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Old 04-28-2012, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,650 posts, read 26,453,494 times
Reputation: 12662

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
It actually is a "brainer."

Businesses hire employees when the need employees to perform work that they need done -- not because the government lowered their taxes. Right now, businesses are sitting on 203 trillion dollars in savings. What makes you think that lowering their taxes, giving them more money, will suddenly make them invest?

===========================
On the meme that government doesn't create jobs: Government spending is part of GDP and government workers have jobs. Government pays teachers, firemen, policemen, etc., are every bit employed as are privately employed lap-dancers.

Moreover, when government invests in projects, it contracts with companies that hire other employees.

Because of the economic downturn. local governments have been reducing employees. Private job growth is way up and the total numbers are depressed by government reductions.
















OK, you started out fine...

"Businesses hire employees when the need employees to perform work that they need done -- not because the government lowered their taxes."

Then you stopped following your own logical thought process.

Continuing with this train of thought, what would cause businesses to need more work done?

Encourage the expantion of business operations performed in the US by making doing business in the US cost competitive with other nations.

The way to do that is to reduce the tax rate on profits earned from these operations to a rate at least as low as what is common in Europe (20-25%).
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:57 AM
 
9,848 posts, read 8,300,680 times
Reputation: 3296
You have some turd making executive orders, but the House has been very busy passing bills to undue the socialism of THE ONE and they are shot down by Bella Legosi Reid and Obama.

Senate under Reid is down as the least productive in at least recent history.

President is a disaster, now worse than even Carter with his misery index.

So I think if the country is fortunate you get a trifecta of Republicans and hopefully enough non DC types within force fiscal responsibility on Washington.

The best thing in general government can do for people is to step out of their way. We were never meant to be answerable to government, the government was to be answerable to the people and in the last few decades that has been happening less and less.

Three is a need to tax our ass off because the government has become this giant bloated hand out machine that never had enough money coming in.
In Europe we see the cancer of similar socialism to what we had within and we see all the measures where there HAVE HAD TO BE DRASTIC CUTS because of the wimpy nature of politicians to never address tough issues. We've been kicked down the road and off a cliff by mostly Democrats, Government Union employee debts and a great society boondoggle.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,987,397 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
OK, you started out fine...

"Businesses hire employees when the need employees to perform work that they need done -- not because the government lowered their taxes."

Then you stopped following your own logical thought process.

Continuing with this train of thought, what would cause businesses to need more work done?

Expanding operations performed in the US by making them profitable and cost competitive with other nations.

The way to do that is to reduce the tax rate on profits earned from these operations to a rate at least as low as what is common in Europe (20-25%).
There are several errors with that line-of-thought. The first is that the vast majority of goods and services from the U.S. are sold in the U.S. So, foreign competition is overstated in your example. When we need houses built, we don't have much competition with foreign homebuilders or foreign labor. When we need roads built, it's 100% American labor.

Second, your theme is supported by the assumption that American business taxes are high compared to foreign nations. The truth is that the U.S. has high statutory rates than other countries, which virtually no company actually pays. Because of tax-credits, deductions and loopholes, American companies pay among the lowest actual taxes. This is evident when we look at the amount of taxes as a p% of GDP corporations pay.

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Old 04-28-2012, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Va. Beach
6,391 posts, read 5,179,131 times
Reputation: 2283
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
And I covered what those bills are in post #8. None of those bills had anything to do with jobs.
Interesting, 27 bills awaiting senate review, you covered a few, and only what YOU thought they were about, I note there is no link to the bill you are talking about in each line item so we can see and review.

Sorry, post # 8 is useless, it has no substance, no good information, thank you for playing.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,987,397 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by RCCCB View Post
...
In Europe we see the cancer of similar socialism to what we had within and we see all the measures where there HAVE HAD TO BE DRASTIC CUTS because of the wimpy nature of politicians to never address tough issues. We've been kicked down the road and off a cliff by mostly Democrats, Government Union employee debts and a great society boondoggle.
I'm going to ignore the first part of your post because it's just a rant.

The second part is interesting because it underscores the fallacious belief that socialist policies are the cause of Europe's problems. But what to we observe? Do we observe the very socialist Scandinavian countries in distress? No. Sweden and Denmark, are doing quite well and Spain, which caused severe market jitters this week, was running budget surpluses prior to the crisis.

Dean Baker wrote a very good column killing this welfare state meme: Robert Samuelson Misuses the Euro Crisis to Advance His War on the Welfare State
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:27 AM
 
Location: Chandler, AZ
5,800 posts, read 6,582,787 times
Reputation: 3151
Government can create business friendly conditions that will enhance the creation of good paying jobs in this country, something that Democrats have been clueless about for decades.

Reid & Obama should be ashamed of themselves, and the President in particular; he has not intention of simplifying the tax code, since most if not all of his proposals have included tax credit and tax increases, which isa downright moronic.

But then he's a lawyer and not an economist, so what would anybody expect from his party?

They can whine all they want about outsourcing, but until they show signs of being really serious about alleviating the conditions in this country which make it essentially mandatory, the unemployment rate will remain in the double digits, and not the thoroughly cooked 8.2% number they preposterously expect us to believe.

Aside from the reinvigorated automobile industry, most of the rest of our economy is on a respirator.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:27 AM
 
9,848 posts, read 8,300,680 times
Reputation: 3296
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
I'm going to ignore the first part of your post because it's just a rant.

The second part is interesting because it underscores the fallacious belief that socialist policies are the cause of Europe's problems. But what to we observe? Do we observe the very socialist Scandinavian countries in distress? No. Sweden and Denmark, are doing quite well and Spain, which caused severe market jitters this week, was running budget surpluses prior to the crisis.

Dean Baker wrote a very good column killing this welfare state meme: Robert Samuelson Misuses the Euro Crisis to Advance His War on the Welfare State
Socialism is crap and can't sustain anything.
If you take a lot of the income from people who are productive and give it to those who are not, then over time you shrink productive people and grow the people with their hands out.

You are talking a leftist myth regarding socialist Scandinavian countries.
The Myth of Scandinavian Socialism - The Mises Community

Socialists and communists have always been about the propoganda though.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:34 AM
 
9,848 posts, read 8,300,680 times
Reputation: 3296
Default Government needs to stay out of the way of the people

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marv101 View Post
Government can create business friendly conditions that will enhance the creation of good paying jobs in this country, something that Democrats have been clueless about for decades.

Reid & Obama should be ashamed of themselves, and the President in particular; he has not intention of simplifying the tax code, since most if not all of his proposals have included tax credit and tax increases, which isa downright moronic.

But then he's a lawyer and not an economist, so what would anybody expect from his party?
Government can only prevent monopolies, kill and break things (military) and then they start to screw everything else up or they take $100 to distribute $7. Remeber the $5000 hammer and the $15,000 toilets?

Government is supposed to be answerable to all of us, instead mostly Democrats have bloated it like a 750 pound fat man and made us far more answerable to government instead.

We are being sunk by the cancer of socialism within.
Why work hard and make money if it is mostly confiscated and given to those who won't work.
We can handle the elderly and disabled, but the rest need to get a great society buzz cut.

Government works best for the people by STAYING OUT OF THE WAY OF PEOPLE.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:44 AM
 
3,852 posts, read 4,532,290 times
Reputation: 4516
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Continuing with this train of thought, what would cause businesses to need more work done?
Demand for their product or service. That's why businesses expand, not tax cuts.
Quote:
Encourage the expantion of business operations performed in the US by making doing business in the US cost competitive with other nations.
Those jobs aren't coming back until we pay Americans the same as the Chinese.
Quote:
The way to do that is to reduce the tax rate on profits earned from these operations to a rate at least as low as what is common in Europe (20-25%).
Since we're modeling things on Europe now, can we have their personal income tax rates too?

Didn't think so.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:44 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,987,397 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marv101 View Post
Government can create business friendly conditions that will enhance the creation of good paying jobs in this country, something that Democrats have been clueless about for decades.

Reid & Obama should be ashamed of themselves, and the President in particular; he has not intention of simplifying the tax code, since most if not all of his proposals have included tax credit and tax increases, which isa downright moronic.

But then he's a lawyer and not an economist, so what would anybody expect from his party?

They can whine all they want about outsourcing, but until they show signs of being really serious about alleviating the conditions in this country which make it essentially mandatory, the unemployment rate will remain in the double digits, and not the thoroughly cooked 8.2% number they preposterously expect us to believe.

Aside from the reinvigorated automobile industry, most of the rest of our economy is on a respirator.
While you bemoan that, 'Reid & Obama should be ashamed of themselves, ...[for not] simplifying the tax code," we've been living under the same tax codes since 2004, and I an sure you never complained about the unsimple tax-rates before January 20, 2009.

Moreover, the idea that civil servants "cooked" the unemployment rate for Obama is tin-foil hat material. But we know, when the right is faced with inconvenient numbers they must cry fowl and throw a bunch of bogus numbers at the issues, in the hope that something sticks.

The real story is that the BLS estimates unemployment based on a monthly survey; this tells us what fraction of workers are unemployed. To turn that into a number of unemployed, the BLS estimates total working-age population; but it updates those estimates only once a year. Period.
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