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Location: Georgia, on the Florida line, right above Tallahassee
10,471 posts, read 15,833,234 times
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Originally Posted by NCN
I am wondering where you are from not to know there is a difference between being a "natural born citizen" and being just a citizen. That and the age of the person trying for the office are not the only things necessary to qualify for the presidency. The president must be loyal to our country only. It is very complicated.
Before Obama was on the ballot the first time I went searching for answers to this and other questions that I found online and on the news. Everybody was talking about it and so I decided to find out for myself. I found a newspaper article from what was said to be a Kenyan newspaper claiming that a man born in Kenyan had just been elected to office in Illinois. There was the story of his grandmother saying she was present at his birth in Kenya that was later disclaimed. Seems there was a language problem that caused that misunderstanding. Then there was a story about the passport he had used on a trip to some foreign country. And the question of why his college records had been sealed?
There were accounts of how easy it was for anybody to get a certificate of birth from Hawaii. So then the question narrowed down to exactly where he was born. I never found out for sure. It was amazing to me that someone who had not been born in Kenya had so many sources saying he was. Even his own book advertised it was written by a man from Kenya. We have now been told his own person got that wrong.
The only official reference to anyone in America checking on this that I found believable was from Arizona about last week and almost three and a half years after he was sworn into office. They said they got papers from Hawaii stating he had been born there.
Until I started this search, I did not realize how lax our government is about the qualifications of a person seeking the office of President of the United States of America. You would think there would have to be information on file in D.C. before anyone could even be placed on the ballot.
This whole experience has left me just shaking my head. One of the most powerful positions in the world and the American people are not allowed to question it even in a court of law. Only congress can address the issue and for some reason they did not choose to do so. !@#$%^&*()
They questioned it. Ad nauseum. Then they got slapped on the forehead with a copy of the long form. So in essence, they had a real one the first time.. .and a real one the second time...and now they're demanding a real third one... or something.
Again Arus, show me where Wong Kim Ark was affirmed specifically a 'natural born Citizen' by the court.
This shows why birthers do not understand our legal system. Why do you think it went up to SCOTUS?
Who cares what the lower courts stated. the SCOTUS ruling is the ruling authority:
Here is what SCOTUS stated in the majority opinion:
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It thus clearly appears that, by the law of England for the last three centuries, beginning before the settlement of this country and continuing to the present day, aliens, while residing in the dominions possessed by the Crown of England, were within the allegiance, the obedience, the faith or loyalty, the protection, the power, the jurisdiction of the English Sovereign, and therefore every child born in England of alien parents was a natural-born subject unless the child of an ambassador or other diplomatic agent of a foreign State or of an alien enemy in hostile occupation of the place where the child was born.
III. The same rule was in force in all the English Colonies upon this continent down to the time of the Declaration of Independence, and in the United States afterwards, and continued to prevail under the Constitution as originally established.
this was part of the discussion on where and when Natural Born was defined in America; that we based much of our laws on the mother country legal system: English Common Law.
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Show me in the Title 8 Code the specific words 'natural born Citizen'. Thank you.
No law defines Natural born, but we have already a RULING that says what Natural born means (whether a subject or citizen)., Even Thomas Jefferson wrote Subject in the Declaration of Independence draft, before replacing it with citizen (and the only reason was to distinguish the colonial inhabitants as separate from those born on the crown of Englan). That's why SCOTUS is TASKED with the job of INTERPRETING and ENFORCING the US Constitution. I mean, its In their freaking job description
and you again fail to understand our system as well as how our laws work. The Constitution specifically TASKED Congress with the creation of our nationality law. Read Title 8. It specifically lists the type of citizens that are recognized in the US
ETA: And while we are at it, Please show us in ANY law, or in ANY part of our US COnstitution where it says that the President must have two citizen parents to be considered a Natural Born. Please cite actual cases that cited this law.
I am wondering where you are from not to know there is a difference between being a "natural born citizen" and being just a citizen. That and the age of the person trying for the office are not the only things necessary to qualify for the presidency. The president must be loyal to our country only. It is very complicated.
Before Obama was on the ballot the first time I went searching for answers to this and other questions that I found online and on the news. Everybody was talking about it and so I decided to find out for myself. I found a newspaper article from what was said to be a Kenyan newspaper claiming that a man born in Kenyan had just been elected to office in Illinois. There was the story of his grandmother saying she was present at his birth in Kenya that was later disclaimed. Seems there was a language problem that caused that misunderstanding. Then there was a story about the passport he had used on a trip to some foreign country. And the question of why his college records had been sealed?
There were accounts of how easy it was for anybody to get a certificate of birth from Hawaii. So then the question narrowed down to exactly where he was born. I never found out for sure. It was amazing to me that someone who had not been born in Kenya had so many sources saying he was. Even his own book advertised it was written by a man from Kenya. We have now been told his own person got that wrong.
The only official reference to anyone in America checking on this that I found believable was from Arizona about last week and almost three and a half years after he was sworn into office. They said they got papers from Hawaii stating he had been born there.
Until I started this search, I did not realize how lax our government is about the qualifications of a person seeking the office of President of the United States of America. You would think there would have to be information on file in D.C. before anyone could even be placed on the ballot.
This whole experience has left me just shaking my head. One of the most powerful positions in the world and the American people are not allowed to question it even in a court of law. Only congress can address the issue and for some reason they did not choose to do so. !@#$%^&*()
You bet we are "allowed to."
It's just that we are faced with a barrage of desperate folks which are using Psychopolitics of ridicule, and this is because it works. It is used to make the average citizen embarassed to associate with and think like the group that is receiving the ridicule.
They did it to Palin, To Glenn Beck and to Birthers.
WHY?!
Because these three group or presences are the most powerful. They potentially can defeat the peculiar one easier than anyone else. Oh, Tea partiers, same thing.
I call it "Saturday Night Liv'ing" someone or some group.
They target their biggest opponents. It's all they've got.
BO has a "Fight the Smears" campaign where he has his supporters contacting his campaign about where the opposition is and what they are saying.
I found a newspaper article from what was said to be a Kenyan newspaper claiming that a man born in Kenyan had just been elected to office in Illinois.
the sunday standard. they ran a correction the very next issue back in 2004.
And the question of why his college records had been sealed?
they haven't been "sealed". they are private records that are protected under the same laws that protect yours and mine.
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There were accounts of how easy it was for anybody to get a certificate of birth from Hawaii.
what account exactly? to date not a single fraudulent birth certificate has been produced or cited ( with the exception of one that occurred nearly 50 years before hawaii became a state ) .
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So then the question narrowed down to exactly where he was born.
hawaii.
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The only official reference to anyone in America checking on this that I found believable was from Arizona about last week and almost three and a half years after he was sworn into office. They said they got papers from Hawaii stating he had been born there.
and ken bennett has accepted this as fact.
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One of the most powerful positions in the world and the American people are not allowed to question it even in a court of law.
there have been multiple court hearings on the birther claims. the georgia ballot challenge being the most notorious.
Last edited by wrecking ball; 05-30-2012 at 11:27 PM..
No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.
I don't see anything in there about both parents
You are quite correct. The issue is not about Obama's parents; it's about where he was born. If he was born in Kenya, he isn't eligible for the office of president. It is not unreasonable to question his place of birth. Obama defenders treat any hint of doubt over his place of birth as akin to denying the Holocaust. There are legitimate questions that need answering.
they haven't been "sealed". they are private records that are protected under the same laws that protect yours and mine.
Given the intense level of interest, they should be made public to satisfy the skeptics. Otherwise, the questioning continues unabated. November is just ahead. Obama needs to defuse this issue, if he can...
If he was born in Kenya, he isn't eligible for the office of president. It is not unreasonable to question his place of birth.
as i've pointed out before immigration records show that there were zero US citizens traveling from kenya to the US by air between june 30, 1961 and june 30, 1962.
If he was born in Kenya, he isn't eligible for the office of president.
Wrong. 1976 update to citizenship law retoractively states that anyone born to a US Citizen abroad, who themselves had 1 year of residency in the US, are a natural born citizen.
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It is not unreasonable to question his place of birth.
Which was answered over a decade ago, in his autobiography "Dreams of my Father".
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Obama defenders treat any hint of doubt over his place of birth as akin to denying the Holocaust. There are legitimate questions that need answering.
They were legitimate for all of 15 minutes. Anyone who bothered to get a copy of his book as well as the 2008 release of the COLB had their questions answered. To persist 3 years after the fact, that means it was never about where he was born. It has and will always be, the color of his skin.
i doubt that he could, even with the release of college records ( we saw what happened with the LFBC ).
but i also doubt that, at this point, obama would want birtherism to subside. both karl rove and the national revue have cited the birthers as detrimental to the GOP's chances in november.
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