Another Disappointing Jobs Report: +115,000 (Participation Rate Lowest in 30 years) (premium, insurance, state government)
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Austerity means reduce spending. Your implication is that by reducing spending you will reduce debt.
I've been trying to explain to the dense-sculled that's precisely what does not work in a liquidity trap. Cutting spending increases joblessness, which reduces demand and reduces government revenue and increases social spending. Thus, it neither improves the economy nor helps reach your debt reduction target.
It was never a spending issue, it is a revenue issue.
Not if you cut spending that doesn't effect the US economy..like the $1 billion we give to Egypt each year to maintain an army.
There's plenty of fat in government spending that can be cut that has no affect on American jobs.
Foreign aid is a rounding error in the federal budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475
LOL,
Increase debt to get debt in control. Apparently the fact that there's no more money left and you're leveraged to the hilt with [u]all[u] of your welfare programs is something quite hard for the liberal mind to comprehend.
If one is carless and unemployed but finds a new job that requires a long commute by car, if makes sense to go further into debt by buying a car and then having income to payoff the car.
That's pretty much what this is. There are millions who could be paying taxes but aren't because demand is so low, that gov't spending would cure.
Moreover, these aren't new concepts. Every freshman eco major knows this and every Republican president has accepted these economic principles as facts.
Every freshman eco major knows this and every Republican president has accepted these economic principles as facts.
You need to travel back in space-time and go ask your professor one question.
Quote:
What's the consumerist U.S. economy going to be like when it's getting pressure from all sides via lower SS payments, higher interest rates to reign in inflation, a bankrupt Medicare system that's had taxes raised substantially just to keep it barely drowning, higher taxes to try and lower outrageous uncontrollable deficits, 15+ states approaching bankruptcy (because of lost revenue due to all of the above) and a debt to GDP ratio approaching 120% while having a Baa credit rating?
What's the consumerist U.S. economy going to be like when it's getting pressure from all sides via lower SS payments, higher interest rates to reign in inflation, a bankrupt Medicare system that's had taxes raised substantially just to keep it barely drowning, higher taxes to try and lower outrageous uncontrollable deficits, 15+ states approaching bankruptcy (because of lost revenue due to all of the above) and a debt to GDP ratio approaching 120% while having a Baa credit rating?
I'd rather worry about the high unemployment and lowered tax revenue that we have now than the possibility that at some time in the future we might have inflation. Moreover, deficits drop when we have fewer unemployed.
As for "a bankrupt Medicare system," Medicare faces the same constraints as private heath insurance, drastic increases in medical care. So if we will have a bankrupt Medicare system we'd better worry about a bankrupt private insurance system too.
Lower SS payments are due to fewer people working, which is addressed by the plans I endorse.
I'd rather worry about the high unemployment and lowered tax revenue that we have now than the possibility that at some time in the future we might have inflation. Moreover, deficits drop when we have fewer unemployed.
As for "a bankrupt Medicare system," Medicare faces the same constraints as private heath insurance, drastic increases in medical care. So if we will have a bankrupt Medicare system we'd better worry about a bankrupt private insurance system too.
Lower SS payments are due to fewer people working, which is addressed by the plans I endorse.
You fail to understand that every single one of those items listed in "The Question" takes money out of the consumerist economy at exactly the same time it will be most needed.
Your idea is to not only do all of those but make those forced changes even more dramatic which is exactly why I pointed out the supernova example.
You fail to understand that every single one of those items listed in "The Question" takes money out of the consumerist economy at exactly the same time it will be most needed.
Your idea is to not only do all of those but make those forced changes even more dramatic which is exactly why I pointed out the supernova example.
Yeah that was awesome - I saw that on the History Channel!!
You fail to understand that every single one of those items listed in "The Question" takes money out of the consumerist economy at exactly the same time it will be most needed.
Your idea is to not only do all of those but make those forced changes even more dramatic which is exactly why I pointed out the supernova example.
What's important is to raise GDP, which is below capacity. Government spending and transfer payments raise GDP -- government spending does because government buying stuff employes people who make that stuff (e.g. the private economy) who then spend it in your "consumerist economy." Transfer payments put money in the pockets of people likely to spend it who have the highest economic multipliers.
The notion that the government is somehow crowding out money in an economy lacking demand is false on the most elementary levels.
Understand this. A supernova is a spectacular event in the stars. In its wake it leaves a blackhole whereas nothing can escape it.
That's not a desirable plan for an economy which is exactly what leveraging your economy to the hilt with debt in a consumer based economy will do.
US Debt is almost $16 TRILLION and WORLD GDP is $70 TRILLION or about 22% of World GDP. The CBO is projecting a $21 TRILLION Debt by 2022.
World GDP is averaging 4.73% since 2000, and US Debt 9.19% over the same period, meaning at that rate, US Debt will be 1/3 of the World's GDP by 2022. Just can't see anyone with money to buy US Debt. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Treasury is using surrogates to buy its own debt back.
You fail to understand that every single one of those items listed in "The Question" takes money out of the consumerist economy at exactly the same time it will be most needed.
That is pretty much exactly how it will unfold.
Understanding...
Mircea
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech
I'd rather worry about the high unemployment and lowered tax revenue that we have now than the possibility that at some time in the future we might have inflation.
Might have inflation? You will have Real Inflation and we ain't talking about 10% like in the 1970s. This will be an average annual rate of 35%-45%. That means a gallon of gasoline that was $3.50 will be $4.90 and then the next year it will be $6.61 and the year after that $9.59 per gallon.
Your $130/month electric bill will be $188/month, and then the year after, $254/month, and the year after that, $356/month.
Sure, you wages/salaries will increase, but not nearly as fast as Real Inflation. Maybe 15%-25% per year, but that's of little comfort when you're losing your shirt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech
As for "a bankrupt Medicare system," Medicare faces the same constraints as private heath insurance,...
Uh, wut? It does not. Your private "health insurance" is funded by employees, employers and investors. Medicare is funded by employee and employer taxes.
The Medicare actuaries called for an immediate 17% cut or an immediate tax increase to 3.7% to fund Medicare. Congress did neither, so Medicare has been harmed that much further.
When Medicare collapses, and that will be sometime between 2016 and 2018, you'll have to pull money out of the budget to fund Medicare. That kind of spending does not benefit the economy.
Medicare is nothing like the Apollo Program or even the nuclear weapons programs. You don't get anything out of Medicare. What did you get out of the nuclear weapons programs? CDs, CD players, DVDs, DVD players, BluRay, and a host of other things. What you got out of Apollo is too much to list. What do you get out of Medicare? Nothing.
You cannot use Health Care to make your car go, or heat your home; you cannot eat Heath Care; you cannot wrap you body in Health Care to look good or stay warm or go swimming; you cannot fish, sail or water-ski with Health Care; you cannot build anything with Health Care; you cannot use Health Care to transport something from Point A to Point B; Health Care does not provide replacement parts for anything; you cannot export Health Care to the rest of the world.
You're just going to have to accept the fact that you aren't in Kansas anymore.
Surrender Dorothy....
What's important is to raise GDP, which is below capacity. Government spending and transfer payments raise GDP -- government spending does because government buying stuff employes people who make that stuff (e.g. the private economy) who then spend it in your "consumerist economy." Transfer payments put money in the pockets of people likely to spend it who have the highest economic multipliers.
The notion that the government is somehow crowding out money in an economy lacking demand is false on the most elementary levels.
Our government just spent $5 trillion in economic multipliers, in three years, so we must be golden then, eh?
We can have out government buy $100 billion in green energy crap, which ends up flushed down a rat hole, and it does not make us a wealthy nation, it just make Obama's cronies wealthy.
Last edited by Wapasha; 05-12-2012 at 09:22 PM..
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