixel size)
Propagation of waves without a medium
Quantum Entanglement
Identical nature of subatomic particles. (Every electron in the universe is EXACTLY like every other one. No variation whatsoever.)

And more I'm probably failing to think of at this time...
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,008,825 times
Reputation: 6128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
That is not true, there is a wealth of evidence, argument, data and reasons to support this. If you start a thread on Evolution Theory I am more than happy to present said evidences and discuss them at length with you.

However that said your statement is so broad and general as to be meaningless. It would be like saying "There is no evidence for Chemistry". Evolution is a vast area of science and you would need to be more specific about what you actually want evidence for. However we can discuss that when you start your thread on Evolution Evidence so we can discuss it.

The problem is that when I make the same request of the religious I do not get the same offer back. They do not present the evidence or discuss it with me because there seemingly IS no evidence to discuss. They just deflect, as you are, into topic changes to things like evolution. Anything rather than discuss their own evidence for their own claims.

This is an obvious deflection trick. It goes like follows:

1) Make a claim X
2) Present no evidence for that claim X.
3) If asked for evidence for X change the subject to Y and moan about how no evidence is being provided for Y.

Again... there either is evidence for a god.... or there is not. Simple as that. If there is... then present it. If there is not, then stop pretending there is and deflecting.
I didn't start this thread - but feel free to chime in.
//www.city-data.com/forum/polit...lassrooms.html
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Old 05-15-2012, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,818,277 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by DentalFloss View Post
The double slit experiment holds the keys to the universe.

If we don't look, matter exists in 2 places at once.

If we look, but destroy the knowledge, it still exists in 2 places at once.

If we look and retain the knowledge, it collapses to only one place.

"Render on demand" is the only theory that I am aware of that explains that behavior. And something being rendered, by definition, means it's being simulated.

Other data points:
Quantum Tunneling (probabilistic rendering)
Planck Time (frame rate)
Planck Length (pixel size)
Speed of light (frame rate * pixel size)
Propagation of waves without a medium
Quantum Entanglement
Identical nature of subatomic particles. (Every electron in the universe is EXACTLY like every other one. No variation whatsoever.)

And more I'm probably failing to think of at this time...
Why are there multiple conclusions drawn on Double Slit Experiment? Could there be one that is valid?
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